Someone brought up the nepotism thing in the comments section, and I thought I’d add my two cents. Was the joke (by Saif, Karan and Varun) insensitive? Sure. Was it in bad taste? Probably. But these awards shows have a long tradition of jokes being made about the industry — that’s the shtick. And each of these jokes must have been “hurtful” to the person being lampooned. This is what a certain kind of comedy is. I find this whole “men of privilege bashing a poor little actress with no connections” narrative a little baffling. Had this joke been made early on in Kangana’s career, then sure, this narrative might stand. But now, she’s herself in a position of privilege. She’s controlling her narrative. She can afford to have a few jokes cracked at her expense, just like Sanjay Leela Bhansali can afford to have a joke cracked about the failure of Saawariya, which happened in an awards show.
This goes back to how touchy we are when it comes to comedy, how easily we are outraged. We seem to be okay with the “roasts” we watch, where Hollywood royalty is mercilessly mocked. It seems to be fine when they do it to their stars. But the same happens here, and a thousand op-ed pieces bloom forth.
PS: It’d be so much more fun if Kangana shot back a few jokes at Saif, Karan and Varun. Balance restored. End of silly fracas.
PPS: There are far more important things we should be taking the cudgels up for.
Baradwaj Rangan 
Doba
July 20, 2017
I think the problems has been that Karan has been very touchy and condescending since the beginning. He lampoons people on his show and gets paid for it. But when Kangana lampooned him on his show, he didnt take it well and has been using all sorts of outlets to vent his frustration.
Plus, you cant force people to laugh. If the “joke” had been self deprecatory, it would have been funny. But this joke wasn’t – What is funny about the line “Kangana talks too much. She should not talk!” ? Very different from Ricky Gervais / Tina Fey in Golden Globes.
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Prem
July 20, 2017
“Was the joke (by Saif, Karan and Varun) insensitive? Sure. Was it in bad taste? Probably.” Thats about it….move on, why did you have to write more? Besides, its all these two cents that add up to becomes the ‘fracas’!.
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MANK
July 20, 2017
IIFA is a publicity stunt where big stars have to be paid fat paychecks just to be present and Johar has always been a jerk. i am surprised you even bothered to write this
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jussomebody
July 20, 2017
Before this ‘joke’, Karan Johar and other products of nepotism were not acknowledging the privilege they have enjoyed with humility, instead couching the issue in a whole load of bs about how only talent helps in survival (as if so-called talent just decides to bestow itself upon a randomly chosen someone, having nothing to do with social and cultural capital, and opportunities to hone itself). KJo in his most obnoxious, entitled manner also condescended about how Kangana should leave the industry if she is unhappy, villifying her for playing the ‘victim card’ when she was pointing to an obvious structural problem. Apologies/explanations since the joke have also been evasive (Varun, KJo with his now refusal to talk about it) and downright stupid (Varun who clearly doesn’t get it, Saif – hahahahahaha). The fact that Kangana is in control of the narrative, and on the flip side, personal attacks on her: both focus on Kangana the individual, which isn’t what this is about, is it? She just happened to be the one who talked about a deeper issue and managed to grab eyeballs. That joke was salt on the wounds of all those who struggle to get access and opportunities, which is a serious issue with resonance across multiple sectors of employment and education. A refusal to open oneself to debate that questions one’s own privilege is just douchebaggery. I don’t even feel like watching any of these privileged idiots’ movies anymore.
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dagalti (@dagalti)
July 20, 2017
I believe the expression in order is: aanaalum unakku romba dhairiyam pA!
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brangan
July 20, 2017
jussomebody: I agree with most of what you say. But I am only talking about the “joke” aspect of it. Had this been a dig in a forum or a panel discussion, then yes, we should take it seriously. In that situation, this would not be seen as a flippant remark.
But this (admittedly tasteless and tone-deaf) joke is at an awards show, where there have been many such potshots taken. To me, the setting of this event makes it like the Oscars, where Seth MacFarlane made the jokes mentioned here:
http://www.today.com/news/5-most-controversial-seth-macfarlane-oscar-lines-include-fat-joke-1C8539124
These covered assassination humour, race, all sorts of stuff.
So it’s really about whether you think certain topics can be made fun of, or not. Again, I am not defending the joke itself as much as I’m talking about how one should take into consideration the setting (venue, occasion) of the joke.
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sanjana
July 20, 2017
The award functions crack jokes at the expense of others and also self deprecating jokes. If Kangana had been a man, it would have been different. Public figures are parodied and joked about. Even an outsider will become a privileged one once one starts patronising one’s close ones after establishing oneself. These are grey areas. And we hear stories of how one makes compromises to get to the top. Will things change and will new comers start getting priority? Unless the new comers show talent and persistance, it wont happen.. Like Sushant singh Rajput or Deepika or even Kangana. What about godfathers who grant favours for something in return? Kjo has the decency to apologise and let us move on. Hope he will crack jokes on himself. Let us stop joking as someone or something will get hurt in the process!
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sanjana
July 20, 2017
It should be, The hosts or jokers at award functions crack jokes
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tonks
July 20, 2017
The Karan Johar I’ve known from his writing, his book and his interviews comes across as funny, intelligent, self aware and very likeable. Even while watching that particular episode of Koffee with Karan where she calls him out for nepotism, Kangana came across as humourless and someone who took herself too seriously when compared to Saif who was with her. I was actually feeling a little sympathetic towards Karan who was getting relentlessly bashed verbally by Kangana, especially since Karan said nothing to defend himself. Probably because she was his guest then (and he was no Walder Frey 😉 ).
But the way Karan has since then behaved does reflect poorly on him. Can he not see the truth in her accusation which makes his present joke fall flat. Three privileged star kids, boasting about that privilege. And we are supposed to find that amusing? Where is the joke in that?
I loved watching the AIB roast. I found that very funny. Maybe because it was mostly self deprecating humour or directed at people present there who were game for getting roasted.
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Sowmya:)
July 20, 2017
The problem seems to be that KJo used the awards platform to settle personal scores with Kangana under the garb of a joke. He just doesn’t seem to get over her statement on his show. It would have been seen as funny / self deprecatory if there was no history behind the whole nepotism debate. In an interview with Rajeev Masand, Jim Sarab beautifully explained nepotism (without using the term) to Harshvardhan Kapoor who tried to show off his ‘hard work’ in getting the movie and working on it. That did not make news for many reasons but also partly because it was between 2 men. While I agree Kangana is no longer a ‘poor actress with no connections’, it still is bashing by men because the person who spoke the truth they didn’t want to hear was a woman.
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RightVsWrong
July 20, 2017
Just how does Bharadwaj Rangan decide what kind of jokes one can/cannot crack in panels, forums or awards functions? For someone who says a ‘Gadar’ preached hatred, talking about context is quite rich. We read you regularly taking potshots in your reviews at this or that scene in a movie by applying your own standards of liberal principles or whatever. Right or wrong, you do it.
If jokes at awards functions are acceptable, certain dialogues in movies should be even more par for the course.
‘Particular kind of jokes on particular occasions are OK’ is just arbitrary.
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brangan
July 20, 2017
RightVsWrong: Particular kind of jokes on particular occasions are OK’ is just arbitrary.
I am not saying that at all. I am saying had the same thing been uttered — not as a joke, but as part of the discussion — on a, say, panel discussion, then we should take it seriously. In an awards show, where jokes like this are made around the world, it doesn’t warrant more than a “tasteless joke, now let’s get on with it” reaction.
Context does matter.
PS: Where did you read that ‘Gadar preached hatred’ thing? I genuinely cannot remember, so would appreciate a reminder.
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rothrocks
July 20, 2017
@tonks: It’s obvious that Kangana has hit a raw nerve and KJ is more unsettled than he wants us to believe. It was clear from his unduly harsh “gtfo” to her earlier. I am glad that she brought up this topic because it is yanking off his mask of self-depreciation. His barb at Vidya Balan a few years back was also mean spirited; it wasn’t just him trying to be funny but also voicing his insecurity by deliberately objectifying an actress who had achieved success with her acting rather than her looks. Does KJ feel threatened by or resents outsider actresses who achieve success without being part of Dharma Productions? Possible! Fool me twice, shame on me, KJ!
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prempalanivel
July 20, 2017
Bradwaj, your slant support to the Johar gang is evident from your 2 cents. Why won’t you ask Johar to chill and move on …instead of using every forum he gets to retort and get back to kangana? Looks like he’s the one who is holding to the outrage! And you think that Kangana and the Johar gang enjoy the same privileges now is it?
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brangan
July 20, 2017
prempalanivel: your slant support to the Johar gang is evident from your 2 cents.
Really? That’s what you got from this? That I picked one “side” over another. Jeez, man.
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prempalanivel
July 20, 2017
If there was no slant you would have picked the right side…telling KJ to take a chill pill and move on. Instead you picked the side of ‘oh move on folks, what’s the big deal if the privileged KJ is using every platform to get back at Kangana? ‘
Well, thats how it seems to me.
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Anuja Chandramouli
July 20, 2017
BR: You are now officially the BOY WHO KICKED THE HORNET’S NEST. Can’t wait to see you in the movie version (Wouldn’t it be something if Hansika snagged the part of the female lead 🙂 ) Incidentally, I agree with you especially the bit about the op – eds blooming forth every time Bollywood fat cats open their big mouths and very deliberately stick their Manolo Blahniks (or is it Louboutins?) in to crank the publicity machine and generate an avalanche of attention. There are so many other things we can get worked up about you know…
But since I am extremely fond of getting all hot and bothered over entirely inconsequential stuff, let’s stir the pot. For the record, I do think the joke was in poor taste and not worth all this attention, but K Jo does make some valid points. For one, Kangana has played the victim and woman card once too often. It may not have been the case in the beginning but she is one of the most powerful stars in the industry now and it won’t kill her to be a tad more gracious and self deprecating once in a while. With regard to nepotism I think the paying public are to blame for this as well. For some reason, everybody seems obsessed with celeb kids these days from Jahnvi Kapoor and Sara Ali Khan to Suhana and lil Abram. Its insane! Small wonder that producers feel that celeb kids are a safe bet.
That said, the entitlement of these star kids gets to be a little bit much. It would be lovely if they could stand up and acknowledge their privilege instead of whining about how rough they had it because K Jo insisted they live on carrot sticks and cabbage soup for their big debut so that they can squeeze into all that haute couture.
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Aman
July 20, 2017
Arjun Kapoor is the joke they forgot to crack.
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brangan
July 20, 2017
Anuja Chandramouli: For some reason, everybody seems obsessed with celeb kids these days …
That’s partly the media’s doing, for they publish photos of Jhanvi standing in the airport etc. But I do think nepotism is less of an issue in the film industry (or the arts in general) than elsewhere, because being a star child can only get you a foot in the door. But if the audience rejects you, you’re nowhere. I don’t see producers queuing up outside Armaan Jain’s or Athiya Shetty’s door. So there’s a natural market balance at work there.
For me, nepotism is scarier when, say, a doctor bequeaths his practice to a less-qualified son. There are fewer checks and balances when it comes to other professions.
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MANK
July 20, 2017
the entitlement of these star kids gets to be a little bit much. It would be lovely if they could stand up and acknowledge their privilege instead of whining about how rough they had it because K Jo insisted they live on carrot sticks and cabbage soup for their big debut so that they can squeeze into all that haute couture..
superb comment Anuja . i developed concussions reading that statement, nodding my head vigorously and laughing out loud at the same time 🙂
These star kids do have a heightened sense of entitlement. Remember when Kareena was making her debut – in the interviews she was giving left right and centre – where she was trying to paint herself as the chosen one
Apropos Kangana, i think she is very very insecure.i dont think she has come to terms with her success. Also years of drug abuse and assorted stuff has taken a toll on her, she has been in some bad relationships where men has abused her repeatedly and she seems to have become really paranoid in the process.
