Brief notes on ‘24 Weeks’, ‘Being 17’, ‘Death in Sarajevo’, and… ‘The End’.
When Astrid (Julia Jentsch) learns she’s going to have a child with Down’s syndrome, she storms out of the doctor’s office. Luckily, her boyfriend Markus (Bjarne Mädel) is a good, strong man. “I’m getting two pieces of Danish. One for you, and one for… you,” he smiles. “And then we will sleep on it.” But does the we word apply? What’s at stake, after all, are the rest of her life, her emotions, her chaotic career as a stand-up comic (and all the attendant media attention that will fall on her). Anna Zohra Berrached’s 24 Weeks (24 Wochen in German; the number refers to the six-month-old foetus) doesn’t judge Astrid, but it’s impossible for us not to be conflicted when we hear how the child will go if she decides to abort (which is legal in Germany). A Potassium Chloride injection will stop the heart, the 1.50-kilo corpse will be placed on the mother’s chest for a last goodbye… 24 Weeks make us see – literally see – what the pro-life people are talking about, even if we are pro-choice.
* * *
The great French director André Téchiné likes to say he doesn’t make movies – he finds them as he goes along. His new film, another one of his patented high-toned melodramas, is ostensibly the story of two boys – Damien (Kacey Mottet Klein), Thomas (Corentin Fila) – who cannot stand each other. But when Thomas’s mother gets pregnant, he moves into Damien’s house so he can be near the hospital, and… Being 17 (Quand on a 17 ans) is divided into three “trimesters,” as we follow the relationship between the boys, who battle sexual confusion with aggression. But this is also about Damien’s mother, whose husband is off fighting a war. It’s also about Thomas’s parents, who 17 years after adopting him, are overjoyed at the prospect of a “real child,” though we are told there is no such thing as a “fake child.” It’s the complex web of life, in other words – and Téchiné is a master weaver. The tale may be cliché, but the telling never is.
* * *
Danis Tanovic’s Bosnian drama Death in Sarajevo (Smrt u Sarajevu) is set in a hotel, on the centenary of the assassination that set off World War I. A high-level EU delegation is expected, and the staff, who haven’t been paid in months, want to use the opportunity to stage a strike. The film, as it follows multiple characters, instantly slots itself as “Altmanesque.” Children practice Ode to Joy, the staff members elect a leader, a French dignitary rehearses a speech even as CCTV cameras spy on him, and Lamija (Snežana Vidović), the overwhelmed manager’s right hand, is trying to shrug off the moonstruck man she spent the night with. The action, mirroring the various hierarchies of politicking and negotiations, glides from the terrace to the lobby to the kitchens and laundry rooms below, and the snaking camerawork lets us see how labyrinthine the situation is. Even if a lot of the content goes over one’s head (the Bosnian Muslim position, the Black Hand, unity of Southern Slavs, Chetnik thugs), the form, the filmmaking, is a model of clarity.
* * *
In Guillaume Nicloux’s The End – one of the many films much better than those in the competition section – Gerard Depardieu plays a man who goes on a hunt with his dog. It disappears, and looking for it, he loses his way. What is this pond doing here?” he wonders. “Where’s all this water coming from?” More questions follow. Who stole his gun? Who is the strange boy who seems to know his way through this maze? Who is the ashen woman who lands up naked? And are those really scorpions, the kind you find in deserts? What looks, at first, a man-cut-off-from-civilisation drama (like Cast Away, or All Is Lost) slowly morphs into an existential horror movie. Soon, bugs are crawling all over the Depardieu character, but even that’s not as scary (to us) as his slow approach to the woman, in a scene where she’s seen only from the back. We expect her to turn and… But there are no cheap thrills. Only a what-just-happened? ending that you will be discussing for days.
An edited version of this piece can be found here. Copyright ©2016 The Hindu. This article may not be reproduced in its entirety without permission. A link to this URL, instead, would be appreciated.
Baradwaj Rangan 
Srinivas R
February 18, 2016
BR, what a feast you are dining on, envy your position and enjoyed all your coverage of Berlinale movies. “24 weeks” seems very disturbing. I am very much pro choice and I get a sense that the movie is manipulative or judgmental, did you get that sense at all?. I have no chance of watching any of these movies you are writing about, but “24 Weeks” and “Fire at Sea” are the ones I am most curious about.
