- If it were not for a Tamilian, we’re told, the Chinese would have ended up wasted by disease (they knew nothing about medicine, apparently) and walloped by marauding raiders (they knew nothing about self defence, apparently). I kept waiting for a scene where the Chinese kept falling asleep and this Tamilian introduced them to a counteractive brew (it’s safe to assume they knew nothing about tea, either), and the other scene where he took pity on their barren shelves and taught them how to make Ming vases.
- Some questions, though. Does Bodhidharman care more about his newfound Chinese compatriots than the wife and family he left behind? Or were they already dead by the time he lost his hair and consumed poisoned food and kicked the bucket? And if he knew about the cure for the disease that causes blisters and boils and bleeding eyes, why did he share this information only with the Chinese and not with his people back in India?
- Why are these movies about the glories of Tamil culture always made by directors who hop, skip and jump to exotic foreign destinations for their songs, which feature whites and where the hero is dressed like a hip-hop artist, mouthing words like “ragamuffin?” Songs and dance videos are exempt from “Tamil culture?” Considering that Suriya is a circus artist, you couldn’t have a down-to-earth kuthu paattu for him? And you have the gall to dole out advice about the benefits of kolam pottufying and manjal thechufying? When you’re sitting behind the director’s camera in jeans, having probably arrived there in a German car?
- I was reminded of a classic (and thoroughly misguided) quote by Thangarbachan in Kalki a couple of years ago, when he took to arms about the “westernisation” of us evil-incarnate, city-dwelling Tamils. “Pizza saapidum Thamizhanukku Pongal thiruvizha edharku?” Words fail me…
- This angst against the wretchedness of finger-wagging apart, this isn’t a bad movie. Merely an extremely dull one, burdened with having to demystify to the average movie-goer its high-tech premise. Which means explanations after explanations, mostly delivered in the very earnest enunciations of Shruti Haasan, who speaks, sometimes, as if addressing someone extremely hard of hearing but who can lip-read. (Strangely, while sitting through the film, I found it merely dull – but talking about it later to a, um, colleague, I realised I was more annoyed by it than I thought I was.)
- Is Shruti Haasan the world’s most genius-level, most garrulous genetic engineering student? She goes on (and on, and on) about cancer-afflicted and mentally challenged kids, about bio-war, about DNA research, about genetic memory, about finding funding for her research. (I wish she’d shed a few words about Suriya’s transformation at the end, despite being hauled out of the lab in a near-vegetative state.) There are long stretches of the film where we feel we’re not watching a Suriya movie co-starring Shruti so much as a Shruti movie with Suriya as a sidekick.
- Is Shruti Haasan also the world’s most transport-friendly genetic engineering student? We see her waiting for a bus. We see her riding a scooter. We see her driving a jeep. I’d like to know what she does for money, exactly.
- The high concept extends to the love scenes too, where the director resorts to every trick to render them “different.” Rides atop elephants? A treasure-hunt based on the letters of the heroine’s name? After a point, it’s all terribly laboured.
- I continue to be astounded by the elasticity of the masala template, of which, regular readers know, I am a die-hard fan. It can be adapted to anything, anywhere. You can connect the dots between, say, Aboorva Sagotharargal and 7aum Arivu, by pointing to the flashback with the “father” segueing into the present-day events with the “special son” completing the cycle. There’s even the background of the circus and a “onna nenachen”-type dirge by this man who works in the circus who finds out that the girl he thought was in love with him is not really in love with him.
- There’s a general air of jitteriness in the film. Early on, there’s a breathtaking shot of Bodhidharman dwarfed by ice-capped mountains, but it’s held for barely a couple of seconds. Why not slow down and let the audience drink this visual in? Instead, the “slowness” is reserved for the action scenes, where it appears that every punch, every vehicle crash, every kick is rendered in slow motion. It gets tiring after a while, as we seem to be watching not the kinetics of real-life motion but some sort of frenzied dream-state action.
- I loved the use of the tree trunk as a ramp, though. Of such cheap thrills, sometimes, is masala-movie-watching made. I also loved the idea of normal people turning killers, like in a zombie movie, thought the relentless slo-mo makes this tiresome after a point. Each and every shot doesn’t need to be a money shot. It’s enough if the scene or the sequence screams kaching.
- Is that the easiest steal ever of an artifact from a museum? Used to high-tech laser beams being evaded and suchlike, I was reduced to giggles when Azhagamperumal simply took the priceless manuscript from Shurti and kept in back in its glass case, looking around furtively as if he were accepting a bribe or letting loose a long-suppressed fart.
- It’s a little surreal watching Ra.One and 7aum Arivu on consecutive days. Both are backed by high concepts that need to be dumbed down, and both fail in different ways. One is a throwback to older Hindi films; the other harks back to older Tamil culture. The heroes of both films like to be featured shirtless, and both are in double roles that feature an early death. And both films feature a uniquely endowed villain with overtones of Terminator 2: Judgment Day – if Ra.One steals the shape-shifting characteristics, 7aum Arivu filches the action scene in the police station.
- The difference, I guess, is that 7aum Arivu takes itself far more seriously. This then, is the conundrum for the mass-movie maker in India. Do you aim high, like Murugadoss, and risk failure, or do you aim low, like Anubhav Sinha, and risk being branded a generic product?
Copyright ©2011 Baradwaj Rangan. This article may not be reproduced in its entirety without permission. A link to this URL, instead, would be appreciated.
Posted in: Bullet-point Report
rameshram
November 1, 2011
” they knew nothing about tea, either”
kapi!!!! Kapi kannamma, as in wake up and smell the…:D
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Srividhya Mahesh
November 1, 2011
“I’d like to know what she does for money, exactly.”
Shruti explains in one of the scenes that she lives from the lodge rental that she receives from Thanjavur.
It could be in Euros you never know! 😉
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rameshram
November 1, 2011
and chitappa pon wasn’t all brains and no bod.(.in the vietnam song she looked passibly like one of thiose mall tweens in a summer dress.).she just had zero chemistry with surya. (and like I said before, he had pretty ear/studs).
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advaitin
November 1, 2011
If you google Bodhidharma, the links do reveal that Chinese historians have recorded him as the founder of the Shaolin Temple, Zen Buddhism etc….so it cannot be so far behind that he could save a Chinese village from a deadly plague. Secondly, Murugadoss had said in a interview that most of the images of Bodhidharma showed him bald and for commercial purposes they showed the Surya version of Bodhidharma with hair and only in the final scene before Bodhidharma’s death they showed him bald. I think the beginning of your review wouldn’t have oozed so much of sarcasm had you known these details….or it still might have!
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Mohan
November 1, 2011
@rangan
In matters of dialogue delivery, you have a knack of coming up with perfect descriptions.
First reg. Nadunisi Naaygal’s Veera and now 7 am Arivu’s Shruti Haasan.
Did you watch Velayudham? I went in thinking it was a remake of Azad and came out sucker-punched with the knowledge that Vijay had just remade his own template film for the ‘n’th time.(generously borrowing scenes from several others of course)
How this fella has the gall to keep making the same film over and over again and call it a new one beats me.
In my moment of gloom, I found this hilarious link.
http://mkrishna.4t.com/Ilaya%20Thalapathi%20Plot%20Generator.htm
And something to cheer you up as well:
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shalini
November 1, 2011
An eye opener…. with awesome real in depth critics
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Kiruba
November 1, 2011
Bran1gan: “I kept waiting for a scene where the Chinese kept falling asleep and this Tamilian introduced them to a counteractive brew”
Oh, don’t you worry. We can indeed take pride that it was our Tamil forefathers who introduced tea to the dumb ass Chinese, just like they introduced everything else to everyone else in this universe. How couldn’t they have? It’s just that the lazy Murugadoss didn’t read the entire Wikipedia page on Bodhidharma which says:
“In one version of the story, he is said to have fallen asleep seven years into his nine years of wall-gazing. Becoming angry with himself, he cut off his eyelids to prevent it from happening again. According to the legend, as his eyelids hit the floor the first tea plants sprang up; and thereafter tea would provide a stimulant to help keep students of Chán awake during meditation.”
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Mohan
November 1, 2011
@rangan
” this isn’t a bad movie. Merely an extremely dull one”
Name at least one extremely dull movie that you found to be good.
I mean, like, duh…good movies aren’t supposed to make for dull viewing, are they?
While a bad movie may or may not be interesting to watch(for example, Narasimha, Sullaan and Kaadhal Azhivathillai are delightfully campy and offer plenty of unintended humour), a good movie has GOT TO be interesting in my view.
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munimma
November 1, 2011
What can you expect from the guy who made ramana? More lectures. The height of it – the prof is being tortured and he gets into a lengthy oration about bio-war.
Shruti seemed more the lead and Surya the eye candy.
Zombie attack was totally laughable.
Did anyone else notice how Surya’s 6+ packs were “enhanced” with brown makeup in that last fight scene?
Similar thoughts on why they couldn’t have extended the damo part – it was the best part in the movie really!