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MANK
July 20, 2017
For me, nepotism is scarier when, say, a doctor bequeaths his practice to a less-qualified son. There are fewer checks and balances when it comes to other professions.
Brangan, i think that’s a wrong analogy. because a doctor;s son does undergo a fair amount of education and training to get to be a doctor. the most scariest analogy will be in politics as in a great statesmen bequething his legacy to a good for nothing son. some names do come to mind but i dont want to kick start another controversy
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sanjana
July 20, 2017
I think BR is getting mildly roasted here!
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brangan
July 20, 2017
MANK: Haven’t you come across doctors who’ve barely scraped through exams, barely qualified, with zero empathy, etc.? I have. These guys have a set of medicines they prescribe for basic things and the public doesn’t know much better. Anyway, the point was a bigger one — that nepotism in the arts is less of an issue (at least to me) than elsewhere.
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sanjana
July 20, 2017
Star kids are also compared to their parents, siblings. Most of the time they receive flak if they cant match the expectations. Only advantage is they get more chances to prove themselves if there is some spark.
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Doba
July 20, 2017
But Mr. Rangan, surely you see that the arts is not the same as Indian movies. Indian movie stars (along with politicians and cricketers) are given inordinate power and money and influence. That is a coveted position. Athiya Shetty is given more opportunities than a newbie. For instance, Taapsee has mentioned all the hoops she had to cross before she got her chances. Its not fair – its just not fair. Why cant these Bollywood fat cats just notice the stench?
Also, to other readers citing Kangana’s drug abuse, physical abuse and so on. Man, that’s mansplaining at its worst. She is making an observation about nepotism based on her personal experiences. You can agree or disagree with that observation. But dont put it down to physical ailment or mental ailment.
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thewordsmithsapprenticeblog
July 20, 2017
More then the “joke” I think the timing of the “joke” is important..
just consider this.. kangana had her last hit over two years ago.. since then two of her major releases (katti batti and Rangoon) tanked on box office.. add it to the last whole year was a crapfest for her in that ugly spat with Hrithik.. so in short I think she might be at her vulnerable best at this time and these brave “Two and half men” chose to attack her at the precise moment..
Even if we keep all the arguments aside kicking someone when she’s already down isn’t fair at all.
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MANK
July 20, 2017
Doba, i wasn’t mansplaining or anything. i dont disagree about the nepotism point as i have mentioned in my comment about entitlement of star kids . my response was in relation to Anuja’s observation
For one, Kangana has played the victim and woman card once too often. It may not have been the case in the beginning but she is one of the most powerful stars in the industry now and it won’t kill her to be a tad more gracious and self deprecating once in a while.
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MANK
July 20, 2017
Haven’t you come across doctors who’ve barely scraped through exams, barely qualified, with zero empathy, etc.
Hmm, perhaps i have , but i guess they do less damage than Zayed Khan or Bobby Deol 😀
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RightVsWrong
July 20, 2017
You talked about ‘Gadar preached hatred’ in your review of Bajrangi Bhaijaan.
“In an awards show, where jokes like this are made around the world, it doesn’t warrant more than a “tasteless joke, now let’s get on with it” reaction.” Jokes are not just jokes sometimes. Scholars analyse commercial ads, innocuous captions, satirical stand-ups, etc for social commentary.
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brangan
July 20, 2017
RightVsWrong: Okay, I guess the way you read my writing is different, then. I said “sell hatred” not “preach.” Very different things.
This is what I wrote:
The great twist in Bajrangi Bhaijaan is in how it renounces the masala formula of good-versus-evil, especially given its incendiary plot built around hostile neighbours. This is no Gadar, and the Pakistanis are not the Enemy. One of them is Chand Nawab (Nawazuddin Siddiqui)… Chand is a journalist and he’s trying to sell the Pawan-Munni story to Pakistani television channels, but no one is interested. He tells Pawan, wryly, that it’s easier to sell hate than love. That’s what Anil Sharma did, with Gadar. Kabir Khan, on the other hand, chooses love.
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Anuja Chandramouli
July 20, 2017
Awww… MANK! How sweet are you? Merci beaucoup mon ami 🙂
BR: “Haven’t you come across doctors who’ve barely scraped through exams, barely qualified, with zero empathy, etc.?…Anyway, the point was a bigger one — that nepotism in the arts is less of an issue (at least to me) than elsewhere.”
I found both observations extremely disturbing. While its true that there are quacks and supremely incompetent nincompoops holding positions of power and grave responsibility (shudder) in other fields like education, civil services, etc. I don’t see why nepotism in any field should be brushed aside. Again, when we are looking at the big picture it is precisely this sort of thinking that prevents us from ensuring a level playing field across society where true talent alone is allowed to shine.
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Madan
July 20, 2017
” But I am only talking about the “joke” aspect of it.” – I think the point is it is difficult to unpack what all went on between the two in this case. In fact, it can be argued that the past history had everything to do with KJ choosing to target her again. So when you say that Kangana should have retorted back and it would have been over, well, it’s actually KJ who is unable to let go of this. And it’s not hard to see why. I also don’t agree that the BO being a brutal judge would level the playing field between star sons and daughters and outsiders. Would AB Jr have got such a long rope early in his career had he not been a star son? And that is AFTER they get to be a part of films, an opportunity that is far more difficult to access for an outsider. So I don’t buy KJ’s argument there at all. It’s more likely that as a privileged insider, he is blissfully unaware of the privileges he is afforded which Bolly’s teeming strugglers cannot.
@ MANK: “but i guess they do less damage than Zayed Khan or Bobby Deol” – I was once treated by an MBBS quack who refused to give me, then a 11 year old, medication for malaria, urging my mother to rely on natural cure. My mother didn’t have second thoughts on rushing me to an MD paediatrician in the next suburb. Many bungling Dr. Deaths out there. Maybe now that we in the ‘middle class’ no longer have to go to those little dispensaries run by MBBS doctors, we are insulated from them though in exchange we have to deal with scalpel-wielding mercenary surgeons hungry to cut you open.
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brangan
July 20, 2017
Anuja Chandramouli: I don’t see why nepotism in any field should be brushed aside.
I’m not saying it should be brushed aside. Just saying that I — and maybe only I — have less of an issue with a star child getting an easy break than someone incompetent entering a field where we cannot evaluate them as easily, because it’s not a simple “I saw you on screen, I think you suck” kind of situation.
Madan: I think the point is it is difficult to unpack what all went on between the two in this case.
That’s right. Only those three guys know whether it was a genuine (bad) joke or an act of vindictiveness. Which is why it is easier for me to lump this under the kind of roasting that happens at awards shows than something I’d care to pick apart threadbare. Which, of course, does not mean that others should not write reams about the subject. Just that I feel it’s not worth it, given the context, the setting.
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Madan
July 20, 2017
Oops, I meant to write it is difficult to unpack it FROM what all went on between the two in this case. What a difference the absence of one word makes to the meaning of the sentence!
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silverambrosia
July 20, 2017
Haven’t seen the awards or the ‘joke’ made by karan, saif and varun… but more broadly have little sympathy for Kangana.. I used to be a fan but of late feel that she acquired has an enormously inflated ego and a disproportionate sense of her own importance. She is not the only talented or capable actress in Bollywood or the only successful contemporary star who has made it without a godfather in Bollywood. Nor is she the unfairly ridiculed newcomer fighting against the odds anymore. I used to admire her because of her grit, determination and her refreshing honesty in interviews. That ‘plain speaking’ trait now manifests itself in ways that convey a lot of arrogance. Points about nepotism can also be made strongly without directly and emphatically attacking its individual beneficiaries: this whole things seems as much about personalities and personal score setting rather than about the principle of it (from Kangana’s side (koffee with Karan) as much as anyone else’s).
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Anu Warrier
July 20, 2017
@tonks, I agree with much of what you say, but where the AIB roast disturbed me was that not all the people being roasted had agreed to it, some of them very senior members of the film fraternity, who weren’t used to this at all.
My initial sympathies were, like you, with Karan, because Kangana came across as being too humourless and too avid-to-make-her-point than anything else. Besides, I did get the feeling that the only reason she came onto the show was to make that very point. (My feeling watching the show.) In other words, she had an agenda, and she skilfully executed it.
I liked that one clarification that Karan made initially afterwards; that he continues to talk about it is irritating beyond belief. But then, I don’t like whiners.
@Anuja – again, I agree – Kangana has played both the ‘woman card’ and the ‘victim card’ once too often. And that irritates me as well, because, damn, woman, you are in a position where you can do something about it. Stop playing the victim now. Also, having whipped Manikarnika right off under Ketan Mehta’s nose after having been in talks with him is Just. Not. Done.
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Anu Warrier
July 20, 2017
Re: the jokes. SRK’s and Karan’s jab at Vidya was scripted as was her reaction. So was Akshay’s ‘joke’ about Gauri always calling him at night. If you think all this is impromptu, you’re mistaken. This one just happened to be in very bad taste, not because they took potshots at Kangana (because they take potshots at everyone), but because this seemed like personal vendetta. I can understand their mocking the ‘nepotism’ part of it; it’s a topic that’s waiting to be mocked.
FWIW, Karan makes plenty of jokes about himself. And when he co-hosts with SRK, they are taking lots of potshots at each other. Ranbir and Imran took enough potshots at everybody else including their seniors at the Filmfare function they hosted.
I find a lot of those jokes cringe-inducing (the one about Vidya was particularly irritating; and I’m glad the script also had her address SRK as a waiter at Yashraj), but then, unlike the Queen, ‘Mera sense of humour bhi na…! 🙂
I did like what Ranbir had to say about nepotism; that he was here because his father and his grandfather and their father before them was in films. That he was blessed to be given that opportunity, but he would also be judged more harshly than a rank newcomer. AB Jr was always judged against his famous father who was still in the industry, castng his shadow over everyone. Yes, he got the chance because of his surname; rank outsiders don’t get that opportunity. Or didn’t. But if you look at the top heroines today, for instance, Aiswarya, PC, Deepika, Anushka, Kangana, Vidya, Katrina – none of them had industry roots. Neither does the current boxoffice flavour – Ranveer Singh. Or Siddharth. SRK and Akshay were also outsiders. So was Amitabh, for that matter. Richa, Irfan, Huma, Nawazuddin, Kalki et al are also ‘outsiders’.
Oh, yes, it was more difficult for them, and there are plenty more who won’t get a chance. But the famous surname only gets you so far, and no further in the film industry. Unlike, say, in business, where sonny boy or daddy’s girl will take over papa’s business, irrespective of whether they are qualified or not.
Can we do away with nepotism completely? Does anyone really think we can? Conversely, if someone appoints their extremely qualified family member, does that make nepotism any better? Or is that person considered unqualified simply because he/she happens to be the offspring of the person appointing them? Something to think about.
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Vanya
July 20, 2017
This has been mentioned already, but there are a couple of ugly undercurrents to this controversy. The first deals with privilege. In comedy, I believe the rule of thumb is to target those at or above your level on the privilege totem pole. In this case, there’s privilege in being successful/wealthy and from gender. Kangna has upped her privilege on the former, but the latter remains unchanged. Actresses in India aren’t suddenly immune to sexual harassment (or rape/molestation in Kerala) or to constantly being told to shut up. In Kangna’s case, in spite of being a very articulate speaker, she’s regularly ridiculed or called some variant of hysterical — on this page alone, comments were made about paranoia and potential brain damage from drug use. (I can think of two instances now where her comments have been responded to with disproportionate force and venom (Hrithik, KJ); considering this, can her suspicion towards the industry still be viewed as paranoia?)
Second, re: nepotism being acceptable in the arts; this is a slippery slope. What about science, another creative field? Engineering? In the US, one could argue this already happens at the college level due to legacy preferences, and there’s data to support the argument that quality is impacted. I’m genuinely surprised that the arts are being held to a lower standard on this site of all places.