P.S. The video links here in this post are unrelated to the movies you have written about
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tonks
February 18, 2016
I am, I admit, pro-choice. I feel that no one else other than the mother has a right to judge because, of course : but does the we word apply? What’s at stake, after all, are the rest of her life, her emotions. But its a fact that the closer the foetus gets to term, to viability, to completion of pregnancy, the more abortion becomes legally sanctioned murder (considering that even a foetus as young as 8 weeks is a miniature human being with all its organs formed). This is one of those debates where there is no one right point of view. I wish I could see this movie.
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Sudha
February 18, 2016
Me too. I am fiercely pro-choice. But I have to say I am grateful I was never in a position when I had to put my politics into practice. At 8 weeks, the steady dubdub of my baby’s heartbeat was unexpectedly moving. And that was so early on. At 20 weeks, after feeling the movements, having to use lethal injection to terminate, that should be an incredibly tough choice. I mean, the choice should still lie with the mother, but it should be one taken after some intense soul searching. My response has also been moderated after reading “Far from the tree”, which features parents of dwarfs, deaf, disabled children and reading of how enriched their lives were, struggle and all, and which questions whether aborting children who are not “perfect” smacks of eugenics.
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olemisstarana
February 18, 2016
Yikes. Man… 24 Weeks is a rough subject.
@Tonks – do watch After Tiller. It deals with the subject of late term abortions (2nd trimester).. and the doctors who provide them. There are only a handful that do, and the documentary delves into their thought process and the reasons why. (Minor Spoiler – they accept very very few cases, health of the mother and the fetus being one of the primary reasons why). It’s not the black and white simplicity that the religious right in the west tries to make it out to be.
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Nee
February 18, 2016
Srinivas: those were my EXACT thought before I even read your comment. How very manipulative. Thats what I thought. I am very glad that there is someone who thought the same because I wouldn’t have otherwise posted this comment.
As far as my genetics knowledge goes, you can find out in first trimester itself that you are carrying a child with D.S. This is like at last more than a decade old technology. So I am not sure if there is a need to wait till 24 weeks but I guess if you are pro lifer than what better way to make a movie and guilt trip future/current parents.
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Apu
February 18, 2016
I know your write-up was not about pro-choice vs pro-life, so apologies in advance for writing about this line: “literally see – what the pro-life people are talking about, even if we are pro-choice.”
And again, I understand that this was w.r.t a film, but most pro-life people are actually pro-birth. Which means, they do not usually think or get engaged in “complications” like support for parents that are unable to care for their child, rehabilitation, adoption support, etc.
Tonks:”closer the foetus gets to term, to viability, to completion of pregnancy, the more abortion becomes legally sanctioned murder”. Where would you draw the line? Which week/day/minute is it when “abortion” becomes “murder”? (I am not saying this to counteract what you said, I am just bringing up a question that probably is steeped in grey areas).
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Nee
February 19, 2016
baddyji, apkaa favourite actress movie me aa raha hai. Don’t streep her out of dignity. She is good one in this one.
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Paresh
February 19, 2016
BR, your note on 24 Weeks took me to a short story The Diary that I’d written long back. Please have a look if you get free time. 🙂 Thanks.
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Sutheesh Kumar. P. S.
February 19, 2016
There are tests like double marker test done around 14 weeks and triple marker test done around 19 weeks, which are done to assess the risk factor for Downs Syndrome. Now that is technical but I guess what’s employed in this film’s instance is a bit of artistic license to articulate their stance. Manipulative? May be it’s one individual’s voice versus the world’s.
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Sutheesh Kumar. P. S.
February 19, 2016
Olemisstarana: Wow! You seem to be a veritable encyclopedia of current affairs and pop culture references. Looks like even Deadpool will have a tough time matching up to you.
The other day i’d commented that some old regular commenters are missing (sporadic appearance) like Ashuthosh, Anuja, Just another movie buff, Apala, the guy with the blade display picture etc., glad at least one is back.
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Anu Warrier
February 19, 2016
I’m deeply envious of the sort of films/documentaries/shorts that you are watching. I do not know how many of these I will ever get to watch, and when, if ever. I’m busily compiling a list of the films you wrote about.
That said: I do not know whether I will ever watch 24 Weeks. I lost a baby, in utero, at 28 weeks. My water broke prematurely, and the ultrasound they took at the ICU showed the baby did not have lungs, just air sacs. There was no way he would survive outside the womb. And by this time – 24 hours later – my life was at risk. So, in my case, abortion was not only justified by his lack of a major organ, but also necessitated by my health. They induced labour, and 8 hours later, was born a perfect little baby – he died in our arms 25 minutes later.