Hubby did not realize the movie title was not 7 AM arrival until a day before we watched it.
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Praveen
November 1, 2011
At one of the award functions (Vijay TV?), Kamal announced Surya, Shruthikku chitappa mora venum””. May be that’s why the chemistry wasn’t there 😀
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rodionprasanna
November 1, 2011
Its a treat buddy movie though…. WE had great fun singing “twinkle twinkle…” to the chinese song and discussing Bodhi’s chronicles. But, the semi-documentary movie making was irritating.
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Umesh Kesavan
November 1, 2011
Hello Baradwaj Rangan!
Brilliantly worded review.as always.
thought I ll share my review here.
http://www.facebook.com/notes/umesh-kesavan/random-thoughts-on-7am-arivuvelayudham-and-raone/2233882963854
I wish u write more on tamil movies!
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sheksshake
November 1, 2011
Tell you whats worse…these guys who made so much scene about bodhidharma’s tamil lineage..bloody say he is from Guntur in the telugu version and Dharavi in the hindi version. What say about this?
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Manikantan Hariharan
November 1, 2011
The reviews reads like the transcript of MTV roadies RAghu interviewing a contestant.. Hilarious.
Loved it!
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rameshram
November 1, 2011
It’s a well known fact that bodhidharman had a vaapa who taught him “naalu perukku udhavumna edhuvum tappu ille”.
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munimma
November 1, 2011
You forgot to mention that extremely annoying scream (bg music?) that accompanies poor Dong Lee 🙂
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rameshram
November 1, 2011
“Zombie attack was totally laughable.”
Oh Stop! it was the best part of the film!
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Priya
November 1, 2011
Whattay funny review… oops sorry ‘thoughts’!! “kolam pottufying and manjal thechufying? ” is that you Mr. Rangan?? Your language shows you are really irritated with the movie. Ayyo paavam Murugadoss…getting smashed by everyone. And Shruthi…ha…ha “who speaks, sometimes, as if addressing someone extremely hard of hearing but who can lip-read” – I just can’t wait to watch the movie..or should I wait for Pongal to watch it on Ungal Sun TV? (Thiraikku vandu sila naatkaley aana putham pudhu ‘mega hit’ thiraipadam – going with the tempo of the movie, read that in slow motion).
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Nice
November 1, 2011
When you review hindi movies you have apologetic comments as if you are embarrassed to comment negatively. Whereas Tamil movies are given royal dressing down. Not that I liked this stupid just a general observation.
-KP
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brangan
November 1, 2011
Nice: Among the recent posts, have you read this or this or this? But I kinda got bashed for the “apologetic comments” in the latter too 🙂
Priya: These bullet-point reports aren’t really thoughtfully considered reviews, more like scattershot thoughts — so I treat them more casually. Hence the language.
munimma: Actually I’m with rameshram there. That was kinda fun.
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Priya
November 1, 2011
But they are bullets nevertheless!!
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Raj Balakrishnan
November 1, 2011
“Is Shruti Haasan also the world’s most transport-friendly genetic engineering student” She should definitely be the sexiest!
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vijay
November 2, 2011
I’ll watch the Aamir khan remake
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munimma
November 2, 2011
rameshram – coming from you, I can totally get it 😉
It was fun, sure, but completely unnecessary.
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harveypam
November 2, 2011
Thanks for saying all those things, which I wanted to say!
Okay, I haven’t seen the movie and I don’t know much about Tamil movies. But the point about wanting a foreign boogey man (Pakistani, Chinese or any other) for the films is always dangerous.
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Manojh
November 2, 2011
I was thoroughly disappointed with the climax when Surya realizes the Bodhidharman-ism but his brown-dyed hair remains brown instead of black, ala Vikram’s instant hairy transformations from Ambi -> Anniyan, the locks at the back to the frontal curls.
Adhukku mattum logic venuma enna?
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Venki
November 2, 2011
Brilliant. I’m surprised you didn’t have anything to say about Shruti lecturing the profs on the glorious language that Tamil is or her rant towards the end against the villain asking him about the guts he has to try to destroy India. Mudiyala Sir ennaala.
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rameshram
November 2, 2011
mohan
“Name at least one extremely dull movie that you found to be good.”
Moghamul
anthimatharai
mughal e azam
konjum salangai
jalasaghar
vanaprastham
kizinjalgal
all of david cronenbergs films(good might be stretching it, though)
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Diviya
November 2, 2011
This is the first Tamil movie I’ve managed to see in years, and I came away totally annoyed! Great review.
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Priya
November 2, 2011
Talking of Shruti Hasan…I don’t understand why she (supposedly a Rock singer) has to appear in TV interviews wearing a 1-rupee coin sized bindhi and mittai-pink salwar-kurtas. What is she trying to prove? BTW, Ms. Hasan, if you think Tamil ponnus can relate to that kind of dressing style, you are totally wrong – an average girl on the road is dressed better these days!!
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rameshram
November 2, 2011
and Branigan, I must raise a voice against your pizza pongal thing. are you seriously suggesting that pride in your history is nothing more than jingo patriotism? I can think of one or two uses for such cultural pride (it sells sun TV subscriptions in US and Australia , for one. )
to go all english film trailer on you, In a world where tamils in trinidad and tobago watch 7am arivu on sun TV, one man has to carry the entire burden of , not only representin’ yo’ but also of not losing your interest to everything from Pizza to hiphop.
IOW, the question is not WHAT are we proud of from history (for which we have wikipedia) but precisely WHO is exhibiting that pride.
I think it is limiting that you should want pride in tamil history(even fake pride in fake history) limited only to Kolam potting tamil girls…and not avuthhu pottu malla avusaria pona tamil girls. I mean what’re you a misogynist chauvenist pig?! 😉
but that apart, the next question is WHY is someone getting all proud of our fake history? is it to become tamil gangs in the ghettos of anglo saxon countries(and france?) or do we have very brahminical aims of submitting our well groomed daughters to wall street traders as the bona fide real thing with a lineage tracing back to bodhidharman.. after all being tamil counts for something on wall street! we tamils proudly rub shoulders with bernie madoff in Jail , these days .
But like I always tell the girls after they have had a drink or two, Im irish, and proud.
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Mohan
November 2, 2011
@priya
Yaemma, poovum pottum vechu irukkura onnu rendu ponnungalayum keduthuruveenga polirukke. 😉
BTW, the one-rupee size bindhi looks far less stupid than the the almost invisible dot that many of these “better-dressed” gals sport. Why have the pottu at all if you don’t want people to see it? 😡
@rameshram
It was a rhetorical question. My point was that we ought not to call extremely dull films good, but seeing that you have just gone and done exactly that, the point has become somewhat moot.
Wonder what “good” is the art of criticism when definitions of “good” and “bad” themselves are so subjective.
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Meghna
November 2, 2011
Before 7am arivu was released ar. Muragadoss went on saying that every tamilian would be proud of the movie. My question is why didn’t the director rectify shruti hassan’s Tamil diction especially in that professor lecturing scene? Is it because she is mr. kamal hassan’s daughter that is why she was exempted? How can we be proud of our Tamil when the person lecturing us is not perfect in the first place? IMO 7am arivu is like a history subject thought in our school by the world’s most boring teacher ever. Not gripping enough.
( note: why are these so called actresses who claim that they were born and brought up in Tamil Nadu can’t speak proper tamil? ex: shruti and trisha. That’s why I respect priyamani more sadly she is not that that active in Tamil cinema)
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Raj Balakrishnan
November 2, 2011
I haven’t seen the movie, but I like the idea of a chinese guy as the villian. I hate those ba*&@$ds. China is bloody evil and is trying to encircle India, our stupid UPA govt is doing nothing about it. Also what’s wrong with highlighting the greatness of our tamil/Indian culture? Good that tamil moviemakers take pride in our culture unlike the crap bollywood filmakers who make films for pakis and the south asian diaspora.
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rameshram
November 2, 2011
@meghana, don’t mess with chitappa ponnu.
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mathusuthanann
November 2, 2011
A perfect description of a imperfectly made film supremely hyped in social media. but for the first 20 minutes it is a so so movie. Murugadoss seems to be talking on 7 aam arivu being remade in English by its awesome script… Enga poi muttikka. My blog almost on the similar lines mr rangan. totally go with your review. http://mindbeatsofamadwhoisjustshortofgenius.blogspot.com/
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Ramesh
November 3, 2011
No Bullet point for the underdog of this diwali Velayudham?
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danny
November 3, 2011
How many actresses do you know that can dub in their own voice? Just because you are an expert in a historical topic doesn’t mean you need to have the same diction. She loves the language, but necessarily need not master it. There are other things in the movie more glaring than Shruti’s diction and you call that out.
Find one tamil A list actress that speaks proper tamil and I will back you
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Cs
November 3, 2011
“Of such cheap thrills, sometimes, is masala-movie-watching made.” I read that in Yoda’s voice.