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Doba
July 20, 2017
What is the woman card? I have heard it mentioned so often now. How does a person (who happens to be a woman) who articulates a popular point of view eloquently, with thought and courage, then get called out for playing the woman card? When she speaks out honestly, there may be many other young women (and men) who agree with her (and thank her for bringing it up) but who may not have her guts or power to speak out. As a person who has reached her position, it would have been safe and easy for her to sit quiet and preserve her position.
Second, if a Khan or Bachchan had brought this issue up (I know, it sounds laughable), would Karan Johar and his cronies have stood on stage and mocked them and asked them to shut up? That would have been a true roast. What happened here was just some bullying.
Its not a roast to poke fun at the fault lines of society – race, gender, skin color, caste, money and in this case – your connections.
People are not calling for the jokes to be banned. But they are entitled to get outraged. The fact that this topic is resonating implies that there is a section of society that is troubled by the inherent unfairness in our society and the lack of a level playing field. That outrage is there in the political spectrum, its there for the movies and its there against the cricketers. I remember reading about how Arjun Tendulkar was getting helicoptered into the Indian team, was getting batting practice against the best of overseas bowlers and so on and many were mad about it.
I am a fan of Mr. Rangan and so many of the other commenters here (that I disagree with on this particular thread). I am usually a silent reader and don’t write in comments. But this time I am so pained by the ease with which women’s opinions are dismissed or considered irrelevant and how men who do so are given an easy pass.
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brangan
July 20, 2017
Vanya: nepotism being acceptable in the arts
Oh. My. God. This is so not what I’m saying, that it’s “acceptable.”
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Santa
July 20, 2017
This is old news, but for a somewhat more nuanced and candid take on nepotism from KJo:
http://www.ndtv.com/opinion/karan-affairs-in-defence-of-my-nepotism-1674657
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Anu Warrier
July 20, 2017
Oh. My. God. This is so not what I’m saying
@BR, 🙂 Man, I feel for you.
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brangan
July 20, 2017
Doba: I’m glad this thread kind of outed you and made us hear you voice. It’s an interesting voice. Hope to see you here more often.
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Vanya
July 20, 2017
@BR, “more acceptable” or “less deleterious” then? I’m not trying to be difficult but I’m not entirely sure why that matters. But this isn’t the hill I want to die on, so my apologies if I’m still misunderstanding and let’s move on.
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Naveen
July 20, 2017
Is it only me who does not get this nepotism debate at all? It is a private industry and what is so wrong if the owner of the industry provides a platform to their next of kin? I mean we give reservations in medicine based on the caste of birth…profession in which mediocrity slipping through will cause damage to people’s lives and families. In case of movies…nothing really gets affected… Once the movie is out…it is in our hands…if we like it…they deserve to be there whether they got it easy or not. And if we don’t…in an industry driven by economics they will go away eventually. So…I just feel it is Kangana who is bigging her achievements which are commendable by themselves….don’t have to point the people who have had it easy…as having it is easy wasn’t their choice either and let us not discredit their hard work and success for it.
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Prashil
July 21, 2017
Vanya, Doba, thank you for putting into words, all the smoke inside my head. The easy compartmentalisation Kangana Ranaut’s personal life gets into amazes me, no, disturbs me. Even when it is not about her, it goes on becoming about her. Some people have even prophesized she will go down the Parveen Babi way whatever that might be. Sigh.
As for this ‘joke’, a big Boo to KJo, Saif and Dhawan. Not funny, guys. Sure you can do better. And yes, too much hungama going on something so silly and we need to focus our energies on more urgent matters but I am glad they are getting a taste of their own medicine.
And BR, I still dont think KR has reached a place of privilege fully. If her upcoming movies don’t do well(I really hope they do!) she risks losing a lot more than any of the three men above. Despite boxoffice and/or critical failures, I dont see any of them shutting shops on their movie careers. We know how long Saif lasted before he made a decent movie… Kjo, lesser said the better. And Dhawan is not even that bad. And that makes K’s confidence (or arrogance) all the more fascinating, and the whole IIFA dig all the more puke inducing.
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Rahul
July 21, 2017
Two things I want to talk about – Punching up vs punching down in humor and sarcasm.
Kapil Sharma routinely punches down in his show – elderly spinsters, servants, wives etc are butt of his jokes. Nothing should be sacred in humor but it is useful to see where someone is punching down from a position of privilege to mock someone further down and to call it distasteful. Kangna may have privilege of her own but in this particular discussion about nepotism Karan and inc are most definitely punching down. The level of butthurt they have shown probably they already are ganging up against her behind the scenes and making it difficult for her to get a movie in the Bollywood insider type productions. (I just saw, Vanya has also touched upon this part)
Secondly, the small skit that they played – it would have been sarcastic if somehow in spite of their connections, they would have made some vague point about not getting benefit of it. But no, they just stated the obvious. There was no subtext to their “humor”. To me this is more criminal and idiotic than even punching down.
Thirdly, I am thankful nobody brought up the freedom of expression bogey. – (“Oh but Saif and Karan also deserve their freedom of expression no? “
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jussomebody
July 21, 2017
I am actually amazed about the part of this discussion revolving on who was vindictive, where and how. Kangana may be humourless, insecure, arrogant, opportunistic… Had an agenda, sure. But that doesn’t make what she said invalid or unimportant. That nepotism and inequality of initial opportunity exists is true, and Kangana spoke of it reflecting on her own past experience. Acknowledging it, wondering what one can do about it, whether it is avoidable, and so forth, as has been raised in this thread, is where the debate ought to go, not about her personality or agenda.
Also, what isn’t part of an agenda? Karan Johar’s funny, self deprecating book? Priyanka’s nonstop spiel about her self-confidence and journey to global domination (with no acknowledgement of her advantages, or the people who came before her or walk alongside her)? Which of these influential individuals here isn’t in control of the narrative that we are evaluating one against the other, and on the basis of what, their personalities? How many with narrative control have raised issues that matter, such as pay disparity? They may be doing so because they are or were personally affected, have an agenda, if you will, but at least these are things with significance for people beyond them, people at a disadvantage.
That joke though, was both an attack on a woman (for talking too much, ha, from a man who has his own show, who just can’t seem to stop talking, in general, and on this issue) as well as a cheap attempt to defend the practice without having engaged with it in any meaningful, non-petty way. The joke on Vidya Balan may have fit into a show filled with ridicule as well as self deprecation, I don’t know, but this one just seemed tasteless, terribly entitled, and worthy of outrage. Privilege everywhere needs to be challenged. Inequality of opportunity need not be categorized by occupation for us to decide which ones to fight. They are all telling about society, and all fights to fight.
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Madan
July 21, 2017
“Can we do away with nepotism completely?” – Of course not, but in KJ’s case it is very obvious how much of a nepotist he is by his reluctance to cast anybody in the lead who is not either (a) an established actor or (b) the beta/beti of a bada baap. And this is what Kangana took his case for, NOT that HE got to make films as the son of Yash Johar but he basically only casts family and friends in his films. Does he have a right to? Of course, but Kangana also has the right to criticise him for it and he should be prepared for such criticism if he makes such decisions. As you have pointed out, the top actresses rarely tend to be insiders (probably because looks aren’t as hereditary as maybe KJ would like) and yet KJ has only ever cast either established actresses or those like Alia Bhatt who are from film family. The only possible exception to this was Rani Mukherji who did have a hit earlier in 1998 (Ghulam) but I would still credit KJ for taking the risk to cast her. And over and above casting, she made a point about his attitude to outsiders, of mocking her for her English and being snooty. Though that is not nepotism, I found this complaint interesting and more credible as well. By the way, Anushka Sharma also accused him of molesting her and alleged that he did that to Jacqueline Fernandez as well. When I put that and his inability to get over the Kangana feud, I start to wonder whether his very openly gay demeanour is really a front for something else. To joke about it is one thing but asking Kangana to just leave the industry is the classic response of a threatened misogynist.
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Madan
July 21, 2017
@ Naveen: Yes, it is a private enterprise and they are ultimately entitled to their decisions. Just as Balachander is ‘entitled’ to plot with Vasanth/Suresh Krishna et al to dump Ilayaraja in favour of Deva. Doesn’t stop us from discussing that many, many years after the fact, does it?
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Anuja Chandramouli
July 21, 2017
Anu Warrior: “Also, having whipped Manikarnika right off under Ketan Mehta’s nose after having been in talks with him is Just. Not. Done.”
Now that you mention it, wasn’t there another controversy regarding Hansal Mehta’s Simran, where she insisted on additional story and writing credits using her clout to relegate the actual writer, Apurva Asrani to the sidelines? My heart bleeds for the poor dude because he got well and truly clobbered for speaking out. Hansal Mehta sided with Kangana and they really did a number on him.
These are just allegations but still it gives one the impression that like so many other celebs venerated by their adoring fans, Kangana also has feet of clay and can dish it out but certainly cannot take it.
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sanjana
July 21, 2017
I always wondered why the privileged ones dont go for medicine or IIT. They mostly go for mass communication or MBA. That means they are not academically inclined most of the time.
Those who want to act have examples of Nawazuddin, Irrfan, Rajkumar Rao etc.
Those who crave for glamour and fame than acting make more noise.
Kangana has become the privileged one and she is getting support everywhere. She is talented and also wants to make her mark as a big star. She has succeeded and let us congratulate her for making a special space for herself.
Kjo is the favourite punching bag for being not man enough, for being the friend of the rich and the mighty, for dishing out rosy films and for being eveywhere. He is making it worse for himself by overdoing.
Both of them have some issues and they both come with some baggage which cant be overlooked while passing judgments. Both are sensitive and use media to vent out.
Let them concentrate on their work.
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Amit Joki
July 21, 2017
With all this nepotism thing going on, has anyone ever looked at the other side of the coin? Every successful star kid’s success will at one time or the other be attributed to nepotism. I mean it wasn’t their fault to have shared a privileged womb, was it?
Privilege has its say everywhere. I for one come under Open Category and with a reasonable cut off of 188 but some other kid with BC/MBC/SC/ST with a cut off of what is considerably less than mine will have an easier shot at good colleges. It is you could say, “caste-based nepotism”.
This is equivalent to having a break easier. But what they become is left entirely to their skills. Also there’s nothing you can really do about the nepotism thing. What are you wanting? Say Nawazuddin Siddique has a son. Directors roam around him all the time and naturally come to meet with his son. Only if they see “something” of an actor do they even start looking at him seriously. You cannot order them, like, “Hey man! Don’t look at their sons/daughters. Hold an audition and give me the chance instead, don’t let that kid have a break at it however talented that brat might be because come on! It’s Nepotism!!! I’ll sue you!”
Also, it is more ofen that the successful star kids that always get called for nepotism. KJo has been hugely successful with his films. You can’t come out now and put the nepotism thing out. That narrative seems reasonable when he his first film flops, second does too and he is able to find the producer for his third. Not when he has been shelling out successful films consistently.
Honestly I have never seen an outrage against Abhishek Bachchan, Athiya Shetty or Hema Malini’s daughters because come on! You won’t grab headlines calling them out.
It is like you want to discredit the successful star kids by coming out with Nepotism thing. Also, I don’t think it is nepotism when parents bankroll their kids’ films. You’re not getting him a job with your influence, you’re creating it with your own damn money risking everything. If the kid happens to be a great actor, people will still call him a product of nepotism but if it flops no one bats an eye. Hypocrites.