Here, in the US, it is in the second trimester that they check for birth defects. At least that is when they did, for me, ten years ago, when I was pregnant with my 10-year-old. I was terrified of the results. I have no compunction in saying that if he had had severe birth defects, I would have tearfully signed on the abortion forms. Yes, it is ‘legally sanctioned murder’, as tonks puts it. Yes, it ‘smacks of eugenics’ as Sudha says.
But, however emotional I am in other ways, I’m ruthlessly practical when it comes to events that will affect other people – What happens to the son I already have when all my attention, my resources – physical, emotional, financial – are focussed on his brother? What happens to that child if born, if one or the other of us (his parents) die? Does his brother, my other son, have to be responsible for him for the rest of his life? How do I justify saddling him with a responsibility he did not choose to have because I decided – ‘selflessly’ as some people put it – to have a baby who was seriously ill?
What if I didn’t have another child? Who would take care of the financial responsibility of this child’s care if and when I die? How will he survive on his own?
I have friends who have children who are autistic, who have DS, etc., and I have seen the heavy toll it takes on their other ‘normal’ children, as well as on them. I admire them for making that choice, and making it work; I know I will not be capable of doing so. It is not a life I would choose for either myself, my husband or my children.
And so, I do not judge women who get abortions. Whether immediately after conception, or for reasons of health of the mother or child later on in the pregnancy. We all make choices that are the best for us. And I know of no woman who chooses to have abortion as a method of birth control. And I know of no woman (and have read of only a few) who have chosen abortion without thinking deeply and seriously about its ramifications.
Which is why, it enrages me beyond belief when the religious right insist that abortion is ‘murder’. It infuriates me when someone tries to make them feel guilty. As someone put it, ‘For the —-, life begins at conception and ends at birth.’ But what of the woman’s life? This is the same lot of people that have a huge issue with ‘single mothers on welfare’. They do not want to provide the financial resources to set that woman back on her feet. But they will criminalise her for ‘murdering an innocent’. Her life is not important; only that ‘life’ she is carrying, is.
So, yes, I’m both pro-choice and pro-life — because the life of the woman is at least as important as the life of that child. Or it should be.
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RT
February 19, 2016
Like Srinivas, I’m also a bit wary about how manipulative “24 Weeks” might be simply because this is the type of extreme scenario which is typically used in propaganda by anti-choicers, with photos of aborted fully formed foetuses, when they know very well that late term abortions are a very rare occurrence.
I also think that “anti-choice” is a more accurate description than “pro-life” of those who are against abortion rights because they generally don’t seem to care as much about any other life apart from the unborn babies. To take just one example: lots of people die every year waiting for a kidney/liver/other organs because their doctors couldn’t find a match on the donors list. I don’t see anyone demanding that a person’s organs should always be harvested after their death if they can be used to save someone’s life, even if that person is not on the donors list. But those who are campaigning against abortion rights want to force women to deliver babies even if they don’t want to. If they get their way, women will have lesser control over their bodies than a dead body has over its organs. The term “pro life” gives them far too much credit.
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tonks
February 19, 2016
As far as my genetics knowledge goes, you can find out in first trimester itself that you are carrying a child with D.S. This is like at last more than a decade old technology. So I am not sure if there is a need to wait till 24 weeks
Absolutely agree. Thats ay valid point. But if she was below 35, they would probably not do specific fool proof tests for ruling out DS for every woman and the routine screening is admittedly not 100% fool proof. So I guess technically such a situation (though a little far fetched) is not impossible.
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brangan
February 19, 2016
Anu Warrier: That was an extraordinary comment. Thanks. It’s ridiculous when people generalise these things, and one has the right — indeed, the obligation — to think about oneself as much as one thinks of others.
Also, to those saying this is manipulative, I did not think so. At first, this woman wanted the baby. She made efforts to see other Down’s children etc. But gradually she begins to wonder is she is doing the right thing – for herself. And that is a very valid thing, IMO. You can’t make others happy if you aren’t happy yourself.