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abc
November 3, 2011
rangan sir,
someone trashed you in his blog !
http://hawkeyeview.blogspot.com/
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apala
November 3, 2011
BR,
Bodhidharman part was quite good — they might have stretched history a little bit but you should allow some artistic liberties there!
But for a film, which is demanding you to take it very seriously (by slapping you with all it’s preaching), the middle portion is so dull and uninspiring the film falls way short.
BTW, Shruti looks like a million bucks though her performance is still a long way to go! Hope she gets better……..her tamil, though good, sounds kind of strained………What ya think?
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rads
November 3, 2011
LOL@6 pack brown makeup 🙂
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Priya
November 3, 2011
@Mohan..ha ha ha…Good one!!! You know.. well, its actually…hmm…like…basically, its all about….
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Shiva
November 3, 2011
BR u tore 7th sense apart while this dude tore ur review apart…both r hilarious & both of u have great sense of humor….LOL
u shd chk it out…..
http://hawkeyeview.blogspot.com/search/label/7am%20arivu
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rameshram
November 3, 2011
“The talent that Baradwaj Rangan type reviewers have is that they can trash or praise any movie regardless of the actual merits of the movie.”
He seems to have your number branigan 😉
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rameshram
November 3, 2011
to quote my hero the single handed rescuer of south indian semi classical music,
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Nimmi Rangswamy
November 3, 2011
With regard to the blog link above and many other who are did not like BRs review for unpaid dues to Tamil culture… I wish to know sincerely what is the ‘essence’ or ‘the core’ or ‘code of conduct’ of Tamil culture and Tamil civilization, especially those that can be marketed and something we can be proud of….
Again sincerely, can someone who is born, went to school in Chennai or anywhere in Tamil Nadu, but went abroad for further studies [ not Sri Lanka] and now lives in NCR Noida embody this essence? Or are there any ‘core’ rules to be considered fit to bear this essence on our person/s?
7 am arivu has really raised this existential question for all Tamils and I would love a clarification though run the risk of incurring wrath for being Tamil and asking this question….
I like that the movie dissess Tamilians for improper conduct in preserving Tamil historical information.
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Kaber Vasuki
November 3, 2011
Seriously? WTF
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Ashwin
November 3, 2011
Sir,
Really admire your review… finally a true image of the movie. I’ve become your fan..and will most likely follow your reviews in the future.
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Mohan
November 3, 2011
@rangan
That hawkeyeview fellow gets quite a bit right you know. Especially this gem:
“The talent that Baradwaj Rangan type reviewers have is that they can trash or praise any movie regardless of the actual merits of the movie.”
I couldn’t have put it better myself.
He also does a fine job of nailing you on your tendency to go ga-ga over any remotely palatable Maniratnam or Kamal offering.
You really should read it. It might help you rid yourself of your entrenched prejudices.
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KishyCool
November 3, 2011
Both Mohan and Hawkeye need not be taken seriously by anybody. They are just trolls desperately trying to get some attention. Better avoid these kind of people.
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rameshram
November 3, 2011
” I wish to know sincerely what is the ‘essence’ or ‘the core’ or ‘code of conduct’ of Tamil culture and Tamil civilization, especially those that can be marketed and something we can be proud of….”
If ya gotta ask, you aing got it. 😉
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munimma
November 3, 2011
nallatho kettatho, BR, people are talking about you 😉
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Mohan
November 3, 2011
@kishycool
“Both Mohan and Hawkeye need not be taken seriously by anybody. They are just trolls desperately trying to get some attention. Better avoid these kind of people.”
Adhu sari. First Neenga yaaru? Indha blog watchman’aa? This isn’t your blog, so why all this issuing-instructions stuff?
Sema comedy sir neenga. 😀
Indha blogla attention kedacha enaku enna Nobel Prize’ a kodukka poraanga.
Ada ponga saar.
@rangan
Exactly how many lurking fan-boys you got in this blog? And for such a nuanced writer, your fanboys seem to come up with the most inane expressions.
” Better avoid these kind of people.” I mean, seriously, I was almost ready to conclude it was really you under an alias before this profound statement hit me. 😉
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Nimmi Rangswamy
November 3, 2011
@rameshram, That’s why I ask you know… some of the gatekeepers of Tamil culture and essence who blog & comment could teach a thing or two about the ‘manjal mahimai’ and ‘poovum pottum’ that Tamil women especially those influenced by Hindi cinema, Maniratnam films are forgetting to adorn. I am so glad 7 am arivu has raised all these issues and rectified important historical mis-information for Tamils all across…
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arun
November 3, 2011
7am Arivu
I saw the movie on Sunday and wasn’t planning on writing a review until I saw this elitist fool tear apart the movie with his ‘8th std fail 10th pass seeman tutorial’ logic.
Let us examine how the logical settings in this fellow’s brain is configured. Consider this hypothetical scientist. This scientis extols the virtue of The Sun. The scientist says, ” the sun sustains life on earth, the sun provides valuable vitamin D..etc etc”. The way Mr. Rangan will criticise this scientist is as follows – “but you are living in Earth. If you like the Sun so much, why don’t you go and live in the Sun. Why do you live on Planet earth, drive on planet earth, see the moon every night, drink water from planet earth and go and praise the sun”. That is how logic works in his mind. In the minds of elistist tools like him who suck up and pander to indhi audience – the “qualification” someone needs to have to praise thamizh is that one must not (a) wear jeans (b) drive german cars (c) one shouldn’t make movies shot in forign locales.
So per the logic of Baradwaj Rangan type people – if you say Buenos Aires is the capital of Argentina or claim that Jupiter is larger than Planet earth – the actual fact of whether or not Buenos Aires being a capital or not / jupter being larger than earth or not – does not matter at all. He will refute both points based on something that is irrelevant to those facts – you. He will say that because you have never visited Bueno Aires or Jupiter and have lived all your life in India – you cannot state anything about it. So Rangan does not care about the actual facts that Murugadoss and Surya seem to be saying. Rangan’s claim is that because Murugadoss had a song called ‘Ragamuffin’ and wore jeans and drove in a german car – he is instantly eliminated as a candidate for promoting thamizh history. Less educated people like baradwaj Rangan believe a lot in Mutual Exclusivity. They have rigid narrow views that in order for a person to say X – the person must be steeped in X. Any trace of Y in that person and that is enough to kill the man. Someone wanting to co-exist with X and Y (say drive a german car and want to promote thamizh history) will be trashed as incongruous. That is because people like Baradwaj Rangan cannot comprehend complexity or nuance.
The talent that Baradwaj Rangan type reviewers have is that they can trash or praise any movie regardless of the actual merits of the movie. The logical flaws that he points out in Shruthi Hasan’s transport mechanisms – he could have pointed that out in Manmadha Ambu and Ravanan. Instead he over praises those movies. Even Maniratnam may not have realized that the white salwar Aishwarya was wearing in Raavanan represents her chastity, that ploiceman vikram shoots someone in dark night t show his demon’like quality. But reviewers who need return favors will use any angle to over-reach and praise bad movies.On the other hand they will unfairly trash other movies if they have no incentive in the offing.
My thoughts on the actual movie: It is not a good movie. I am not saying this to avoid the perception that I am trashing Baradwaj because I disagree with him and think that the movie is good. The movie is bad – but not for some of the reasons Baradwaj has mentioned. And his reasons are insidious and illogical. I thought the movie had its heart in the right place but Murugadoss’ inherent lack of class in story telling brought it down. As I noted in the Ghajini review – Murugadoss lacks class. He is persistently loud and uncouth. The logical flaws in the movie didn’t bother me. I was willing to be led by the ambitious approach. The movie claims that we have no sense of preserving historical information and so that in effect means that whatever recourse bodhi-dharman prescribed for the deadly chinese disease – we must’ve have lost that information. That is the basic premise of the movie. (Note B Rangan’s stupid question on the same subject).
Murugadoss cannot seem to decide if he wants to make a movie for A center or C center. He has a story that is inherently A center. But he decorates it with stuff that is targetted at C center. In the end the movie falls through the cracks and is neither sophistcated, underplayed or nuanced nor is it out and out masala. What it becomes is a good story trapped within a formulaic thamizh movie structure and language. Who in the world introduced thamizh cinema to these 50,000 cuts per second rule. Movie makers today sem to think that the faster and higher the number of screen cuts – the more brisk the pace of the movie. That is not true at all. It didnt help that the songs were horrible. It didnt help that the director forgot to have a tense tight narrative and abandoned everything midway to deliver a sermon.
It is true that thamizhs are losing the essence of their culture. It is also commendable that people like Surya and Murugadoss are marketing the features of thamizh civilization to create more awareness. That part of the movie got me on its side. I also thought it was very bold of the movie to state an anti-reservation and anti-religious conversion message. Murugadoss is scratching the edges of what I think is the truth. That I thought was really profound for a commercial director. But at the same time a little more nuanced story telling might’ve helped. Srilankan thamizh issue is too important and too senstive an issue to be a one-liner. All the items (60% of the movie) he aded for masala effect was not entertaining. I dont think C center people would’ve been entertained either. But it was important that this movie was made.