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GODZ
July 21, 2017
“But I do think nepotism is less of an issue in the film industry (or the arts in general) than elsewhere, because being a star child can only get you a foot in the door”
Lets see some data here from Telugu Flim industry
Although I can see you point, Below are the list of actors in telugu industry and whether they have a flim background or not
Akkineni Nagarjuna – Yes
Allu Arjun – Yes
Jr NTR – Yes
Pawan Kalyan – Yes
Mahesh Babu – Yes
Ravi Teja – No
Ram charan – Yes
Prabhas – Yes
Ram charan Teja – Yes
Chiranjeevi – No
Venkatesh – Yes
Naga Chaitanya – Yes
Nani – No
Navdeep
Allari Naresh – Yes
Rana Dagguati – Yes
Nara Rohit – Yes
In the above list, Except for very few, Almost all of them are from cinema background. Clearly, their seems to be a total dominance of an entire industry by very few families. Yes. without people support no one survives. But You don’t need Marlon Brando Acting or Michael Jackson dance movies to be a peoples hero. They have very low standards and they can able to meet to make their ends meet. It’s very obvious that there is clear Favourism of opportunities to these star kids and they control every aspect of the film industry. Downplaying the nepotism/Denial of opportunity in film industry is like killing Dreams of numerous talented man. May sound dramatic. But the statement is clear “This is our land”
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vinjk
July 21, 2017
Totally agree with Amit Joki here. If these star kids were getting projects only because of their privileged background it would have made sense. But Karan Johar and his lot has proved their worth.
To me their privileged background is more like a referral you give with job applications.
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Honest Raj (formerly 'V'enkatesh)
July 21, 2017
Comparing nepotism with reservations is a classic case of false equivalence. Two of my batchmates, who got admitted through management quota, in college had a tough time with academics. One dropped out during the second year while the other gave a try till the final year before eventually dropping out. In three years time, they became “heads” of their family-owned educational institutions, which include a couple of engineering colleges as well.
A medical PG equivalent would probably be ten times more privileged than these two guys. Despite reservations and various other quotas (private colleges are still in the majority) we’re facing acute shortage of doctors. This article throws some light on the issue:
http://www.hindustantimes.com/india-news/healthcare-crisis-short-of-5-lakh-doctors-india-has-just-1-for-1-674-people/story-SZepTyjJ78WgOVIo93tBVK.html
About nepotism in politics, didn’t Indira Gandhi manage to “overpower” her privilege and make a name for herself? In film, you have Raj Kapoor!
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Honest Raj (formerly 'V'enkatesh)
July 21, 2017
GODZ: In the Telugu industry, more than nepotism caste plays a major role. Even in Chiranjeevi’s case, he became a STAR only after he married Allu Rama Lingaiah’ s daughter.
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rothrocks
July 21, 2017
@ Amit Joki There is indeed no issue if the star puts the money where the mouth is for his son’s films. But that’s not what’s at work here. David Dhawan did not produce Student of the Year and yet Varun waltzed into a lead role for a big banner film, just like that. Do you know how many years Irfan Khan or Vidya Balan had to slog in TV/ads before they got their break? Outsiders don’t get a lead role just like that unless they are very lucky or decided to sacrifice honour for a role (if you get the drift). If our industry too gave roles strictly based on auditions, film family would find it harder to break through because they would have to prove themselves against outsiders hungry for success. Hollywood has its star sons too but far fewer of them and has a wide variety of actors and actresses and is generally very happening. Why? Because they actially value talent.Maybe Kangana did not bring out all these facets of the issue but she should be applauded for bringing it up, something that more well heeled outsiders like SRK haven’t dared to.
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sanjana
July 21, 2017
Acting itself is not enough. The actors need some aura too. Especially if it is a lead role. This aura is readymade stuff with star kids. The outsider is a relative term. Now Srk is outsider for all purposes. If he promotes his son instead of some talented outsider, then he also becomes part of the system. Even if it is his money, he is indirectly pushing his son or daughter.
Mani Ratnam also opted for stars or star sons when he ventured into bollywood.
Models and beauty queens are also roped in to provide extra buzz.
Outsiders were given lead roles in Lagaan and Swades. But they did not last.
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Nitin Sundar (@knittins)
July 21, 2017
Dei… This much and all people are ranting about this nepotism issue, then how on earth do these idiotic movies starring useless, entitled star-kids keep getting released week in and week out? Arjun Kapoor and Athia Shetty are back with a movie this weekend – I mean, who watches this stuff to make this business so viable that this industry peddling dummy piece star spawnage keeps rolling week after week, month after month, year after year…?
If you really want to take a stand against nepotism, then VOTE WITH YOUR FEET, dammit! If you don’t, and have no qualms toting out 300 bucks every weekend to watch Abhishek Bachchan’s, Kareena Kapoor’s Sonakshi Sinha’s next release, then clearly you have made peace with the fact that star kids have it easy. Your opinion on the crass stuff that happened at IIFA counts for nothing, since you will go and watch Karan Johar’s next. You are the problem. You make the damn industry nepotistic.
On the other hand, you would never take your kids to a doctor’s kid without reliable credentials would you?
End of rant. Sorry.
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Amit Joki
July 21, 2017
rothrocks: A quick Wikipedia search got me this: Both Varun Dhawan & Siddarth Malhotra (who’s an outsider) were Assistant Directors of Karan Johar for his 2010 flick “My Name Is Khan” and two years later, both make their acting debut with Student Of The Year directed by Karan Johar himself, what does that say?
I agree with the rest of your comment but you can find my response below.
‘V’enkatesh: Two of my batchmates, who got admitted through management quota, in college had a tough time with academics. One dropped out during the second year while the other gave a try till the final year before eventually dropping out. In three years time, they became “heads” of their family-owned educational institutions, which include a couple of engineering colleges as well.
I don’t see why it matters. It is not like to manage an institution you’d need to have to solve complex differentials or integrations or go through Maxwell’s theory and all. The tricks of the trade will be passed on by their parents.
Their parents worked their asses off to earn their children the privilege. Privilege is always earned. Yash Johar worked his ass off so that KJo could be the privileged one. What did Kangana’s parents do? If you want to topple the king to his throne, you get there by working hard, plotting conspiracies, not complaining that the king sat there only because his father was one too. Because at some time or the other going up the line of succession, some forefather would have fought for the privilege that their descendants continue to enjoy. If you want it, fight for it, don’t whine about it.
Despite reservations and various other quotas (private colleges are still in the majority) we’re facing acute shortage of doctors
Basically the same would be the case for the film industry, if KJo, Varun, Alia were all outrightly ridiculous. It is just in the example you mentioned, the nepotism (in that politicians provide favours to their castes to get a hold onto their vote banks) exists but the beneficiaries aren’t skilled enough to take the advantage of the privilege they’re given, whereas it’s not entirely true in Bollywood, which is why nepotism comes into the play.
In the fields of Engineering, Medicine and all, most of the time, you just “work with it”. Whereas with films, every good film you give is “a contribution”. Their children are therefore privileged to have a right to continue the legacy; whether they’re fit to do so is quite another question; if they’re not, they will become AB Jr, else they become KJo.
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nikkie1602
July 21, 2017
Hello…have very recently discovered this amazing space and have thoroughly enjoyed going through the various threads..and am now daring to venture with a comment. So here are a few of my thoughts on this subject :
The nepotism debate isn’t only about how the star kid has it easy because of their legacy. It has also do with all that they have which the struggling folk can only hope for. So it is just not the films aspect of it…it is how star kids are already celebrities before they enter the industry, how they have easy and privileged access to all other things that go into the making of a film star- personal stylists, designers vying to put them on the ramp, the many many interviews, the gym honed body and what not. This is not to say that filmmakers must not take on star kids. The key word here is ‘opportunity’…level the playing field to the maximum. And thus the least star kids can do is to acknowledge their blessings…talking about how they have it hard because they have a name to live up to is in bad taste.
Equating nepotism with caste-based reservation is a little ridiculous. One is a matter of privilege and the other is of affirmative action.
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jussomebody
July 21, 2017
(Wish I had proofread my previous comment and sounded less belligerent, but ah well.)
Just want to say that drawing a parallel with reservations is wrong, outright. What reservations seek to do is ensure equality of opportunity for people from backward classes, who haven’t had easy access to education and employment for generations. We could argue about the creamy layer, whether reservations at the college level make sense without ensuring quality school education that equips students for competitive colleges and the job market, and so forth, but that would be another argument. The point is that reservations intend to assure to communities, opportunities they have been denied historically. (Accessing reserved seats certainly isn’t privilege, it is affirmative action that attempts to right historical wrongs. It has not been easy for Dalits to access education and dignified jobs for centuries. Comparing cutoffs is a facile, rather limited way of understanding advantage.) Also, reservations only seek to move towards equality of opportunity, not of outcome.
The contention is that nepotism does the opposite: offers opportunities, at least, initial opportunities and too easily, to the relatives and friends of the powerful. Not saying reservations are the solution in the movies, only saying that this privilege must be scrutinized and engaged with.
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rothrocks
July 21, 2017
@ Amit Joki: Yes, I am aware that they both worked under him as Asst Directors. As I said, sometimes an outsider can get lucky and perhaps Siddharth Malhotra did as he is not a particularly amazing actor. As for the rest of your post, do you realise it tantamounts to an argument for the preservation of class and privilege a la British style entitled nobles who don’t have to move a finger because they were born into wealth and status. Of course, people like KJ had parents who bequeathed them with privilege. That privilege by itself doesn’t make him more special than another human being nor does the lack of privilege make Kangana worthless. Are you saying it is somehow Kangana’s fault that she was not born with a silver spoon? Wait, is it Ilayaraja’s fault that he was born in a village rather than some upmarket locality of Chennai? You see where this is going? I totally get that there is no level playing field in reality. That doesn’t mean I am going to criticize someone who has spoken out against the reality and struck a blow for the cause of change.
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nikkie1602
July 21, 2017
Amitjoki: So basically nepotism is here to stay and we better deal with eh? Why is it a problem if one talks about overhauling the system and bring in change that benefits all? And about the whole what did kangana’s parents do bit…you do realise how problematic it is right? You are essentially saying that since her parents did not raise her to be a film star she shouldn’t… That we shouldn’t dream big, that we deserve the troubles since we were born into it? Yes the film fraternity parents worked hard…but so do others as well with what means are available to them…they deserve as many opportunities as the film kids. It isn’t their sole right…
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Honest Raj (formerly 'V'enkatesh)
July 21, 2017
Amit Joki: Their parents worked their asses off to earn their children the privilege. Privilege is always earned.
Since you seem to know more about their backgrounds than I do, allow me to shed some light on it. Their families (rightly) credit their successes to go their grandfathers, who were landlords in western TN. And, they belong to “dominant backward” castes that are entitled to reservation benefits.
Also, since you think that privilege is always earned, why should there be a need for feminism in the first place? Going by your logic, ‘male-privilege’ should be a myth (men-who-worked-their-asses-off should never be blamed because women in the past never bothered to come out of their kitchens). I’m asking this specifically to you because you seem to be a feminist-in-the-making (at least from my observation).
Basically the same would be the case for the film industry, if KJo, Varun, Alia were all outrightly ridiculous. It is just in the example you mentioned, the nepotism (in that politicians provide favours to their castes to get a hold onto their vote banks) exists but the beneficiaries aren’t skilled enough to take the advantage of the privilege they’re given, whereas it’s not entirely true in Bollywood, which is why nepotism comes into the play.
See, my point about IG and RK should make it amply clear that I’m NOT entirely against nepotism. Take Mani Ratnam and Dhanush from Kollywood – both “beneficiaries” of nepotism. Like KJo and Alia (to some extent), they too have no issues admitting their privilege. That’s the point I was trying to make. As for the last point, do you really have some data (not anecdotal ones)?
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Srinivas R
July 21, 2017
@Amit, in an ideal world, every role should be auditioned for. Alia Bhatt got there through audition ( apparently, one among 1000s of applicants). Any field suffers when the entry barrier is too high and worse restricted to a few insiders. As mentioned in one of the comments above Telugu cinema seems to be a classic case where the industry’s standard seems to have been pulled down because of the capability of the star kids. Imagine the kind of roles and movies Randeep Hooda, Irfan Khan and Nawazuddin would be playing but for being outsiders. A movie like 2 states would have been far better with an actor to match Alia Bhatt. Sidarth Malhotra and Katrina Kaif are confusing cases though, no family connection, no acting skill, but still get picked for marquee movies.