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sanjana
February 19, 2016
Sometimes medical reports mislead. I knew one lady who was advised by the doctors to abort as there is possibility of some deformation accompanied by mental retardation. It happened in a first world country. But the lady in question did not have the heart to do so and went ahead with the pregnancy. Now that girl who faced death before being born has no physical deformity and she is the brightest student in her class winning many competitions. But these types of cases are rather exceptions than normal.
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Sudha
February 19, 2016
AnuWarrier, thanks for sharing. That must have been a wrenching experience to go through. Wanted to clarify, Andrew Solomon (Far from the tree) – is not referring to aborting babies born with life-threatening birth defects when he talks of eugenics. He refers to children who will live, but with atypical characteristics – like being very very short, or deaf – and therefore have issues fitting with the rest of “normal” society. Well, he doesnt weigh in on either side, but the parents he profiles talk of their own dilemma when faced with a less-than-perfect child. Definitely, any parent who decides to go through should do so after contemplating a life that is subsumed by the baby’s needs – and in countries like India where there are no public health services and the traditional family support is being eroded, that is an even tougher decision to make.
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olemisstarana
February 19, 2016
@ Sutheesh Kumar. P. S.: Now if I have ever seen a euphemism for jobless… 😀 I kid, of course. Thank you. Such consumption is part of my job, much to the chagrin of those who attend parties with me.
But seriously, if you guys are ever on the fence of being kinda pro choice or kinda pro life, please go watch After Till. The 4 doctors profiled in the documentary are courageous in the face of some lethal odds. In another world, at another time, Dr. Till would have been celebrated for the unflinching hero that he was. You follow the doctors as they interview prospective patients, talk to them, understand the reason why they had to take such a step, you see their struggle, their understanding that if they don’t provide this medical procedure then the women who are denied may very well be handed a death sentence.
One of the doctor’s says, and I quote approximately – why is it that I get to decide based on someone’s telling of a story. Is it fair, because what if they simply cannot express a dire situation in compelling enough terms for me to agree to do this?
Apu mentioned the week term limits that are considered for legal administrations of the procedure. I know this is getting a little off movie topic, and more into social science, but I do want to mention the duplicity that is such a part of this issue here, and why the medical exception alone might not be enough.
You have young women and men (children, even), who are told that the only safe way is abstinence, hence no access to contraception. Now abstinence is a bouquet of bristling turds, and doesn’t work, and when these women fall pregnant, they end up looking for education, options – anywhere. They cannot go to their families or their churches or their friends and peers and often end up in these institutions that advertise themselves as medical facilities, but are actually pregnancy crisis centers run by pro life groups. Here, the women are questioned about their faith, their morals, given false medical information about the effects of abortion, aggressively sold on adoption, lied to about how far along their pregnancy is, lied to about the extant laws in the state, all in the intention of delaying things till it’s too late. Then you have states where the rapist/committer of incest has fatherly rights, i.e. where the woman having the baby would have to give parental rights to the father, or fight him in court for 18 years.
I really don’t want to come across as being cavalier. I just want to make people think, because it might be easy for the SCOTUS to keep redrawing a line in the sand, closer and closer to the date of conception, but there are real women with real issues and real lack of resources here.
Here’s a story for you. Mother of two autistic children, talking about her life, her struggles and her two sons whom she loves immensely.
http://www.wnyc.org/story/autism-death-sex-money/
At the end of the day, you just can’t make a choice for someone else. Period.
There is no grey between pro choice and pro life. You either are pro choice or you are not. Period. Some of the commenters here have started sentences that go somewhat like “I am pro choice, but those who are in xyz situation should really think about it,” or “I am pro choice but I would find it hard to do so myself.” You are all still very pro choice because the emphasis is on the choice, the thinking about, the allowing oneself the option of not.
Anu: I can’t even. Taking this conversation elsewhere. Madprops.
#shoutyourabortion
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olemisstarana
February 19, 2016
@RT: I almost missed that comment and feel that a simple “like”/”upvote” is not enough. Preach it brutha/sistah.
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Nee
February 19, 2016
“But gradually she begins to wonder is she is doing the right thing – for herself. And that is a very valid thing, IMO. You can’t make others happy if you aren’t happy yourself”
Not having seen the movie….I guess we are weighing in on it.
Personally I wouldn’t want to see such a movie, there is enough drama in personal life to not want to extend it, philosophically, on screen. Rather see boy-girl fall in love, run around trees…
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jithu
February 19, 2016
thanks Anu for that clarity..and BR for the context.