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arun
November 3, 2011
i just copied the review and pasted here. my point is “MR RANGAN YOU ARE THE MOST IRRITATING AND BIASED PERSON I HAVE EVER SEEN”
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guest
November 3, 2011
The trolling here is getting tres annoying.
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rameshram
November 3, 2011
“nallatho kettatho,…”
Which brings me to…
BR நீங்க நல்லவறஎ கெட்டவர
ting ta ding ta ding ta ding….
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sachita
November 3, 2011
Mohan, you can just read average reviewer’s review and quit trolling Baradwaj’s place.
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Priya
November 3, 2011
@rameshram about the video link…ouch please…I’m only hoping you’re being sarcastic. Though I’m a die-hard Rahman fan, I’m sorry he’s associated with that song (or any song in this movie for that matter!).
And about your above question, “நீங்க நல்லவறஎ கெட்டவர”, if I can answer for Mr. Rangan, “naalu peru nalla irukkanam na, ethu senjaalum thappey illa”. The naalu peru in question is murugadoss, producers, Surya and Shruti Hassan (cos everyone who’s not watched the movie including me’ve become really curious to watch this movie – appadi enna thaan irukku paakkalaam types) and also Naappadhu other peru like us who are having a great time reading all this!!! And also Mr. Hawkeye who’s blog has become so famous all of a sudden!!
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rameshram
November 3, 2011
Why is there this meme that mohan is a troll? he is hostile to BR(keeps trying to tear him down) ,and fairly garrulous, but his obsession with mankatha apart, theres nothing trollish about him.
Mindless zombie attacks on other posters should stop. we must reserve our firepower to fake nobel prize winners.
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munimma
November 3, 2011
rameshram – ethukku intha visha paritchai. erkanave sila peru inga tamizha saavadikkaraangantu kothippa irukkanga…
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Kiruba
November 4, 2011
“Consider this hypothetical scientist…”
What kind of fucked up logic was that?
Personally, what I find irksome about all these flag bearers, be it Thangar or Ramadas or Krishnaswamy or ARM, is not that they live in this modern world (thus leading wicked lives!) and extol a glorious past (they have every right to do so and may be are correct too), but the holier than thou attitude and finger pointing that these postures come to be invariably associated with. That eventually leads to questioning (which may just be a coping strategy) the motives behind such posturing. As in all these cases there is some political or personal gain to be found, reactions such as bran1gan’s are quite natural.
In ARM’s case, the Tamil culture thing is just another tool to market crap. Not that it is bad to market a product or sex it up, but then it is just that. This is not the same as a hypothetical scientist speaking about, of all topics, the virtues of the sun. (Well, if it is Shruthi lecturing on DNA transplant and rekindling genetic memory(!), then yes, the motive will have to be questioned).
To dissociate what is being said from the person saying it seems illogical to me. If there happens to be an utterly selfless soul whose every utterance can be taken to heart, I’d probably be very happy. But in this era of cynicism, I can’t believe I’ll ever find him. Therefore, let me be blissfully stupid and continue to believe that the ad hominem fallacy is not all that bad.
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Venkatesh
November 4, 2011
ting ta ding ding ta ting ….. 🙂
After the Rahman (saint or not) article – this is another troll fest. One of the best aspects of this blog used to be the knowledgeable comments ( Sri Sri Ramesh Ram included ) , not so much anymore.
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Steve Z
November 4, 2011
What’s with the caps? And when were you born? Yesterday? and just landed here to discover BR to be the most so-and-so? Have a drink and chill. Tis’ a movie review.
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Vivek
November 4, 2011
padam per en 7am arivu?
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Mambazha Manidhan
November 4, 2011
Hey, maybe you wanna have a tagline ‘Not a Review. Merely, a collection of thoughts that arose //blah..blah..” so you won’t have some misunderstandings from outsiders and some baity posts from certain insiders. No harm done. But, good to see the Format is back.
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Mohan
November 4, 2011
kishycool, sachita…such nice names for aliases. 😉 Pity your writing style gives it away.
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rameshram
November 4, 2011
minimma,
engla tamizzzz kula pengal pei endral peiyyum mazai. (and by that we don’t mean rain, nescesarily 😉
o Priya, priya
I cringe everytime someone says tamizzacchi, feels like kottangucchi!
it’s like when a sanskrit type calls a women a nari….
Anna venkatesu, namma mattum enna kizzichomam? ever since somebody stopped posting here aal addresseye kanum he he he he (rubs sotta thalai like asokan).
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KishyCool
November 4, 2011
Dear BR,
You are a great reviewer and plz don’t give a damn to these trolls. These people are just parasites who try to live off by bashing famous people and as a consequence getting some attention. Sociiety can survive without trolls, but cannot progress without intellectuals like you. You are not just writing something about movies, but also showing things in a different perspective and stimulating thoughts and showing new horizons to explore. I have been a regular reader of ur blog for the past 4 years and commented many times on ur blog. Your writings really helped me explore world cinema and understanding it. Hope these trolls won’t affect ur writing style. Plz don’t change it.
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brangan
November 4, 2011
Meghna: Reg. Shruti’s diction, she enunciated the words clearly. That’s enough no? Different people talk with different accents. She may be one of those people who knows the language really well, but doesn’t get the chance to practice much 🙂
Ramesh: Haven’t seen Velayudham yet. But I heard good things about it, except from apala.
Venkatesh: I don’t know whose blog you’ve been reading but I swear I never wrote an article about Rahman being a saint or not 🙂
Mambazha Manidhan: You seem to be the sole supporter of the format. Thanks 🙂
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KishyCool
November 4, 2011
Regarding bullet point format, it is really very funny and certainly a fitting format for moves which don’t deserve a full length review but deserve some attention. It is really entertaining and a relief from regular review format.
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Mohan
November 4, 2011
@kishycool
” These people are just parasites who try to live off by bashing famous people and as a consequence getting some attention.”
Nope. Attractive though the prospect may sound, I am yet to meet anyone who is willing to pay me for bashing Rangan. 😉
BTW, Do you have any frickin’ idea what you’re typing? How can anybody “live” off commenting on other people’s blogs? At first it appeared you were just another crazy fanboy who gets his jollies licking your master’s feet but you seem hell-bent on proving you are also a first-rate moron.
“Your writings really helped me explore world cinema and understanding it.”
You’re so retarded that I doubt whether you could even comprehend a 60 second ad on TV, forget “exploring” world cinema.
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Mohan
November 4, 2011
@rangan
Velayudham is the same old Perarasu kinda shit that Vijay has been starring in all these years. The fella just remade his own formula again, having copied just the core premise from Azad. Jayam Raja also borrows scenes generously from Singh is King, Chance pe dance et al. Need more be said?
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Sukanya
November 4, 2011
Dear Mr. Rangan,
I hardly read your reviews to find out your opinion (which is usually ambigous) about a movie/person/event. I read them to see the sheer artistry with which you handle this language. You have certainly elevated the review sections in The Hindu to a new level (and rescued us from the likes of those who write reviews for first graders).
Anyway sir for you – A life in literature awaits.
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JayN
November 4, 2011
how about this:
http://www.messagefrommasters.com/Life_of_Masters/Bodhidharma.htm
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JayN
November 4, 2011
also rangan, Zen masters always live in presnt dont have any past! so your question about his family back in India is meaningless
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Venkatesh
November 4, 2011
Ramesh Ram : “Anna venkatesu, namma mattum enna kizzichomam? ever since somebody stopped posting here aal addresseye kanum he he he he (rubs sotta thalai like asokan).”
Ada ille sir – i have been contemplating – Bodhi like – indhae sinna sinna fight ku laam naa varadhe ille.
BR : “Venkatesh: I don’t know whose blog you’ve been reading but I swear I never wrote an article about Rahman being a saint or not ” – adhu seri. Tongue firmly in cheek then 🙂
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bigbala
November 4, 2011
@Baradwaj: Enna sir, taking a leaf out the pages of this Bodhidharman fellow-va ? 😀 Orey zen like silence ? 😀
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KayKay
November 4, 2011
“we must reserve our firepower to fake nobel prize winners.”
Arambichitya? BTW, Ramsu Kanna, that luuuuurvely song you posted above “Senthamizh Naatu”…any idea who composed it????
But for the record, let me also add my voice to the chorus. Mohan is NOT a troll and is every bit entitled to his opinions as are conspiracy theorists who believe Oswald wasn’t the lone gunman, the moon landing was faked, and Rahman only ever composed 30 songs, 20 of them sample-lifted copies:-)
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KayKay
November 4, 2011
“After the Rahman (saint or not) article ”
Err….the article per se was about Rahman.
Mozart’s sainthood was conferred by his groupies…which naturally brought Salieri’s minions out of the woods, baying for blood….
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KayKay
November 4, 2011
Nice to know the Ctrl C, Ctrl V and Caps Lock functions work on your keyboards…….that’s like….so awesome dude!