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dagalti (@dagalti)
July 21, 2017
The hen was blind
The stew is good
Weekend is nigh
Arinaru Basho
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tejas
July 21, 2017
The first deals with privilege. In comedy, I believe the rule of thumb is to target those at or above your level on the privilege totem pole. In this case, there’s privilege in being successful/wealthy and from gender.
This, this, and a hundred times this. This is why Michael Richards shouldn’t even have started to talk about African-American calling them “niggers” in his routine. And the backlash he received was perfectly justified. It’s like Chris Rock says and I paraphrase from memory, “I get to make jokes about niggers, you don’t”.
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Uncouth Village Youth
July 21, 2017
I’m in principle against nepotism – you can see my earlier posts in the Remo thread. But I’m amused by the hypocrisy of the Middle Class, when they have been products of nepotism themselves. Most of my friends including me, had the full financial backing of our parents when it came to the education arms race. We started out with the best possible weapons – coaching classes, best study guides, best schools etc. I’m not even mentioning the fact that I had access to a stable household, food, money, support system etc. I was aware of the safety nets available so I could take more risks. A lot of my friends get money, referrals, lever pulling from their parents even now, after being in the middle management for years, while for many who started out as first graduates in their family, even a car is a distant dream. I also have a problem, when star kids (and their fans – AKhan/Vijay/Dhanush fans I’m looking at you) claim to have reached where they are only because of their hard work. Boss, you started a 100m race at the 50m mark, so shut up and be thankful for the head start you got. It is indeed a unfair world out there – unless you impose strict-true communism, abolish land ownership and come up with oppressive estate tax (but that is for a different forum), nepotism is always going to be there in form or the other.
So how do we make sure that the world doesn’t get into a cesspool of nepotism – support people who are outsiders so they are not discouraged, in taking the plunge. I agree it is not as straightforward as I claim to be – but we can all make a start. I stopped visiting a doctor,after midway through an eye exam he asked his son to take over. I shop at small grocers than the big supermarkets, even if it is more difficult. I visit mid-range eateries – the numerous bhavans and chettinad restaurants that dot Chennai rather than blindly going to HSB/DTK every single time. Now, I’m no saint/communist – I indulge myself and my family often, but I try to make a change at least a few times. I remember Kanimozhi, in of the debates asked why do you guys vote for us again and again if it’s a problem – the crux of the argument is that, it is the public who has to kick them out.
Slightly off topic – What makes me truly happy is that, sports with all its fixing,doping issues has managed to stay clear of nepotism. You simply cant play Rohan Gavaskar, Binny in enough matches and then make them a better player- like a few star kids mysteriously turned into ‘terrific actors’ after a few films. You cannot make Arjun Tendulkar play for India by featuring his ‘exploits’ in the news regularly. I also rest assured that, I will not be seeing Federer kids play in center court in all probability – while on Federer, Federerphiles here rejoice – what a wonderful year – GOAT – or should I say male GOAT to be PC 😀
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Aditya (Gradwolf)
July 21, 2017
Why is “foot in the door” used so flippantly like it is not a big deal at all? Someone mentioned Jim Sarbh explaining to Harshavardhan Kapoor about privilege and what that brings during a newcomers roundtable and what a huge difference that can make. He talks about how an outsider wouldn’t audition for the lead part – Sobhita cuts in to say she first did for a detergent brand – when Harshavardhan talks about missing out the lead parts of Life of Pi and The Night Of and Bhavesh Joshi (in 2012; today I believe he is doing the film), so nepotism does not play that big a helping hand. Which is simply not true. I am not sure “foot in the door” in this context can ever be prefixed with “only”. How many doors have Arjun Kapoor and Tiger Shroff got so far?
Here is the video and the relevant part is from 22:50 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gPshbSHi0C8
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Anu Warrier
July 21, 2017
People are conflating two issues, at least with regard to what I said. Let me be very clear. I may think Kangana is arrogant; I may think she has an agenda; I may have a personal bias against her. But put, say, my favourite Deepika in this context, and I would have said the same things.
However, I am not and have never defended Karan’s ‘joke’. I don’t consider it one, and I thought he was hitting below the belt. I’m surprised because from what I know of the man, it is very unlike him. And I’m disappointed.
Oh, yes, nepotism is definitely around – not just in the film industry, but everywhere else. It is what gets the star kids their first break and perhaps, a few more films after. There are two reasons for this. One, of course, is the parent pulling in favours. Or bankrolling them. The second, and the most important, is the fact that the film industry, particularly, runs on economics.
If you are making a film with newcomers, who would the audience rather see? SRK’s son Aryan? Or someone no one has ever heard of? Sridevi’s daughter? Or the girl next door? Whether we like it or not, we are the part of the problem.
Also, ‘privilege’. There are many ways in which that is used. How many of you commenting here have either ‘passed on a resume’ or had a friend/ friend of a friend ‘refer’ you for a job? Al things being equal, who do you think gets the job? The rank newcomer, or the person referred by someone of good standing in the company? It is ‘networking’ when we do it. And of course, not nepotism, because we aren’t using our parents’/siblings’ good graces to get a job. But we are using someone…
Should we move to a society where only pure talent counts? Oh, damn it, yes! Are we there yet? Not by a long shot, we aren’t.
But at the end of the day, perhaps because I’m not in the business of film-making, I couldn’t care two hoots as long as they can give me good content. Whereas when a thoroughly inexperienced Kushner is made chief-of-all-he-surveys, I fear for the fate of the planet.
And if this long screed hasn’t already made it clear – Karan is clearly in the wrong; to me, his biggest crime, other than his unexpectedly thin skin, is that the ‘joke’ wasn’t funny at all.
(‘Unexpectedly’, because.the man has taken a lot of bashing for allegedly being gay, for being fat, for not coming out as gay, for… you name it. He’s taken it on his chin, and laughed at himself as much as he does at the others.)
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Anu Warrier
July 21, 2017
Also, come to think of it, it is not just nepotism that plays into the starkids being signed; it is the concept of working with people you are familiar with, that you are comfortable with – and this is true of every creative space. Why do music directors work with certain lyricists? Why do directors work only with certain cinematographers? Why do most directors find a couple of actors with whom they share a vibe? Shyam Benegal had a few actors that he consstently repeated; Raj Kapoor had his team – SJ, Shailendra, Hasrat, Radhu Karmakar, Mukesh, Lata; Naushad worked mostly with Shakeel Badayuni; Satyan Anthikad -Priyadarshan- Sreenivasan- Mohanlal were a quartet even the lay audience knew.
For a lot of these starkids, they grow up on the sets of their parents. They know the directors/producers/cameramen/whatever. The comfort level that they share with the starkids parents spills over to the kids.
Let me put it this way – if one of us is a fledgling author whose parents are publishers, or are friendly with one, don’t you think we would get an edge over the thousands of manuscripts that are handed into publishing office? Oh, yes, that is also privilege, alright. Only, when we do it, we don’t call it nepotism. 🙂
Let’s face it, most of us here are children of privilege. We are here because our parents gave us that platform. People like Alia and Ranbeer may have been lucky to get their breaks because they were born with silver spoons (a fact that neither of them deny), but they have also proven their right to be where they are. They are not where they are because of their lineage; they may have indeed got their initial breaks because of that, but they are where they are now because they are talented and they work bloody hard to stay there.
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Anu Warrier
July 21, 2017
@Amit – please don’t conflate nepotism and privilege with reservation. I don’t know how successful our reservation policies are, and I have seen that being abused as well, but at the core of it, reservation is an attempt to right centuries of oppression, of rights and privileges that have been denied to sections of the populatiion because they weren’t born into the right strata of society.
Speaking of which, I would rather see reservation based on economic background rather than caste or religion; because a successful Ezhava businessman’s daughter certainly can afford to pay medical college fees.
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brangan
July 21, 2017
Anu Warrier: If you are making a film with newcomers, who would the audience rather see? SRK’s son Aryan? Or someone no one has ever heard of? Sridevi’s daughter? Or the girl next door? Whether we like it or not, we are the part of the problem.
This is kind of where I was going. Along with the other factors you brought up — comfort levels, etc. Great set of comments.
No is saying that this is an ideal situation. People talk about films because it’s so visible there, but it’s everywhere.
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Madan
July 21, 2017
“You cannot make Arjun Tendulkar play for India by featuring his ‘exploits’ in the news regularly.” – I fear we may get there eventually what with the incredibly long rope being given to a certain batsman who is nicknamed talent because he is rumoured to possess it in abundance but generally fails to bring it when it really counts. Cricket used to be absolutely brutal earlier; somebody like Pravin Amre was denied chances for God knows what reasons. Now it’s swung to the other extreme. This country is always extreme metal only ra, no balance.
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Madan
July 21, 2017
@ Anu Warrier: I broadly agree that it is not practical that each and every choice in the film industry be driven by merit because it is a people business and comfort level in collaboration is important. But again I can’t help point to the example of Hollywood. It seems to run more on ‘networking’ than ‘nepotism’. Come to think of it, that could be said for the politics of that country as well, notwithstanding the Bush and Clinton families. Yes, a well entrenched insider can protect his/her turf but entry for outsiders does not seem to be so difficult as it is here. As filmmakers like to say, films are a reflection of society and it is not very surprising that our film industry increasingly resembles our dynastic politics. Again, this was not the case in the 1950s or so when a bunch of outsiders got together to dream big, as did the politicians of the time too. So it is very much a part of the Indian norm to revert to nepotism, just like a businessman grooming his son to take over the business from him rather than trusting his loyal lieutenant.
But that is exactly why I don’t think Kangana is out of line to point it out and why I find KJ’s masterful jugglery to dodge the accusation very amusing. She’s pointed out a very Indian problem and I think we should be honest enough to accept it. OK, maybe it’s not possible to change it in a hurry (what gets changed fast in India anyway) but it’s still a problem even if not a very pressing one for a third world country. I read the defensiveness of some of the participants here as more confirmation that she hit a raw nerve with that one, just like how Ilayaraja fans erupt when I question why he let Bhava spoil so many of his songs. The N word is literally nuclear in India because it makes us feel very guilty.
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brangan
July 21, 2017
DNA Exclusive: Saif Ali Khan pens an open letter over the ‘Nepotism rocks’ brouhaha during IIFA 2017
http://www.dnaindia.com/bollywood/report-saif-ali-khan-pens-an-open-letter-over-the-neopitism-rocks-brouhaha-during-iifa-2017-2508860/amp
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Aadhy
July 21, 2017
I just couldn’t stop rolling my eyes when I saw nepotism in cinema compared to the reservation system.
Anu : Good points. But I have to disagree on this.
Speaking of which, I would rather see reservation based on economic background rather than caste or religion; because a successful Ezhava businessman’s daughter certainly can afford to pay medical college fees.
People were oppressed based on their castes (which in turn were formed from the kind of jobs people used to do) and not on their economic statuses. So it’s not just economic upliftment that reservation aims to bring, but also social upliftment, to have a representation of people from oppressed communities in all kinds of jobs, to abolish manual scavenging and much more. Someone born into an upper caste, where his/her parents and possibly grandparents have had access to education, is already privileged. As opposed to say someone from a Paraiyar community, whose parents, grand, great grandparents etc.. were denied access to schools for centuries together. A rich, land-owning Paraiyar is a rarity, as an upper caste Tamil living in slums. Reservation based on economy would mean we are brushing the whole history of oppression under the carpet. A privileged upper caste person, who is poor because of reasons other than oppression, does not need extra privileges. A person who’s poor because of centuries of oppression needs extra privileges. And if this system means it would benefit one or two already uplifted SC/STs, so be it. We haven’t attained equality yet, the ratio is still skewed, discrimination is still abound, although in much subtler and intellectual ways. For the middle castes falling under OBC, where the uplifted are quite more in number, we already have the creamy layer, which is fair.