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tonks
February 19, 2016
You ask me, Apu : Where would you draw the line? Which week/day/minute is it when “abortion” becomes “murder”?
Or in other words, what is the point at which a bunch of cells gets invested with a life, becomes a human being? Impossible to answer and like you said, a grey area. But the period of viability (when the foetus can survive as a separate life independant of the mother, outside the womb) is near zero before 20 -22 weeks, even with modern neonatal care. Survival rates are 15% at 23 weeks, 56% at 24 weeks and 79% at 25 weeks. In practice, doctors and nurses are advised not to resuscitate babies with gestational age of 22 weeks or less, under 400g weight, with anencephaly, or with a confirmed diagnosis of trisomy 13 or 18. Currently the limit of viability is considered to be around 22 weeks in developed nations although the incidence of major disabilities remains high at this point. So perhaps “above 23-24 weeks when a foetus becomes capable of survival” is one way of answering your question. But then again, even the eight week embryo, though incapable of independent survival on its own, looks a lot like a human baby and has a beating heart. Which makes one wonder.
Despite this however, I’m absolutely with Olemisstarana (abstinence is a bouquet of bristling turds wow 😀 ) and Anu (disarmingly honest and eloquent comment as always #respect) on this. And no one other than the mother, in my opinion, has a right to judge or decide.
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tonks
February 19, 2016
On a lighter note, here’s Monty Python poking fun at what would happen if we took things too far
“There are Jews in the world there are Buddhists
There are Hindus and Mormons, and then
There are those that follow Mohammed, but
I’ve never been one of them
I’m a Roman Catholic
And have been since before I was born
And the one thing they say about Catholics is
They’ll take you as soon as you’re warm
You don’t have to be a six-footer
You don’t have to have a great brain
You don’t have to have any clothes on you’re
A Catholic the moment Dad came
Because every sperm is sacred
Every sperm is great
If a sperm is wasted
God gets quite irate”
Monty Python – Every Sperm Is Sacred
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tonks
February 19, 2016
I think one of my comments has disappeared into the spam folder?
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Sifter
February 19, 2016
@RT – Anti-abortion, not pro-choice – Perfect
@Olemisstarana – Can’t agree with you more
@Anu Warrier – What an awesome comment. With you. And in a small way, a big hug for what you went through.
@Tonks – So true. Had a guffaw at ‘You don’t have to have any clothes on you’re…A Catholic the moment Dad came. Because every sperm is sacred, Every sperm is great, If a sperm is wasted, God gets quite irate” Sad, but the frikking truth.
If in the west it is ‘pro-life/anti-abortion,’ in India it is an entirely different story. But in the end, it is all about making rules and laws that insist in taking away a woman’s right to herself, her-self.
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brangan
February 19, 2016
tonks: Not able to find comment in spam folder.
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Ram Murali
February 19, 2016
Anu Warrier – thank you so much for sharing your gut-wrenching story. I can completely relate to what you and your family went through. We went through the physically and emotionally draining experience of a miscarriage before we were blessed with a son a year and a half later.
This happened in 2011 when I was 29 and my wife was 27. Both of us and our families were looking forward to the arrival of our first baby in Aug of that year. In March, when my wife was 19 months pregnant, out of the blue, her water broke. That night, she had to still “deliver” the stillborn child. It was the most heartbreaking experience of our lives ever. To realize that the baby stopped breathing before she could see us broke us emotionally. The emotional nadir happened when the nurse suggested that my wife hold the baby in her arms for a couple of minutes to ensure that there’s “closure.” I don’t think that there’s another moment that my wife and I would consider more painful in our lives.
But I must say that my wife showed a lot more composure in that period than I did. A few days later when my Mum visited us, she (my Mum) remarked, opening the blinds of our room, “Winter is over, spring is almost here. Things will brighten up very soon for both of you.” And, my wife calmly replied, “Ma, it’s the brightness within that matters.” I was stunned that she could be so positive despite just having been handed a calamitous situation. Our lives have become better since that fateful day but memories of that experience flit past my mind every once in a while to make me realize that life is a boon and that we need to make the most out of it. As my hero Randy Pausch said, “You cannot control the cards that you’re dealt; just how you play the hand.”
Salute to women like Anu Warrier and my wife who have gone through these kind of experiences and have come out of them stronger.