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Mohan
November 4, 2011
@rameshram, kaykay
Thanks for the vote of confidence. 😉
@kaykay
Don’t you club me with conspiracy theorists!!! That Rangan holds certain Tamil film personalities in high regard(regard that unfortunately colors his opinions on all matters related to Tamil Cinema) is far from a conspiracy theory. You only need to read his previous posts in this blog to know this.
Read his Bullet-point Reports on 180, Easan and Manmadhan Ambu for starters. You’ll understand why I endorse the statement that I quoted above from the hawkeyeview blog.
@rameshram
Did YOU just talk about someone else being garrulous? 😉
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udhav naig
November 4, 2011
I have a Chinese roomie here in the UK who happened to see wikipedia page (Bodhidharma, SIGH!) I was reading on my laptop. He asked me what I was reading about. I proudly told him, “Do you know this guy who is worshipped in YOUR shaolin temples is from a place called Kanchipuram, which is 80 KMS away from my place…..and I studied in a college which is just 20 KMS from his place of birth?”
Mr Cao was not really interested. I, as a Tamilian, was furious. I told him, “Here, don’t you know that this guy introduced Kung Fu to Chinese…” The Chinese was a little unsettled. He said, “Look, fuck you. May be in India you believe in fairy tales and heresy, but we don’t. All these claims made in the book Yijin Jang that Bodhidharma is invented Kung Fu have been disproved…..and I know this because I am a linguistics student and I also know Kung Fu. Kung Fu was part of a chinese culture even before this Bodhidharma ever came to China…”
My Tamil pride was deflated that very moment.
Then I watched the film and cringed. I mean this scholarly researcher of Chinese history has a dialogue in the film which suggests ancient science is better than modern science and says we understood 9 planets, ironically as Navagrahas and therefore it is science? Sun and Moon are planets? Raghu and Kethu, the two snakes, are planets?
I agree with you that the film takes itself too seriously. This guy has nothing in his head to differentiate between facts, faith and belief. Meditation for 9 years and the wall in front of him changing???? There is a limit to suspension of disbelief.
The most hilarious thing to me was the so-called making us feel bad footage asking the Chinese and Tamils about Bodhidharma. We know and believe for a fact that Ravana has ten heads and he lived in Srilanka. What can one make of it?
This whole research behind the film is a farce. In research you don’t simply take anecdotal evidence which supports your point and leave out the rest of the evidence which is contrary.
All in all, it is a film which tries to shove down a belief as a fact…and makes a mess of it.
It has some pretty dangerous ideas as well….clamping reservation, corruption and recommendation was certainly bullshit.
The most hilarious thing, however, was Nokku Varmam and “unakku dhil irundha Indian army kooda sanda podunga….” 😀
I agree with your comparison with Aboorva Sagodharagal. Only that ARM replaced janakaraj with himself. The film is a total joke.
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rameshram
November 4, 2011
kaykay, keep at this and you’ll be close to exhibiting trollish behaveour.(I understand that you have n adolescent need to cry for attention from people to whom you mean very little,but its not like Im obliged to give a fuck…)
you got a thrashing in the Rahman thread, as did that other creepy crawly, and it feels unrequited..I understand , but not for me.
I have said what I have to say and will continue to do so, even if it gets under your skin and dances a mackarena.
the sentamizz nattu thamizzachiye(cringe inducing song) was posted deliberately for effect. (silathukkellam sonna than puriyum).
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rameshram
November 4, 2011
“@rameshram
Did YOU just talk about someone else being garrulous? ”
en thappu. velila pora onanai edutthu madiyile kattinda apparram kodayarathu nnu solla mudiuma enna! onanna kodiya than seiyyum! 😀
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Praveen
November 4, 2011
Nokku Varmam was chumma made up eh? Not true?
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rameshram
November 4, 2011
There is a branch of historical research called cultural research which takes on an unevaluative (evidenciary support vice) look at the stories inherent in each culture(for instance we would look at the gilgamesh stories out of mesapotomia to glean a view of what a forgotten culture might think its world looks like) . I believe that the kind of stories 7 am arivu is screen written on (bodhidharman, nokku varmam, ancient science…etc) belong firmly in this category.
as regards udav naig’s story about his chinese roommate, what do you expect him to say? “yes, we chinese are indebted forever to your cultural superiority?” of course he’s going to discredit everything…its not as if this whole bodhidharman joke was true , but it’s one culture’s was of writing its popular history.
There are plenty of tales of tamil antiquity that do not have supporting evidence. the stories of “old madurai” and shiva and the old tamil sangams (not to mention the fantastical “lamuria” stories have no basis in fact except as stories some tamil(chauvenists?) believe to be the truth.does this mean they are FALSE? maybe. but until proven to be false, it is the job of cultural history to record them as told, because , who knows, when google is mapping the sea outside sri lanka , they may find a city from10,000 BC and then look how foolish you all would feel for trashing poor surya and murugadoss.
I am not, here, referring to myths that cultures believe are real history. only that some stories (like those involving gods) are QUITE CLEARLY not believed to be historical fact, while others (eg: the three tamil sangams…bodhidharma, “old science” are believed within a culture to be historical fact, even if noone has proof . I think it is important to seperate such cultural history from sheer mythology and treat it differently, for the purpose of authentication.
7am arivu is at best a half hearted attempt to scratch the surface here, but Im appaled at the amount of dismissiveness prevelent in the educated peters who post here on the subject. Reminds me of some conversations I have had with the sanskrit types that consider the whole “tamil culture” thing something karunanidhi and periar dreamed up to get CIA funding in the 1950’s.
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Mohan
November 4, 2011
@udhav naig
“Raghu and Kethu, the two snakes, are planets?”
The very same Raahu and Kethu you refer to are referred to in Vedic astrology as “Chaya grahas” or Shadowy planets.
When I met an astrologer once, I asked him what is the meaning of “Shadowy planets”, he told me that, first of all, grahas mean celestial bodies within our solar system, not only the planets(which clears your doubts on Sun and Moon inclusion). He also told that Raahu and Kethu actually denoted the shadows cast by the Earth and the Moon during lunar and solar eclipses respectively. He added that the mythology reg. the two snakes that ate Surya’s head and Chandra’s head were an allegorical explanation to demystify the eclipse phenomenon.
That cleared your doubts?
Now that’s just what he told me. I am personally against all religions, so I don’t care either way.
Another thing to note: Whatever is said in 7aum arivu about the Panchangams predicting eclipses and the exact time of sun rise and sunset 100% accurately, the true purpose of applying Turmeric on skin and putting Kolam with rice flour so that ants can be fed…. All these are very much true.
So don’t blindly dismiss our traditions as hogwash upon what your chinese friend says. REMEMBER, all chinese will say that only. His linguistics background and all is to just bamboozle you into believing him, which you at once did. PRIDE is too great a thing to be allowed to deflate over comments from others. If you truly have it, you won’t let it go over such mundane matters as comments from room-mates.
At the same time, don’t blindly extol our cultures’ virtues either. Read, analyse and arrive at your own conclusion. For that matter, this applies in area of knowledge.
“We know and believe for a fact that Ravana has ten heads and he lived in Srilanka. What can one make of it?”
Siamese twins, conjoined at the neck nu sonna nambareenga. Abnormal calf born with two heads nu photo kaamicha othukareenga.
Millions of years back, there was a fellow with 10 heads nu sonna mattum yaen sir “rejetted”nu odhukki vekkareenga?
If you got to ask proof for everything, then why believe in religion at all? Be a “don’t know, don’t care”er like me. “Naan x and y story nambuven, z story mattum nambamaatten” nu solradhu trying to ride two horses at the same time.
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Praveen
November 4, 2011
Chinese are quite capable of re-writing ghistory in their favor I guess.
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Raj Balakrishnan
November 4, 2011
I saw 7am Arivu today, I congratulate Murugadoss for taking up this theme. I am glad that there are filmmakers who are proud of our culture and glorify it. I would recommend every tamil to see this film.
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KayKay
November 4, 2011
Mohan, no no no! I was by no means lumping you in with the conspiracy theorists who talk outta their ass! The point was in defending free speech. You’re passionate about certain topics, (I believe your Mankatha-love extended over a few posts) that I and a few others may not agree with, but I respect your views and that’s no reason to slap the “troll” label on someone just because you disagree with them. That’s what I meant.
And speaking of free speech…(Ahanga)RAM, I’m equally prepared to respect your views as well, but the fact that you come across as an arrogant asshole almost all the time makes that exceedingly difficult.
So you have said all you have to say and will continue to do so? Well, right back at ya boy! I missed the memo that said all your rants need to pass unchallenged and unquestioned. Not that I’d give a flying fig even if I got it.