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Madan
July 21, 2017
Saif Ali Khan says, “Nepotism in dynastic politics is a well-known and unspoken truth. It’s the same in business. But nobody talks about that. ” – Yeah sure, nobody except a cacophonous election campaign built largely around dynasty with a very colourful word used to describe the heir apparent who was and is perpetually missing in action. Too funny.
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Anu Warrier
July 21, 2017
Madan, nepotism has always been there in US politics; are you kiddng me? Kennedy, Bush, Clinton, Trump on the national front; on the state fronts, many, many more. As for Hollywood, don’t make the mistake of thinking they are any better. The Barrymores and Fondas are Hollywood dynasties. Off the top of my head, Michael Douglas, Angelina Jolie, Nicolas Cage, Sofia Coppola, Jamie Lee Curtis, Carrie Fisher, Emma Roberts, Rumer Willis, Dakota Johnson, Willow and Jayden Smith… oh, so many more.
See this for a more nuanced take on the subject:
https://www.theatlantic.com/entertainment/archive/2013/06/the-big-upside-of-hollywood-nepotism/277246/
I don’t think Kangana was out of line to point it out. The platform she did it on, the way she did it, was petty – at least for me. (Also, it doesn’t help that she turns around and abuses her power either.)
That said, I find Karan’s behaviour after this rather unsettling – he has been pretty honest about his privilege, and his ignorance about the less-privileged. He’s spoken honestly about how he does not relate to certain things and how he lives in a bubble. I wonder why the nepotism remark cut so deeply that he’s still trying to defend or justify it. I’d really like to ask him that – ‘Why does this bother you so much?’
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Anu Warrier
July 21, 2017
Aadhy, fair point. It’s just that I see a heck of a lot of estate owners from my state take advantage of their SC/ST status to get coveted seats in professional colleges. I agree that we cannot do away with reservation, I was just musing about the economics of it all.
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Madan
July 21, 2017
@ Anu Warrier: I already mentioned Bush-Clinton, left out the Kennedys only because it’s in the past now. Also mentioned Douglas/Sheen upthread. I am familiar with those examples. For all that, the roster of top actors in Hollywood isn’t overrun by star sons and that is the point I am making. They have their flaws but outsiders have a better chance to shine there. Bollywood wasn’t always quite so obsessed with star sons and daughters but the numbers have really swelled over the years.
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Madan
July 21, 2017
“I wonder why the nepotism remark cut so deeply that he’s still trying to defend or justify it. ” – Maybe similar to how the Indian media closed ranks and got on the defensive during Radia-gate. Because maybe the allegation has some truth, some merit to it and it makes them uncomfortable. The defensiveness comes through in Saif’s open letter too. Saying film industry is the least nepotist is a stretch, especially for someone who was the son of a great cricketer. As Uncouth Village Youth said above, sports is where nepotism is least prevalent because it has the most objective measurement of performance. If you don’t win, no excuses can cover it up. Of course, there’s still the ‘talent’ excuse…but even that depends on the player showing some evidence of it.
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Anu Warrier
July 21, 2017
Madan, the top roster in Hindi films is also not dynastic – of the Khans, SRK is an outsider. Akshay Kumar is an outsider. The three top heroines – Deepika, Priyanka, Anushka, Katrina – are all outsiders. Kangana and Vidya. Richa, Huma, Aditi Rao Hydari. Previously Aiswarya, Preity, Madhuri, Juhi, Sridevi before her.
You can’t argue that even among the ones who came in because of filmi connections – Aamir, Salman, Saif, Ranbir – et al, do not deserve the position they are in, today. The Khans, particularly, have sustained their career for three decades now.
The obsession with star sons and daughters – is it really the industry’s fault, or is it the media’s? I don’t see SRK promoting Aryan or Sridevi promoting Jahnvi. I see the media poring over every single thing the kids do, whether it is trawling their Instagram accounts or following them around to report on whether Sara Ali Khan is already at odds with Jahnvi.
Do these kids have access to the industry that few outsiders will? Of course! But will they sustain a career just because of their parents? Not at all. Just look at all the starkids whose films have bombed.The ones who get to the top are the ones who have a certain something – whether it is talent or charisma or sheer screen presence.
Do you think any management school graduate, for instance, will have the same access to business as the scions of the business houses who grow up in that atmosphere? In any sphere of activity, from time immemorial, craft and art have been passed down through families. It’s not that an outsider cannot get in, it is always going to be easier for the insider to access that knowledge.
What I’m saying is that the ‘nepotism’ issue is not as black and white as people think it is, certainly not in the arts where, finally, you stand or fall based upon what you bring to the table.
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GODZ
July 21, 2017
“I see a heck of a lot of estate owners from my state take advantage of their SC/ST status to get coveted seats in professional colleges”
I get you point and There are always People who break the system and lack of a better word steal other foods to swell their already swollen bellies. But I hope you do agree that these reservations exist in the field that requires high Cognitive and thinking abilities. And I hope you do believe in Evolution and this particular set of Groups(Not all but most of them) are not even aware of those basic cognitive abilities for generations(memorize, understand, pattern, thinking etc) blame it on the system, social structure, geography etc. So when the society becomes knowledge based, these group of people needs some kick start because they are absolutely devoid of these abilities. But make no mistake, those cognitive abilities can be taught, trained and mastered for them. it’s absolutely not Rocket science.
Unfortunately, no Sane Government will do those things as it will hurt them politically because then everyone will start asking questions and then people will ask “Why cannot we enforce two terms Only Policy ” or “why are you always nominating you son when a more deserved candidates exist?(Critical thinking)”. Reservations are like you spray fragrance in a room with a dead rat. It’s not a solution. But it needs to be there to remind us of the actual problem which is unfortunately here the burden of our past actions and systems.The permanent solution is to train that sector of people, give them sufficient tools, train them, statistically log their abilities, make it a level playing field and then get rid of reservation altogether. This may take even a century but this will end. So You need to see it from a more humane perspective on this.
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Amit Joki
July 21, 2017
Being the only OC in the class having friends who really aren’t “backward” but for in the name of the castes, I perhaps misconstrued that nepotism and reservations are same, overcome by emotions with the counselling being held within a week.
rothrocks: I am not defending Nepotism. I am just saying how things are.
That privilege by itself doesn’t make him more special than another human being nor does the lack of privilege make Kangana worthless.
I never suggested that it does. I just observed that the privileged ones are privileged for a reason, of which KJ can do nothing about, so stop vilifying him (I am saying this to Kangana).
nikkie1602: You are essentially saying that since her parents did not raise her to be a film star she shouldn’t…
I never remotely even suggested this. I just said that KJo’s parents did the hard work in the film industry to bequeath him his privilege. KJo is not answerable for this, is he? What I wanted to say when I asked, “What did Kangana’s parents do?” was that, her parents had not earned the privilege so she should be fighting for it (and she’s successfully attained the privilege too).
To put it more succintly, I was just saying that KJo’s parents had the privilege which they could pass to KJo, and since Kangana doesn’t (because her parents aren’t filmy), she should fight to get the privilege (which she got) rather than complaining that KJo has it easy.
KJo had it easy because his parents had it tough. Somebody has to pass through the tough phase and in Kangana’s case it is herself who has to.
Anu Warrier: Excellent point regarding reservations. Yes, it was my bad to have coalesced those two. Also excellent earlier comments!
‘V’enkatesh: Since you asked me specifically, male-privilige is definitely not a myth. But it WAS earned. But first, think like someone from ages past. Early men were the breadwinners. They took the risk of hunting wild animals. Made a shelter and safe guarded their family. All these was because these things required brute strength and hence born was the male-privilege and is unfortunately imbibed in the common culture.
But come to present, the male-privilege is irrelevant because the jobs we do now are more intellectual than ever. Females are no longer the secondary now. Women are equalling men in nearly all tasks they’re venturing in.
But not many people accept this fact and therefore feminism is needed so that we could straighten such men.
As for the data, I have one straight off the top of my head: Dhanush and Vijaykant’s son. May I add Vijaykant’s son is far better looking than the Thulluvatho Ilamai Dhanush?
Srinivas R: To be honest, when I something that’s an inside affair but is on the web, I always get sarcastic replies in the form of “You know him better than himself” and such things.
So why could not Alia Bhatt’s fairy tale of being selected from a thousand be anything but PR? Also she got to play the child artist in Sangharsh so who knows?
When I say Siddarth got his break, he is lucky but Alia gets selected from a thousands?
Nepotism exists. But their products are usually making worthless films. Ranveer, Deepika, Priyanka, Anushka Sharma are the top tier actors. Actors like Nawazuddin Siddique, Irrfan Khan are increasingly being noticed and casted in films worth their mettle. I’d shudder to think a film with Arjun Kapoor in mind was offered to Nawazuddin.
Uncouth Village Mouth: Someone like the 16-year-old Dhanush would never even have the opportunity to enter the audition hall and would probably be insulted by the watchmen like in the movie Shamitabh. So I thank nepotism because it created a “level-playing” field for him. Keep looking 🙂
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Honest Raj (formerly 'V'enkatesh)
July 21, 2017
Aadhy: Since I cannot ‘like’ your comment, one word: excellent!
My views about caste-based reservations have drastically changed over the past few years. When we talk about ‘economy’ replacing ‘caste’, it again goes back to the question of why reservation (or rather ‘positive discrimination’) was introduced in the first place? Was it meant to be a poverty-alleviation program? Heck no! As explained by others, it was introduced to provide a level-playing-field for people who were oppressed for centuries. The problem with economy-based reservations is that economic-equality can NEVER be attained in any society (not even at the theoretical level); social equality, on the other hand, can SOMEWHAT be achieved! Affirmative action was introduced to address the latter. Simply put, reservations were meant to be a “necessary” evil and not a “never-ending” one!
UVY: Since we’re also discussing about privilege and now that you brought up Gavaskar, I’m being reminded of the “fisherman” episode from his bio:
http://www.wisdenindia.com/wisden-india-lite/sunil-gavaskar-8-little-known-facts/215537
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jussomebody
July 21, 2017
So I think everyone on this thread recognizes that nepotism, or nepotism-like practices exist everywhere: it’s why this conversation has seamlessly incorporated examples from other fields from the very beginning. Training your eyes on privilege should force one to train their eyes on themselves, and call privilege what it is, without making excuses. One is definitely privileged to be participating in this conversation for starters. We have the necessary social and cultural capital to: we are all English speaking, able to understand BR most of the time (:D), able to participate in an online forum, presumably went to good schools, etc. My screaming hoarse about someone’s privilege does not mean I don’t recognize my own. Some of us are forced to confront our privileges every single day at work, where we are in the business of working for equal opportunity.
Which is precisely why this nepotism conversation is important. Privilege does not exist in neat little boxes sorted by profession. Its omnipresence tells us something about the society we live in. We are all imbricated in it, and complicit, through the choices we make, the content we consume, the things we allow. We are absolutely a part of the problem. So, questioning privilege involves exactly the opposite of comfort, DISCOMFORT, in order for us to move towards more fair practices, even if they may not guarantee the same outcomes. Every opportunity granted and gained unfairly or automatically implies a denial of that opportunity for another. The outcome could swing either way in theory: the so-called dilution of merit and standard can be as much a product of reservations as it could be of nepotism. So why not try and pick the more fair practice? I am not sure if this is the answer, and I am trying to think through this in the film industry… could the money being pumped into yet another Tiger Shroff dud be channelled into making perhaps multiple smaller projects starring legit talents like Vikram Massey and Jim Sarbh? Take my money. (Of course, if Tiger remains on this course, the market would automatically shut him out. We are only talking of access and initial opportunities.)
Obviously I am not talking about the Ranbirs and Alias, calling for a dismissal of talent just because it comes from privilege. And I guess I am sucking the joy out of just the pure pleasure of watching a film. But choices are political, and films and filmmaking doesn’t exist in some artsy vacuum that is immune to politics or scrutiny. We are enlightened enough to call out regressive ideas in the end product, why not engage with the process even if it makes us uncomfortable, as it ought to, really? I actually genuinely don’t see why the comfort a director has with Mohanlal should extend to his son if he isn’t worthy, especially if there is money and the pressure of making a good film riding on it.