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tonks
February 19, 2016
Its there now. Thanks 🙂
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RT
February 19, 2016
@olemisstarana – thanks for your kind comment. I also agree wholeheartedly with you about “the emphasis is on the choice, the thinking about, the allowing oneself the option of not”. Far too often, pro-choice is equated with “pro-abortion” but it is not the same thing.
@B.R. – glad to hear it is not manipulative, more tempted now to give it a try.
@Anu – thanks for sharing, that was an amazing comment. There’s really nothing much that I can add to the discussion after that, you’ve said it all.
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Anu Warrier
February 19, 2016
Thank you, every one. It’s still tough to write about it 16 years later.
Apu, – thanks for the queries about the ‘grey’ area.
Olemisstarana – especially the bit about the emphasis on ‘choice’. Whether to give birth, to abort or to adopt – these are, or should be, our birthright, not doled out to women as khairaat – that Urdu word that is so evocative in its meaning that an English word wouldn’t suffice.
Tonks – your perspective as a doctor adds so much to this discussion. These are topics we discussed – agonisingly. What if?
RT, your first comment – spot on! As olemisstarana put it, preach on! Especially about ‘pro-life’ meaning ‘anti-choice’. In any case, I can’t see the ‘pro-lifers’ being concerned about any other ‘life’ other than the one inside a woman’s womb. Thanks for a succinct comment on what it means to be ‘pro-choice’.
Sifter, thank you.
Ram Murali, my condolences to you, and your wife. If it will not offend you, {{hugs}}. Simply because, society often neglects the feelings of the fathers when a miscarriage or an MTP occurs. Just because they don’t carry the foetus to term doesn’t mean that men don’t feel its loss.
This has been an interesting, if painful discussion. Thank you, BR. Both for your support, and for providing a platform where we can debate – civilly – on such a fraught topic.
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Radhika
February 19, 2016
olemisstarana –
Very well put
(Slightly off topic, a woman I knew once said that she wished contraception hadn’t invented because then “the baby would just happen”, meaning she wouldn’t have to traumatize over when to plan for one. The rest of the group just tore into her, for wanting to abdicate decision making and blaming technology for it. We couldn’t fathom why she would want to give up the freedom of choice.)
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Ram Murali
February 20, 2016
Anu Warrier – thank you for your kind, empathetic words and for understanding that a father goes through a lot as well.
“Simply because, society often neglects the feelings of the fathers when a miscarriage or an MTP occurs.” –> I must say that my wife’s family offered tremendous support to not only my wife but also me, at the time. They knew that I was – and am – the more emotional person so, they extended a lot of support to me – pep talks, comforting words, cheering me up, etc. Of course, my own family knew me and what I needed. But for the in-laws to behave that way, that was sheer class, generosity and affection all rolled into one package. I am truly grateful to them for that…
As a lighter aside, I hate the person that came up with the line, “Boys don’t cry.” Who said so. I have sobbed my heart out many a time and I have not an iota of shame about it.
Virtual hug reciprocated and real salute repeated 🙂
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Sutheesh Kumar. P. S.
February 20, 2016
Ram Murali and Anu Warrier, I empathize with what you have gone through. My wife and I lost our first child and it was a pre-eclamptic delivery. The child was in the NICU and on ventilator for a week and didn’t survive. It was too painful for us to tide over this loss and it weighs on our mind even now. But I find some kind of cathartic solace from what you all have shared here. Thank you.
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Sifter
February 20, 2016
Apologies in advance for the OT – Nell Harper Lee is no more. RIP
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Radhika
February 20, 2016
re my comment above – i realize there is a circular paradox in us haranguing her for choosing to give up choice, hahahaha
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Ram Murali
February 20, 2016
Sutheesh Kumar. P. S. – I am very sorry for your loss. When I go to the temple today, I will sincerely pray that only good things beckon your family. Yes, this has been quite a cathartic experience.
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olemisstarana
February 20, 2016
@Radhika… “The ONLY choice you have is choice!”
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Sutheesh Kumar. P. S.
February 21, 2016
Ram Murali: That is really kind of you, thank you once again. You are a through and through gentleman. Like you said why shouldn’t a man cry?