Got thrashed in the Rahman post??? Please. You were called out…REPEATEDLY by some people who simply didn’t feel like taking your asinine comments lying down. ALL your points were challenged to which you could only retort with smug put-downs and like all bullies when their smarmy little facade is punctured, you go for the nuts with some good old-fashioned personal attacks. So, let’s see, for giving you the occassional slap up the head (which all brats require from time to time), I’ve been labelled a foaming-at-the-mouth Rabid Dog and now am in danger of being a troll while others are creepy crawlies? So be it. This would only matter if I gave a shit, which I thankfully don’t.
So, what can I say Ramsu? While I generally will let a shitload of your raves, rants and rambles pass with a glazed eye, once in awhile, I’m gonna get down into the mosh pit simply because I feel as strongly about certain things as you do, and more importantly, because I just happen to be in the mood for a push and shove.
After all, you can’t be the only one who gets to toss toys outta the pram now, can you?
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Nav
November 5, 2011
Dude BR,
Whats your angst about tamil culture? Would you beleive if a westner taught chinese kungfu or if dustin hoffman saved chinese people from an epidemic?
I am sure you would have bend over your back if Mani ratnam( highly over rated Film maker) made this movie or any other director of his/your ilk( you know what i mean). Obviously he wouldnt take such a movie for the same reason …hatred of tamil culture or the people who lament about fast dead tamil culture.
And the pathetic appreciation for your so called Critique is the funninest thing i have read for a long time now.
By the way get a life..and i need to get one , after having wasted my time reading this and responding to this.
I still cant get my head around your hatred towards tamil culture..if you were by any chance tamilian…i pity your parents.
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gv
November 5, 2011
@ munimma: “Hubby did not realize the movie title was not 7 AM arrival until a day before we watched it.” – hilarious. My hubby too asked why have they name a tamil move 7 am arrival?? 😉
@ rangan: why no comments about Harris Jayaraj’s ‘aracha maavu music’??
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udhav naig
November 5, 2011
/////////////////////////////There are plenty of tales of tamil antiquity that do not have supporting evidence. the stories of “old madurai” and shiva and the old tamil sangams (not to mention the fantastical “lamuria” stories have no basis in fact except as stories some tamil(chauvenists?) believe to be the truth.does this mean they are FALSE? maybe. but until proven to be false, it is the job of cultural history to record them as told, because , who knows, when google is mapping the sea outside sri lanka , they may find a city from10,000 BC and then look how foolish you all would feel for trashing poor surya and murugadoss.//////////////////////////
We have moved on from logical verification to falsifiability for a long time now. I mean, you don’t just take evidence that supports your idea and say, “hey, see this. This is true…” BUt rather change the very idea when contrary evidence is shown.
Read this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karl_Popper
So, today’s science is not about verification but falsifiability. You just need one evidence to discard the very idea that supports it.
And you are not really right about believing something until proven false either (actually, it doesn’t appply here. It has been proved by Chinese archaeologists that most of Kung Fu techniques were already in practise in China even before Bodhidharma supposedly came to China.) simply because claims unless they are proved can be rejected. I don’t have to “prove” claims that someone else makes in the first place.
The onus is on that person to prove it. It is enough for me to show how the evidence is not evidence at all.
If you really want Bodhidharma to be recorded in history, he is simply a legend, just like 10-head Ravana. To make authoritative claims like this guy invented Kung Fu is an insult to research.
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udhav naig
November 5, 2011
/////////////////////////The very same Raahu and Kethu you refer to are referred to in Vedic astrology as “Chaya grahas” or Shadowy planets. When I met an astrologer once, I asked him what is the meaning of “Shadowy planets”, he told me that, first of all, grahas mean celestial bodies within our solar system, not only the planets(which clears your doubts on Sun and Moon inclusion). He also told that Raahu and Kethu actually denoted the shadows cast by the Earth and the Moon during lunar and solar eclipses respectively. He added that the mythology reg. the two snakes that ate Surya’s head and Chandra’s head were an allegorical explanation to demystify the eclipse phenomenon. That cleared your doubts?/////////////////
No it doesn’t. If they are merely denoting shadows of earth and moon then they are simply not celestial bodies or planets as we call them. In science you don’t call Jupiter andits shadow both as planets. Jupiter is a planet and Jupiter’s shadow is its shadow.
First of all, all this so called navagrahas most of them can be with naked eye. Sun, moon and your so called shadows Raghu and Kethu, mars, jupiter and saturn, mercury and venus are visible to the naked eye itself.
You don’t need telescopes to see them. Finally, science itself is modern. I don’t what sort of idea is this ancient science. Any scientific idea which makes sense even today is modern science. Newton’s science is modern science, it is not ancient.
Sun, moon, shadows are all not planets. That is not science in the first place. And planets do not move into houses, and earth is not at the centre of everything.
And predicting eclipses are all done by many civilizations. You just need common sense.
My Chinese friend didn’t just say that he is a linguistic student. He is a PHD student in Linguistics. And he DID point me out to the disputed connection of Bodhidharma on wikipedia. Perhaps, it’s time to be little more skeptical than just gulping down everything in the name of Tamilness or Indianness?
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udhav naig
November 5, 2011
/////////////////////////Siamese twins, conjoined at the neck nu sonna nambareenga. Abnormal calf born with two heads nu photo kaamicha othukareenga. Millions of years back, there was a fellow with 10 heads nu sonna mattum yaen sir “rejetted”nu odhukki vekkareenga? If you got to ask proof for everything, then why believe in religion at all? Be a “don’t know, don’t care”er like me. “Naan x and y story nambuven, z story mattum nambamaatten” nu solradhu trying to ride two horses at the same time./////////////////////////////////
I don’t know on what basis you came to a conclusion that I submit to religious dogma. I am an atheist, and a skeptic. Edha sonnalum evidence kaamikanum baas. Ambuttu dhaan naan kekuradhu.
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Dheeptha Mohan
November 5, 2011
“And if he knew about the cure for the disease that causes blisters and boils and bleeding eyes, why did he share this information only with the Chinese and not with his people back in India?”
The disease was known to spread only in China, as foreseen or came to be known by the grandmother of Bodhidharman. He says there must be a reason why he is been sent from his village by her and he sets his journey. If that disease might have to be spread in India, maybe she wouldn’t have asked him to leave. But anyways, I didn’t expect you to ask such a question.
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rameshram
November 5, 2011
“So, today’s science is not about verification but falsifiability. You just need one evidence to discard the very idea that supports it.”
Science? since when did culture start becoming science?
and history is even murkier. even if you were alive when it was being written, there is no one Truth in history.
“If you really want Bodhidharma to be recorded in history, he is simply a legend, just like 10-head Ravana. To make authoritative claims like this guy invented Kung Fu is an insult to research.”
and that is a bit of fanciful nonsense. bodhidharma (the historical figure) existed pretty verifyably. maybe some of the “miracles” and Achievements” attributed to him were in the realm of myth, but you have the onus of proof on your head…I don’t need proof. its history…
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rameshram
November 5, 2011
as regards”bodhidharma invented kung fu” Indians didn’t start making that claim. the movie is correct in that few Indians know what the fuk a bodhidharma is.
these claims and counterclaims were made by the chinese. Some of these chinese were buddhists and adherents of bodhidharma , and they believe he invented “kung fu” the particular martial arts tradition, some are ANTI buddhists (neo confusians) tracing their histories back to the tang dynasty which replaced the buddists using a “reformation to old chinese culture” plank, and they claim that kung fu “techniques” were in use, and thus buddhism has been refuted. people , like heisenburg said can prove pretty much what they WANT to prove…specially in history, and pretending that this is a “hard science” is doing a disservice both to history and to hard science.
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sairamrajamani
November 5, 2011
I don’t know why people liked this movie. A student doing gene research to bring back Bodi Dharma in twelve days to get rid of Dong lee! Why? Can’t she learn to shoot in twelve days to finish off the villain.
YAWN*
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rameshram
November 5, 2011
?! I thought dong li was sent to kill the bodhidharman project, not vice versa?
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Mohan
November 5, 2011
@udhav naig
Reg. you queries on Navagrahs, you are asking the wrong person. As I already told you, I am merely passing on second-hand, nay, third-had, nay, n-th hand information that has doubtless been modified over the passage of several millenia.
Who knows exactly what the Navagrahas were originally supposed to denote?
You asking me these questions is like asking an illiterate person to read the english alphabet, and trumpeting his ignorance of the language to be proof that the alphabets are mad scribblings.
If you are truly interested in knowing the truth, the least you can do is study Vedic Astrology in detail and the come to a conclusion, instead of trashing it based on your surface-level view of things.
And, to be sure, not all our ancient astronomers were novices to the helio-centric theory that you seem to be alluding to. I suggest you read up on Aryabhatta and Bhaskara. From Aryabhatta to Brahmagupta and Bhaskara, Indian astronomers have done pioneering effort in several areas of mathematics.
Aryabhatta and Brahmagupta, in between calculating the value of “pi” and devising solutions for the general linear and quadratic equations, also rejected the Raahu-Kethu explanation in favour of purely scientific theories.
So we HAVE had our share of brilliant minds whose science is “MODERN SCIENCE”.