My apologies for talking so much. I will stop now, promise.
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GODZ
July 22, 2017
The point is just because one is star kid it does not he should be banned from the movie industry. No. Dhanush, Selvaraghavan, Venkat Prabhu etc those names from memory right away are genuine people who used their cinema background just as an entry ticket but made a mark on the industry through hard work. Those are exceptions and Exceptions do exist in all fields. What we are talking deliberate pumping of Star child to make sure the enormous money and profit that comes out stays with in specific few and never goes outside. This “Bloody Hard work” is paid handsomely I mean to unimaginable sums of money so I request anyone not to play the hard work or talent card here. This entire favoritism is more visible in Politics and Entertainment because that’s where power and money is. If it’s just acting then that’s fine. But we are not talking about Art here. It’s pure business and money where specific people hold the keys, make sure only their people enter and systems have sufficient checks and balances to make sure only they win. The entire system is set up in such a way that may be 10% of outsiders have a chance. This is not about star kids it’s about people behind them.
This group controls the Every aspect of movie making, they control the real estate, Television, Satellite etc. The next aspiration would naturally be politics. So once these star Kids meet their expiry date, then their next destination is politics. Again full control of machinery. To put this in perspective, Imagine these guys as Michael Corleone and the nonperformers, the ones who people reject are Fredo. “Everything comes from Family and Everything Goes to Family and If any threatens Family, don’t ever take sides with anyone against the Family again. Ever” .. 🙂
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Vanya
July 22, 2017
To Anu and others, I get that people want to hire someone they trust or are familiar with, so they turn to their networks for recommendations. But typically in such cases, they’re still looking at the CV and making a decision assuming that all other qualifications are equal (I say “typically”, but I know gargantuan caveats apply here). Bollywood behavior stretches this to a crazy extreme. Saif Ali Khan didn’t just get a foot in the door, he was allowed to stay in the room long after he’d shown that his qualifications were sub-par. From 1992 to 2002, he had 21 films that did poorly vs. 5 that fared well (all multi-starrers). His first solo-hero hit was after being in the industry for 12 years! Where is the outsider equivalent to his case?
However, there’s a problem with bringing up examples/counterexamples to argue that nepotism is or is not a huge issue in Bollywood; how do we determine if the example is representative? And I also see comments that this happens in Hollywood, and other industries too, so why single out Bollywood. The “it happens elsewhere” feels like a cop-out as in “rape and sexual harassment happens in western countries too, so why is India being singled out?”. Severity of the problem matters too. Here’s Dharma Productions’ track record:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Dharma_Productions_films
Per my count, in the modern era (2000 and after), about 85% of their films feature Bollywood offspring in a prominent role. I’m not sure what an appropriate comparison in Hollywood would be. 20th Century Fox?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_20th_Century_Fox_films_(2000%E2%80%93present)
I don’t have time to break this one down as Wikipedia didn’t offer an easy compilation of credited actors for these films. But I would be very, very surprised if the percentage with Hollywood offspring rises even to 25%.
There are several obvious advantages that offspring get from successful parents — genetic, familial environment, and professional network boosts over the general public. So I don’t think it’s surprising that given birth into a filmy/sciencey/businessy/musicy family, the odds of choosing and succeeding in that arena increase relative to the general public. I don’t know what a “normal” level of boost would look like, i.e., without unchecked nepotistic practices, but my impression is that Bollywood is operating at a level that’s far from ideal.
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GODZ
July 22, 2017
Adding to the above, The denial of opportunity is the supreme and only reason that we always remain developing and we will be developing after 50 years. Some here say one or two opportunities. But there are lots and lots of people with genuine talent who are denied that ticket. That’s the precise reason, we see people leaving India and That’s the precise reason NRI’s and their kids are most successful and we shamelessly publish Articles about them. We do have Kalpana Chawla, we do have Marlon Brandon and Nolans, We do have Sunder Pichai and why go to that level..We do have millions of Spelling Bee Champ Kids in our country.
Its land of 1.4 Billion. So we are talking about 580 Heroes in the Entire Indian movie industry(let’s say 20 from each state). So let’s say a million people are aspiring to be heroes(0.1% of Population), that’s just 0.06%. So those 1 or 2 crucial opportunities do matter. So in the name of comforts, and you can add whatever you want, You easily deny the opportunity for those remaining 99.9% people mercilessly without even considering them. This is the system I am talking about. That’s the precise reason we have so many star kids because they easily bypass the million people just like that. Yes. Just like that.
Denial of opportunity for genuine talent. It’s the curse of this nation and I bet until the system changes we will be developing the country for generations to come.
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Anu Warrier
July 22, 2017
Where is the outsider equivalent to his case?
Amitabh Bachchan? 🙂 13 flops before he hit it big? Akshay Kumar?
Look, please, please note that I never said anywhere that ‘it happens elsewhere, so…’ The part about Hollywood was a direct response to something Madan said.
Nowhere have I said that Kangana was wrong in calling it out, or that it doesn’t exist! Nor that the fact that it exists elsewhere means it should exist in the film industry or at all.
With other professions, what happens is that unless you own the business, there’s only so much that nepotism can do – it can get you a job. But if you look at business houses, their scions are always trained to take over the business. Nepotism? Or ‘I’ve made this business and so I’m going to give it to my children’? What happens is that the parents or the parents friends are making movies – it becomes easier in this scenario to say, ‘Let’s take the son/daughter of XYZ’. As I said, the curiosity value of ‘Big star’s son/daughter’ is good for a few footfalls. It’s commerce.
For all the star kids you remember being noticed today, there are several who have fallen by the wayside because their lack of talent overwhelmed their curiosity value – Esha Deol comes to mind. Or Fardeen Khan. Plenty more where those came from. We only notice the ones who made it big.
Nepotism may have given Alia and Varun the breaks; their hard work and talent keeps them there. The industry is a very unforgiving place – their standing is only good when they bring the crowds in. Newcomers are more likely to fail big and less likely to be forgiven, true.
The point is, I am NOT defending nepotism. I’m pointing out ground reality. There’s a difference.
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Anu Warrier
July 22, 2017
@Gadz, from my earlier commentI don’t know how successful our reservation policies are, and I have seen that being abused as well, but at the core of it, reservation is an attempt to right centuries of oppression, of rights and privileges that have been denied to sections of the populatiion because they weren’t born into the right strata of society.
I hope that clarifies my stand on this issue.
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Anu Warrier
July 22, 2017
@jussomebody, I said earlier that we all (the readers of this blog) come from privilege – the degrees may differ, but we do have privilige, and it is absolutely up to us to recognise that we have it, and to ensure that we level the playing field for everyone, including – especially – those who don’t.
As to why film-makers who are comfortable with say, Mohanlal, are comfortable with casting his son, it’s as I explained earlier – one, they probably know the kid. Two, the economics of Mohanlal’s fans coming to see his son, is huge. If he is absolutely useless, then a couple of films later, he will be out. Unless (and this is huge), the director/producer wants Mohanlal to star in one of their films and is using this as a quid pro quo arrangement. A lot of it is that, you know. Otherwise the economics of film making will weed them out soon enough. Not even diehard nepotism supporters will support casting a talentless star kid just for kicks.
Again, to be very, very clear – not defending nepotism. Not saying it shouldn’t change. Not saying don’t call it out. Just stating the reasons behind these decisions. And fact is, at least in films where our money is not involved, we really don’t get a voice. He who pays the piper calls the tune.
We can choose NOT to see any star kids’ movies. Not to buy or consume any written material about them and so drive the economies of the marketplace. Or we can bankroll films that give a platform to new talent. Are we willing to do that? We cannot tell a producer how to spend his money.
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Madan
July 22, 2017
@ Vanya Thank you. This is the point I was trying to make. Yes, nepotism exists in both Hollywood and Bollywood but it is far less prevalent in Hollywood.
“You can’t argue that even among the ones who came in because of filmi connections – Aamir, Salman, Saif, Ranbir – et al, do not deserve the position they are in” – Vanya has made good arguments about Saif. Salman is in interesting case. Yes, he has been undoubtedly accepted by the market and has delivered hit after hit. But let’s also look at what kind of films those are. Mostly masala films and masala here means something worlds apart from the 70s AB films (or even the Naseer Hussain films like HKKN/Yaadon Ki Baarat), more like Vethalam/Jhilla ‘quality’ masala. And this is something stars have done to help their sons get an easy launch. When RK was devastated by the failure of Mera Naam Joker, he rolled out a total masala enterprise for Rishi Kapoor’s launch. Muthuraman also rolled out one masala after another for Karthik. Bharatiraja attempted the same for his son albeit without success. So, yes, this route may yield commercial success and even over a long period of time but it also creates a very risk averse climate in the industry. Maybe the industry would grow up a little bit if it was more inclined to take chances with a new face and a good script instead.
The other problem with an industry that doesn’t welcome outsiders is it starts to run short of new ways of looking at the world it is filming and that is happening in Bollywood too. If people from the same or at least similar kind of backgrounds get together to make films year after year, there is bound to be a sameness. Even the outsiders in Bollywood used to be diverse. If Sunil Dutt came up the hard way and retained a kind of stoic understatement till the end, Rajesh Khanna was always flamboyant. If the industry does not open its mind to different influences, it only closes avenues to new sources of creativity.
I agree that it is not a black and white issue as far as the film industry goes but when the stars make it out as if it is almost a non issue, I have to disagree and only shows them to be unaware of how much they have benefited from their privilege.
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Madan
July 22, 2017
” I actually genuinely don’t see why the comfort a director has with Mohanlal should extend to his son if he isn’t worthy” – It’s like if your car mechanic – ok, outdated example now that the OEMs have forced us to visit their authorised service centres for the most part – has a son whom you have also seen working in the garage and then one day the mechanic says he is retiring and handing over the work to his son who he assures you would do a good job too. Would you discount him or would the trust you have for HIS work influence your judgment? Now of course after he has right royally messed up the repairs, you will swear off him but he still gets that one opening which a guy trying his luck for the first time in Mumbai does not. That is how a star son gets introduced, by a director/producer loyal to the star who has delivered many hits for him.
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Madan
July 22, 2017
“I just observed that the privileged ones are privileged for a reason, of which KJ can do nothing about,” – No, there is something he can do, which is to give outsiders more opportunities at Dharma and also treat them well and in particular not heaping scorn on them for their English. That was the point Kangana was making. As for fighting for privilege, she has done it with aplomb. She has endured the same kind of stereotyping that has also been seen in this thread throughout her career and, in spite of almost being certified insane by her detractors, rose to the level where she could deliver hits on her own name. There are precious few actresses in Bollywood who could hope to do that. So she has earned the right to ‘whine’.
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GODZ
July 22, 2017
@Anu My reply is towards this opinion of yours “Speaking of which, I would rather see reservation based on economic background rather than caste or religion;” To put it simply, Reservation based on economic Background will not work.
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Carol
July 22, 2017
As someone who is not Indian but follows cinema around the world, I feel safe in stating that nepotism abounds in most film industries. Someone mentioned that there is not much nepotism in Hollywood which is completely false. Probably half of cast and crews members in the Hollywood are related to someone else in the industry and most folks don’t realize it. Why? Unless it is mentioned in an interview, bio or the person grew up in the public eye, it is usually ignored. Hell, I think probably all of Meryl Streep’s kid are in the industry in some capacity and they are a very low key publicity shy family that lived in Connecticut not LA.