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newbie
February 21, 2016
Anu, Ram Murali, Sutheesh Kumar P.S – Got very emotional reading this post and your comments. Someone I love deeply underwent something similiar many many years ago (80s) and to this day, she cannot bring herself to talk openly about it. So huge huge respect for sharing your stories in this forum – it cannot have been easy.
olemisstarana, RT, tonks – With you on ‘pro-choice’. I will never understand the hypocrisy behind putting the unborn child’s welfare before that of the mother. Its infuriating how in this day and age, this is even still an issue. Especially in countries like Ireland (a country which I adore otherwise) which had such dubious (anti) abortion laws ( http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-20321741 http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2012/nov/19/savita-halappanavar-death-pro-life-abortion), until very recently. And the US too, where religion and psuedo-science is still playing havoc with real people’s lives. (There are crazies in the UK too, but largely both left-wing and right-wing agree on being pro-choice, on gay rights and on climate change.)
Anyway, felt forced to create a wordpress ID just so I can explicitly start ‘liking’ comments. ‘newbie’ was already taken so will be using the boring but available ‘sameoldnewbie’ moniker.
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jithu
February 21, 2016
ottal wins Br! make it part of your berlin diary 🙂
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Sutheesh Kumar. P. S.
February 21, 2016
Newbie: Thank you for your comforting words.
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olemisstarana
February 22, 2016
Thank you all for this incredible thread. This is why I read you, all of you.
I wanted to leave the thread as is, but please see this…
Very on point.
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Iswarya
February 22, 2016
Olemisstarana: I came here just to add that LWT link and you’ve snatched away my only possible chance to add to this most meaningful conversation! 😦
Anyway, a big salute to all those who have shared their most private/painful memories here. Your courage is truly inspiring!
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Anu Warrier
February 23, 2016
olemisstarana, thanks for my morning laugh. It was hilarious, yet on point and hard hitting as well. Loved it.
Sutheeshkumar, just read about your experience. My condolences to you and your wife.
Ram Murali: I see no shame in a man crying. As I said, the loss is as much yours as it is your wife’s.
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Paresh
February 25, 2016
Anu Warrier, first of all a big SORRY for being late in going through your comment and responding to it. I too have spent many a sleepless nights thinking about prenatal detection of defect/disability in the foetus and wondered what my parents would have done if cerebral palsy could be detected in the initial stages of pregnancy… I’d have wished that they’d stopped me from coming into this world like this. 😛
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Anu Warrier
February 25, 2016
Paresh, from what you wrote, it appears that you’ve CP? (If not, I apologise.) Your parents absolutely made their own choice and I’m sure that whatever they went through, having you as their son is both a blessing and a happiness.
Mine was an academic post, Paresh, since I cannot even say for sure what I would do now, for instance. What I wrote above is what I felt then – when I’d already lost a baby with a birth defect in utero, and was being told that I’d to prepare myself for another baby with a serious birth defect.
I don’t know what the right answer is, nor if there is one right answer. I know that, for me, what was right then may not be right now, or what was wrong then may absolutely be the right thing to do now. Life, circumstances, your own capacity – physical, emotional, financial – to deal with issues… all of those play into how we make our decisions.
The only thing I do not do is second guess my decisions. I do not regret them – because whatever decision I took then was taken with the information I had at that time, and the knowledge of what I could deal with then.
All I’m saying is that it is my choice. And that is something I’ll fight for, until death. For me, and for other women like me. They, and only they, should have the right to choose. My life, and those of other women like me, is at least as important as that of the life we carry inside our wombs.
As I said before, I have friends who would choose differently from me, who have chosen differently from me – I admire them from the bottom of my heart. I know I do not have their strength. And I will not leave what is (or should be) my responsibility on someone else’s shoulders. My choice is limited to what I would do for myself. I do not insist that others choose that same path. But that freedom of choice? That is important.
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sravishanker1401gmailcom
February 26, 2016
Anu, Ram Murali, Satheesh : many Thanks for sharing. What a support group this is !
My wife and I have been through something similar but not to the extent you have. But it was a nightmarish experience and left a bitter taste for years since there was lack of sympathy and cut us off from many of our relatives for years.
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Ram Murali
February 27, 2016
Ravishanker – absolutely. thanks for your comment.
You wrote that it “left a bitter taste for years since there was lack of sympathy and cut us off from many of our relatives for years.”
I am sorry to hear about that. I had a similar experience with some people outside of my immediate circle. I don’t think I would venture to call it “lack of sympathy” but it was more a lack of understanding of what we were going through. People would make casual statements like, “Seekrama amanjudum…romba emotional aagathengo.” My worst moment was when I received an e-mail from someone that called it a “mishap,” acknowledged my sharing the news in one line and then moved over to describe some stupid occasion that was coming up. I remember fuming internally thinking, “It’s a big deal to us.” That e-mail exchange really fractured my relationship with that person.