As much as I disliked Murugadoss’ movie, I am now forced to accept that he had a valid point when he told that our people have lost all knowledge of our historical greats. You, my friend, are a classic example of the malaise. Instead of researching on our achievements and countering your chinese roomie, you just return tail between your legs complaining our culture is worthless. Sad. 😦
“And predicting eclipses are all done by many civilizations. You just need common sense.”
Don’t blabber nonsense. Just because many civilizations did it doesn’t mean it is not a science. Predicting the exact time of Sunrise, sunset and eclipse, upto the exact Naazhigai, Vinaadi and Nodi without modern technology, needs, at the very least, your mathematics to be right on the money, and Mathematics, as Friedrich Gauss, the great modern scientist called it, is the “Queen of all Sciences”.
Next, you will go on to say that you just need common-sense to build The Egyptian Pyramids and the Thanjavur temple.
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Mohan
November 5, 2011
@udhav
So you’re an atheist? Good to know.
Pray enlighten me how you got convinced that no superior power exists. I, too, am keen to join your fold. Not joking.
But I have had a question which atheists I know never answered to my satisfaction, so I have remained non-committal on this “Greater Power” issue.
I’ll pop the question to you as well.
“Why does this cosmos exist(and exist as it does)? If, as the Big Bang proponents tell, time itself began at the Big Bang, why did it have to begin? Why couldn’t everything have remained blissfully non-existent, as it were?(sorry, that’s actually 3 questions, albeit somewhat related)
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Mohan
November 5, 2011
@rameshram
In the theater where I was watching, audiences repeatedly(and with great joy) mangled the fella’s name as “donkey”. Perhaps that was Murukkudoss’ intention as well. 😉
And there WAS one classic moment in this film, where the call taxi operator munching some snacks lazily smirks at the villain and goes “Dong Li nu paer vechavangalukkellaam naanga address kodukardhilla.” 😉 Looking back, that was probably the high-point of the movie for me.
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udhav naig
November 5, 2011
/////////////////and that is a bit of fanciful nonsense. bodhidharma (the historical figure) existed pretty verifyably. maybe some of the “miracles” and Achievements” attributed to him were in the realm of myth, but you have the onus of proof on your head…I don’t need proof. its history…///////////////////
Well, what can I say. Mythology doesn’t need evidence, history does depend on evidence. I think this is a problem with most of the people, especially Indians, they can’t understand science is a method.
You don’t write history randomly or based on heresy. You write history based on facts, evidence. If it is not conclusive, you say it was simply believed. You don’t make up stuff without evidence and call it history.
Historical evidence is many a time very difficult to assess, but that doesn’t mean history is made up according to one’s own will and fancy. This thinking is what is fanciful nonsense. Saying that history is based on fact and evidence is not fanciful, definitely not nonsense.
Mohan – This is not the place to discuss it. You shall contact me on FB or mail me, udhavn@gmail.com.
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muttakannan
November 5, 2011
superior power does exist even to an atheist (by that i include myself here :)). atheists deny that a superior power is not a pot bellied, diabetes prone lol, ganpath with a moonjooru between his legs (i mean a vehicle):) (peters can bash me now :))
the three questions you ask to atheists are asked by atheists too but not to a theist necessarily. they would probably put it to a geographer. why do you have to presume that an atheist should necessarily be a geographer. atheists in a broad sense reject the existence of deities (wiki of course lol)
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muttakannan
November 5, 2011
superior power does exist even to an atheist (by that i include myself here 🙂 ). atheists believe that a superior power is not a pot bellied, diabetes prone lol, ganpath with a moonjooru between his legs (i mean a vehicle):) (peters can bash me now 🙂 )
the three questions you ask to atheists are asked by atheists too but not to a theist necessarily. they would probably put it to a geographer. why do you have to presume that an atheist should necessarily be a geographer. atheists in a broad sense reject the existence of deities (wiki of course lol)
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muttakannan
November 5, 2011
bodhi dharman kshatriyan ah porandhu tholaichadhala vandha vinai dhan idhellam. avare oru brahmin ah irundhudattume peter sum avanga thalaivar branganum sendhu alalukku oru bodhi dharma suprapaadhame ezhudhi iruppanga lol. poor bodhi cha lol.
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muttakannan
November 5, 2011
vandhuthAi bOdhi ni pallavan than thirumaganai hehe
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Mohan
November 5, 2011
@muttakannan
Why bash just one version of the God concept alone when you have the Holy Father of Jesus, Allah(who is formless yet created Man in His image) and so many others having even more numerous and arguably, more fanatical, adherents than our benign Kozhukattai-eating elephant-god? From Periyar Paasarai, I guess.
This is the reason I prefer to trust my arivu rather than Pagutharivu. 😉
Your atheism seems to be more of a form of protest against Hinduism rather than a desire to rid the world of religion in general. This makes you susceptible to other equally stupid religions, thus endangering your atheist status.
I, for one, while remaining free of committing myself to any school of thought(including atheism), am heavily in favour of abolishing religion all together from public life, as I find it to be fatally restricting(and frequently eliminating) Man’s ability to reason for himself.
“superior power does exist even to an atheist”
Really?? If the World Atheist Association(just made that up) scrutinized your application, udanae neenga “rejetted” dhaan. 😉
And, BTW, the questions I asked had nothing to do with geography. A couple of them were related to Astronomy, and perhaps Maths.
In any case, my point is that, if, as an atheist, you proclaim that there is no “God”/”Superior Power”, then SURELY the least you can do to spread the word is to prove it.
Till then, I will remain firmly non-committal. It is the only sensible thing. Ignorance is better than pretending to know the truth.
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Mohan
November 5, 2011
@udhav naig
“You shall contact me on FB or mail me, udhavn@gmail.com.”
I shall do no such thing. 😉
I see you wriggled out quite expertly. Atheists(especially Indian ones) have a knack of doing this when put in a tight spot.
Don’t worry. I am wading through quite a bit of atheist literature right now(Sam Harris, Dawkins et al.) and perhaps my questions will be answered soon(though that hardly looks likely right now).
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muttakannan
November 5, 2011
“You’re so retarded that I doubt whether you could even comprehend a 60 second ad on TV, forget “exploring” world cinema.”
good one 🙂
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rameshram
November 5, 2011
” history does depend on evidence. ”
true, but to show evidence that bodhidharma existed I don’t nescesarily have to show that he had ten heads like ravana. “debunking” some myths about the historical bodhidharma does not refute his existance as a historical figure. there is much three dollar bill “science” in history.
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Manojh
November 6, 2011
I thought her logic in bringing back BD was to cure the world of that dreadful virus. btw, was Surya/BD’s role to find the right mooligaigal for the cure or what? I was surprised they completely ignored that part. But well…AMR might have as well concluded with “PS: Refer to ‘Contagion’ “
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muttakannan
November 6, 2011
1) sorry for only bashing ganpath 😉 i can endlessly bash the symbols and personalities that is the source of inspiration for the “elites” that demolish masjids, perform jihads, conduct crusades (in one or other form). satisfied! 🙂 my point is i dont love NOT ONLY ganpath 🙂
2) there is nothing wrong in pagutharivu as an arivu. if you have argued that i should stop bashing ganpath i wd have amazed at your arivu but you questioned me why i didnt bash jesus and allah. what is the use of THIS arivu sir? rrrrrrr 🙂
3)”////Your atheism seems to be more of a form of protest against Hinduism rather than a desire to rid the world of religion in general. This makes you susceptible to other equally stupid religions, thus endangering your atheist status/////”
sorry if i had presented myself like that. you have no idea sir 🙂
4) “formation of the universe” is a prime chapter in geography.these topics you have presented lie at the loci of intersection of different ideas. i became familiar through geography. “nothing to do with geography” is imho sir is too rude 🙂 but i also agree that it is not just geography. fine:)
5)your teleological skepticism regarding cosmos, time and shoonya are interesting but why this “god created them at 9 am” attitude. (you cant deny it sir. your non committal stand is slightly tilted towards theism ;)).
6)finally
“////In any case, my point is that, if, as an atheist, you proclaim that there is no “God”/”Superior Power”, then SURELY the least you can do to spread the word is to prove it. ////”
feel sorry again for misunderstanding me. as an atheist i am against EQUATING the construct “god” to/as the superior power.
i believe in superior power absolutely. but that superior power is not a FICTION called god.
if you ask me then what the hell is this superior power i would rather say science is trying hard to prove it. till then i will believe that that SUPERIOR POWER is greatly PHYSICOCHEMICAL :). i am too serious about it. if you then ask me what is ITS precursor my simple answer will be -it is definitely not A MENTAL CONSTRUCT called GOD but is something scientific. hold your breath while science disproves this idea of god. afterall we have “just” got rid of this Astraphobia to indhiran lol 🙂 🙂
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muttakannan
November 6, 2011
mr mohan my reply to you is “moderated” by brangan i think. thanks anyway for a nice discussion 🙂
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RSPrasanna
November 6, 2011
This single review has made your comments stream reach Youtube levels.. before it hits Sify, shut the comments section down I say!!! ;p
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Mohan
November 6, 2011
@muttakannan
I find your “superior power” explanation self-defeating.
As you yourself finally confess:
” till then i will believe that that SUPERIOR POWER is greatly PHYSICOCHEMICAL ”
The operative word is “believe”. Since I, unlike yourself, am not prepared to believe in anything which is neither self-evident through reasoning nor scientifically proven, the question of “tilt” does not arise. I am just not prepared to commit to any “BELIEF”, and as of now, both theism and atheism seem to be just that. Beliefs.
Now you know why I said I am strictly non-committal. Or, if you dislike that term, ignorant would also be a correct description reg. my stance on “Greater Power” or/and “God”.
” if you have argued that i should stop bashing ganpath i wd have amazed at your arivu but you questioned me why i didnt bash jesus and allah. what is the use of THIS arivu sir”
Are you joking? Opposing unsubstantiated(and unverifiable beliefs) of ANY RELIGION is what is called INTELLIGENCE(arivu). Bashing symbols of ONE PARTICULAR RELIGION by activities like garlanding photos of deities with Shoes etc. is what Periyar tried to exemplify as Pagutharivu, the so-called “Periyar’s rationality”. I am content with the former and wish to have no truck with the latter.
If I said “Stop bashing Ganesha”, it would mean I endorse Hinduism, which is not my stand at all.
I may be non-committal w.r.t God, but I am fervently anti-religion. Religions have brought nothing but misery to Man. The little good Religion has done could have been done even without its help.
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adrasakka
November 6, 2011
wow an indian version of Bill O’ Reilly!!! lol
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rameshram
November 6, 2011
mohan youre a troll.
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Ranga
November 6, 2011
Your comments sections are starting to be more fun than your posts. No disrespect to your writing, of course, but the comments here are reaching levels of surreality that would make Douglas Adams proud.
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muttakannan
November 6, 2011
1) “/////The operative word is “believe”. Since I, unlike yourself, am not prepared to believe in anything which is neither self-evident through reasoning nor scientifically proven, the question of “tilt” does not arise. I am just not prepared to commit to any “BELIEF”, and as of now, both theism and atheism seem to be just that. Beliefs./////”
the question is simple – at which point of the “theism – atheism” continuum do you place yourself. you say “non-committal” / ignorance (i am unable to understand this ignorance stand of yours) if i consider that you are at the exact mid point then i put myself exactly upon atheism extreme.
your point of argument is based on the word “belief”. what is the confusion here? how come it become self defeating. we have accepted that you dont believe in anything and i believe in atheism (a view point that sees things as they are and by doing so exposing ulterior motives). there is no confusion.
if you argue on proof then point is this – nobody has proved till now the existence of god- accepted? but nobody (not hardcore theists) denied that a physicochemical interplay created everything (everything including our thought process – psychology leads to physiology and vice versa) this is my strong point. i will rather try to explain under the light of reason not based on some religious text.
the main problem here is i am arguing with a non believer rather than with a “hardcore” theist :).
i must clarify something here – believing in atheism is NOT middle path. atheist are anarchists from religious perspective.
so it is that just you dont believe in anything but i dont believe in god (this too is a belief sir 🙂 )…straight ? 🙂
2) “////Are you joking? Opposing unsubstantiated(and unverifiable beliefs) of ANY RELIGION is what is called INTELLIGENCE(arivu).////”
wow you have explained what atheism is all about while explaining arivu.
sir do you find me departing from anything you said in your explanation of intelligence !!
(that ANY RELIGION point comes next)
3) “///Bashing symbols of ONE PARTICULAR RELIGION by activities like garlanding photos of deities with Shoes etc. is what Periyar tried to exemplify as Pagutharivu, the so-called “Periyar’s rationality”. I am content with the former and wish to have no truck with the latter.///”
this is the final time i am going to repeat it sir 🙂 i bash not just ganpath. i also bash church discourses that base their arguement borrowed from atheists and cunningly hiding the bashes an atheist made on jesus the mandravathi mandrake lol. i also bash jihadies. i laugh i those elites from hinduism islam christianity etc etc who submit their reasons to meaningless religious texts (even great rocket scientists!).
i must also say why i called your non committal stand as tilted : the reason- “the three questions you placed to atheists” it reveals you sir.
>do you think a scientist for scientific inquiry will put it towards an atheist?!! – no
>do you think that a “non committal” wd ask it?!! – no because a non believer wd know that the answer is in science?!! afterall the best explanation that can convince him can be from science. because he is far away from theist extreme.
now why did you put these questions to an atheist? simple – you are somewhere in the theist half or you are not clear (not confused :)) about the concept of god as religion is based on it which you dont like.
i want to clear my stand one last time in comparision to you 🙂
you are not a hardcore theist as you are far from that extreme – me too 🙂
you are non committal since you are waiting for a proof to disprove god and you are against religion – what about me here ? – i am also against religion and in addition i dont believe in god because i can point out how a person or an animal or an hybrid cannot be a god (superior power acc to theists). i have my own theory and i have certain explanations (not necessarilly periyarish 🙂 ). just for the knowledge sake i have finalised ideas on some topics that are called theological such as how fishes and wine multiplied when jesus prayed (if it had really happened or what does this spirit or aavi actually mean? in hinduism and christianity for instance or why religions originated and prophets existed only in the past. why none them in recent periods (very common question though)
and many more such things 🙂
except for misleading you to believe that i am from periyar paasarai (that only ganpath comment lol) i dont find any mistake in putting myself in the light of atheism 🙂
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muttakannan
November 6, 2011
i will stop this atheist discussion here. mohan sir i can give you my id if u find a discussion as worthy.
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muttakannan
November 7, 2011
mr. brangan !!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Mohan
November 7, 2011
@rameshram
Lol. 😉 Ok. I get your message. Will stop this debate now.
@muttakannan
Sorry mate. I guess this ain’t the right place for such (inevitably)long-winded debates on theological beliefs. Don’t bother giving mail ids. What is there to be gained with arguing with atheists, who anyways are fairly reasonable and free-thinking people, when there are so many theists yet to be freed of their regimented lines of thinking ?
@rangan
Do accept my apologies for cluttering up your comment-space. 🙂
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rameshram
November 8, 2011
RIP Bhupen Hazarika.
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Arun
November 8, 2011
In the scene where the mystery disease first strikes the Chinese, I think Murugadoss showed someone resembling a village medic examining the ill child and asking people to flee. So I think he did show that they had some knowledge of medicine but they didn’t have any about THIS ailment. I think on the whole the movie was a laudable effort. The zombie attack sequence was well conceptualised, but looked a bit artificial on screen.
I disagree with BR’s suggestion that Murugadoss may be ill-suited to preach about Tamil pride, culture and so forth just because he may follow a modern, westernised lifestyle. I think it’d be unfair to say that those preaching these ideals should follow the Tamilian lifestyle in the traditional sense of the word. I understand the hypocrisy in filming songs abroad and the general lack of nativity in the film, especially in the context of the message the film tries to preach. But it was a comment that still jarred.
For a movie with this kind of budget, the songs were shockingly bad.
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KayKay
November 9, 2011
Am in no hurry to watch this movie, but did Muruganka Dass at least have the brains to showcase Johnny Tri Nguyen’s excellent martial arts prowess?
How good is Johnny, I hear you asking?
Check him out here in the bone-crunching Muay Thai Actioner Tom Yum Goong against the awesome fighting machine called Tony Jaa:
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Sharan
November 12, 2011
Did anyone else realize that 7aum Arivu’s plot was a carbon copy of the video game. Assassin’s Creed?
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Vidhya
December 13, 2011
Ok, even though my comment comes long after after all the heated discussions above, I feel I have to write this. In the paragraph where you say “There are long stretches of the film where we feel we’re not watching a Suriya movie co-starring Shruti so much as a Shruti movie with Suriya as a sidekick.” Whats wrong with that? You could say you are just making an observation, but in all the sentences in that bullet point you are criticising Shruthi Haasan, then i see this too as a criticism, and thats what I dont understand. Isn’t it good if a movie has both the hero and heroine participating and whats wrong if Surya is a side kick? Its high time we see the movie for the sake of the movie and not just for the hero. And coming from an award winning critic like you, I was not expecting this. And the movie was called ‘7am arivu’ and not ‘Bodhi Dharman’, in which case I would have accepted the argument that you were looking for a “Surya” movie.
I did read your comment “These bullet-point reports aren’t really thoughtfully considered reviews, more like scattershot thoughts — so I treat them more casually. ” I wouldn’t have had any problem if you had separated the bullet points and said “It seemed like a Shruti movie…” in a separate bullet point.
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brangan
December 13, 2011
Vidhya: There’s nothing “wrong” with that. It’s just an observation. I felt the story should have made more room for Suriya’s character instead of making him a puppet in Shruti’s hands. But yes, it’s great that the heroine has something to do and in a sense actually empowers the hero to become what he becomes at the end.
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