But as you said, it’s good to have a support group – the group maybe virtual but the sentiments are absolutely real.
Have a great weekend. And, thanks for sharing your experience.
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Paresh
February 27, 2016
Anu Warrier you don’t need to apologise as I’ve got CP (with 90% locomotor disability and speech impairment). I was just talking of hypothetical situation as CP isn’t detectable in prenatal stages even now. 😛 Baradwajji, I hope you don’t mind if I use this space for a little shameless self-promotion. 😛 😀
Thanks. 🙂
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Sutheesh Kumar. P. S.
February 27, 2016
Hi Paresh Palicha, yours is a voice i respect among malayalam movie critics. Wow! your story is an eye opener and truly inspirational. You can be proud of what you have acheived and kudos to your wonderful parents. Now i’m eagerly looking forward to your film. All the Best.
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tonks
February 27, 2016
Paresh : That was a very moving video. Hats off to you and your parents for all you’ve achieved.
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MANK
February 27, 2016
Paresh Palicha, that was a very moving story. thanks for sharing. Truly inspirational. i love your malayalam reviews that appear on rediff. you convey so much about the film in so few sentences. Honored to do your plugging sir, one of my favorites of your recent reviews.
http://www.rediff.com/movies/report/review-pathemaari-is-worth-a-watch/20151012.htm
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apex
February 27, 2016
Mr Paresh–Im trying not to join this debate… but i just HAD to jump in & applaud u.
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Anu Warrier
February 28, 2016
Paresh, that was absolutely touching. I can only imagine what you and your parents must have gone through – my heartfelt congratulations for your incredible journey, and a humble salute to your parents as well.
All the very best for any future endeavour.
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Paresh
February 28, 2016
Thanks everyone for your encouraging words. 🙂 Now, may I request you to read the short story The Diary that I’ve linked in a comment above. Thanks. 🙂
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Ram Murali
February 29, 2016
Paresh – thank you for sharing your short story. I found it immensely moving. The fact that you took a very difficult topic and tackled it head on was extremely praiseworthy. Keep at it – you write extremely well.
And, thanks also for sharing your personal story. You and your parents are truly an inspiration. Have a great week ahead…
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Nee
March 2, 2016
PareshBhai,
Your parents are divine. So much smiles and such love between all of you. This family love is indeed rare.
Brought tears.
People tend to make broad strokes but things are not that easy. Shri Krishna (I spied Sri Nathji in the mandir and calendar in the video) called it “gahana”…complex. l So too it is complex/complicated and beyond our understanding of “whys”.
The best is to give up “Why me” complex. Every life is useful and indeed has a purpose.
If we are not exhausting our own karma, our presence causes others to exhaust theirs.
May you flourish and keep writing.
May you also make a movie one day.
May all your dreams come true.
I will send your video link to all my friends.
Keep dropping in at BRji’s (for he in indeed a decent man) site and keep us up to date on what is going on with your movie endeavors.
Take Care
Nee
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Nee
March 2, 2016
I have read all three of your blog posts and am posting for others if they want to discuss with you furthur.
I must say that it is indeed thought provoking and eye-opener for me.
http://pareshpalicha.blogspot.com/2008/08/playing-god.html
http://pareshpalicha.blogspot.com/2006/10/towards-perfect-world_07.html
http://pareshpalicha.blogspot.com/2006/07/women-power.html
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apex
March 2, 2016
Great stuff by paresh & nee.. Good people
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Eddiered
March 2, 2016
Awesome comment, Apex… but I asked you a question on Vacation Notes. No answer?
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Nee
March 2, 2016
@Eddiered: So you hate a person, you write long notes about how they need to be shushed or gone from blog but you cannot stop fingering the person.
Don’t you see a gadbad in this? Someone/something needs to be corrected. It is within. Not outside you dude.
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olemisstarana
March 2, 2016
Nee: Is Apex really the hill you are choosing to die on?
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Eddiered
March 2, 2016
But Nee – I am having a genuinely enlightening conversation with Apex. I understand such conversations burst from the confines of the thread in which they begin, but such is the nature of a free ranging discussion… I am so sorry you are offended!
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