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jussomebody
July 22, 2017
One of the many things that makes me uncomfortable is our collective emphasis on the output / outcome of the product, and how the optimal economics is to be achieved. I am hoping this doesn’t qualify as whataboutery, but just thinking aloud…
It is the emphasis on efficiency and productivity that justifies gender-based disparities in many fields. Women routinely suffer injustice at work, get hired less, get paid less and passed over for promotions, due to the risk of lesser productivity (either by getting knocked up or now, just bleeding every month). It is a certain unchallenged ‘market logic’ that justifies these decisions for the company. One could say that if you hired terrible men workers, then automatically they won’t last at the job. But is that good enough? Then you would hire other men. It is through debate on what productivity means, and how women contribute to the company and overall economics that ought to change outcomes for women, no?
Similarly, if we regularly and more often, bet on the faces that are likely to make the most money and accept that as a valid market logic, what we are doing long-term is legitimizing those kinds of hires in the long run. We could say the market automatically provides checks and balances, but do we stop there? The market logic itself is kinder to some compared to others. As Madan pointed out, what this could result in is a loss in diversity, less room for representation and voices that can only enrich the output, especially if films are equal parts art and commerce.
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sanjana
July 22, 2017
All said and done, Kangana is right. That is why defending Kjo looks and sounds so clumsy and ill articulated.
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Doba
July 22, 2017
And here is Kangana’s response –
http://www.mid-day.com/articles/kangana-ranaut-reply-farmer-comment-saif-ali-khan-karan-johar-varun-dhawan-dig-iifa-awards-2017/18443159
I cant help admiring this woman (She doesn’t sound like a drug addicted, paranoid, hysterical woman to me who is holding any woman card!!)
She argues against the ridiculous eugenics argument made earlier by Saif. The idea that genes can pass down artistic ability in two to three generations – man that is the most ridiculous of arguments.
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thika
July 22, 2017
“For all the star kids you remember being noticed today, there are several who have fallen by the wayside because their lack of talent overwhelmed their curiosity value – Esha Deol comes to mind. Or Fardeen Khan. Plenty more where those came from. We only notice the ones who made it big”
It is possible that:
Priorities changed – they started focusing on something other than movies
Time at which they were launched – during their time, talented outsiders were still welcomed or were already there. So, unless the star kids were talented it was impossible to make a mark. Now, it’s dominated by star kids who are not talented. Even if the star kids are only marginally talented, they can still sustain.
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Honest Raj (formerly 'V'enkatesh)
July 22, 2017
Amit Joki: Sorry for the delayed response. Having watched Kavan and Vaalu back-to-back, I badly needed a sound sleep.
Since you asked me specifically, male-privilige is definitely not a myth. But it WAS earned. But first, think like someone from ages past. Early men were the breadwinners. They took the risk of hunting wild animals. Made a shelter and safe guarded their family. All these was because these things required brute strength and hence born was the male-privilege and is unfortunately imbibed in the common culture.
You’re now starting to sound like KV’s VC. Agree, a Harmanpreet Kaur or a Mithali Raj may not be in a position to face the likes of Akhtar/Lee/Steyn/Tait/Malinga, but have you ever wondered why women are not allowed to become a priest/pope? Starting from the first millennium, we’ve had 266 popes to date:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_popes
Don’t you think it’s a ‘privilege’ that only men enjoy? Or, does becoming one require a specific ‘state-of-mind’ which only men possess?
But come to present, the male-privilege is irrelevant because the jobs we do now are more intellectual than ever. Females are no longer the secondary now. Women are equalling men in nearly all tasks they’re venturing in.
Sure, some do but what about the rest? Take engineering, medicine, management, or any other field which requires high ‘intellect’. In AIIMS/IITs/NITs/IIMs, the male:female ratio is highly skewed towards males (10:1 in some colleges). Sure, women from well-to-do families manage to clear the initial cutoffs but the fact remains that they are just outliers (as opposed to the continuous distribution of men cutoffs across various categories). It’s for this very reason, the IIMs give ‘grace’ marks for girls and candidates from non-engineering backgrounds. Also, there’s a proposal to reserve 14 percent of the seats in IITs for women (irrespective of caste and economic status) from the next year.
But not many people accept this fact and therefore feminism is needed so that we could straighten such men.
See racists, misogynists, jingoists, et al will continue to exist; they CANNOT be “tamed”. I’m not going to go deeper into this for now (I’m sure there are people who can address this point and articulate things at a much better level than I can), but I see that you maintain a blog and even have a post up on women’s rights (the ending sounds pretty much like Michael Winterbottom’s Trishna). 🙂 I’ll post my views there sometime later.
A: Being the only OC in the class having friends who really aren’t “backward” but for in the name of the castes, I perhaps misconstrued that nepotism and reservations are same.
B: Someone like the 16-year-old Dhanush would never even have the opportunity to enter the audition hall and would probably be insulted by the watchmen like in the movie Shamitabh. So I thank nepotism because it created a “level-playing” field for him. Keep looking.
I can buy (A) and (B) separately but not together. Not meaning to sound condescending, but I’m not sure you’ve started to think beyond Dhanush. Perhaps, you should revisit the Remo, Cinema: chicken-egg? threads. 🙂
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nikkie1602
July 22, 2017
Amitjoki: Actually kangana never complained that KJo had it easy…she called him out on the fact that he played a part in making it tough – that he is snooty, that he had made fun of her accent and the fact that he in fact was nepotistic in his casting choices. What’s more, it seemed to have hit a nerve with Kjo because he never stopped talking about it. Asking her to leave the industry if she wasn’t happy with the way things worked was extremely hypocritical considering it came soon after the ADHM fiasco… It is not about fighting for privilege but about what can be done to minimise the fighting. Yea Kjo isn’t answerable for what his parents bequeathed him but he is answerable when it comes to the way he goes about in the industry….all parts of the system are answerable when the entire system is flawed.
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Madan Mohan
July 22, 2017
Bhai log, picture abhi baaki hai. Here’s Kangana’s open letter. Does the media perchance accept outsourced work from India Post?
http://www.mid-day.com/articles/kangana-ranaut-reply-farmer-comment-saif-ali-khan-karan-johar-varun-dhawan-dig-iifa-awards-2017/18443159
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Madan Mohan
July 22, 2017
“I think probably all of Meryl Streep’s kid are in the industry in some capacity ” – Yes, most of them are actors. But not one of them has headlined a big budget film as far as I can tell. We are talking (in the Indian context) about star children getting parachuted into lead roles for big banner films right off the bat with no previous performances. A terrible actress like Esha Deol not only got a lead role but has also done plenty of films since in spite of failing to justify these opportunities. If that happened in Hollywood, would it still be suppressed by the media? Genuinely asking.
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Honest Raj (formerly 'V'enkatesh)
July 22, 2017
Carol: Probably half of cast and crews members in the Hollywood are related to someone else in the industry and most folks don’t realize it. Why? Unless it is mentioned in an interview, bio or the person grew up in the public eye, it is usually ignored.
I’ve always wondered why the fact that Rajinikanth and Mohanlal being related to each other in some way hasn’t been pointed out at all. 🙂
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brangan
July 22, 2017
That is such a knowing, polite, graceful, forceful letter by Kangana — I love how she says she herself may do the same thing with her children but that doesn’t mean one should stop striving for an ideal world. Beautiful.
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Anu Warrier
July 22, 2017
@ BR: Loved her letter! Glad she wrote this.
@ Madan – the press is not going to call it out here either; the papparazzi make their money out of photographs and stories of celeb kids. You would get called out in politics, for instance; in entertainment, it’s par for the course. I’m glad Carol stepped in to bolster my remark.
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Anu Warrier
July 22, 2017
@Godz, yes, Aadhy already pointed out the fallacy behind my thinking that economic reservation would work.
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MANK
July 23, 2017
the most successful cases of star kids in Hollywood are Jane Fonda and Michael Douglas. Fonda started out as a secretary(or some similar profession) before going on into acting where she toiled for more than a decade in B and C movies.she even did X rated stuff like Barbarella until finally she became an A list actress with Klute when she was 35. Michael douglas started out as a supporting actor on television, then he moved in to film production and produced the oscar winning one flew over the cuckoos nest. little by little he started getting leading man parts and almost 2 decades in to his career he hit stardom with Wall street and Fatal attraction at the age of 40. this is how star kids break out in hollywood. Neither Henry Fonda or Kirk Douglas produced multi million dollar launch vehicles for them.
The more recent case of nepotism was Francis coppola putting his daughter Sofia in Godfather 3. He was hounded by the press for that and it still is Sofia was (perhaps unfairly) painted as the weakest aspect of the film and almost every review about the film mention this. she was scarred for life to the extend that she switched profession and become a director. Even Recently Will Smith tried to put his son Jaden in After Earth (alongside himself ) which again drew heavy criticism and one of the first big flops of will smith’s career.
I think 2 of Meryl’s daughters are in to acting. i dont think they have landed anything major. i Saw one of the daughters in a few episodes of the tv series The Newsroom.But leave all that aside. check this out Clint Eastwood is as revered as Amitabh Bachchan in Hollywood. to top that he is an accomplished producer director as well .he could put anybody in his movie but he never cared to launch his son. i saw his son Scott playing third or fourth supporting role in last Fast and furious movie. no there is absolutely no comparison between Hollywood and Bollywood in matters of Nepotism
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MANK
July 23, 2017
Saif’s usage of genetics as an excuse for nepotism was disgusting. it creepily sounded like some kind of reaffirmation of the dreaded caste system. This acting in the blood thing was also peddled in the recent Yashraj ads for launching Aadhar Jain, which had the twitterati up in arms. Loved Kangana’s letter. it was heartening to see her react in such a mature way.
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Doba
July 23, 2017
What is so saddening is that despite the debate that has been triggered outside, there is not an iota of debate inside the industry. Not one person (star kid or outsider) has supported Kangana’s stand. The nearest someone has come is Jim in the Rajeev Masand show.
Ranbir Kapoor said that he was a product of nepotism but quickly qualified it by saying that his successes are not applauded. That is an astounding statement. Everybody has raved about his and Alia Bhatt’s talent and nobody is grudging their position in the industry.
Finally, its not about star kids and non star kids. Katrina Kaif is a classic product of nepotism. Salman Khan promoted her big time despite her lack of talent.
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rothrocks
July 23, 2017
” i saw his son Scott playing third or fourth supporting role in last Fast and furious movie” – Indeed. Well, maybe even that is considered nepotism out there. And it may well be at some level. But it doesn’t compare to how easily star children land lead roles in big films in India. The fact that Streep’s children doing decently well in acting is still considered nepotism in USA only serves to show the difference between their and our society.
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tonks
July 23, 2017
To an extent though, isn’t there a grain of truth in what Saif said? Good looks and acting talent, that are assets for movie stars can be inherited. The same way that the ability to draw well, hold a tune or intelligence is inherited from parents to children.
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Madan
July 23, 2017
“Good looks and acting talent, that are assets for movie stars can be inherited” – Yes, that indeed, plus the nurturing also. If they grow up around film people, they will fit in. Just like any occupation handed over from father to son. But he got carried away with the eugenics part.
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Tambi Dude
July 23, 2017
For a change why don’t we mention cases when sons of famous dads actually ended up showing that they were better than father or at least good enough to hold comparison. I can think of two cases
Mohinder Amarnath vs Lala Amarnath.
RD Burman vs SD Burman
Mohinder was clearly a better batsman. As for RDB, folks who have worked with both dad and son rate RDB higher than SDB. Lyricist Anand Bakshi, Laximikant of LP fame and several other musicians like Kersi Lord.
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Madan
July 23, 2017
Would take Mohinder over Lala, yes. RD v/s SD is debatable. LP used to be good friends with RD at least until they backstabbed him over Ram Lakhan. Kersi Lord as an arranger would have found RD more exciting to work with because RD WAS great with using different instruments and sounds and in a very different way from the earlier composers. But SD was stronger in melody. But what can be safely said is RD eclipsed him in popularity and impact, comfortably.
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Vanya
July 23, 2017
@Madan, I’m glad Kangana called him out on the eugenics part. When I saw his comments, I immediately had an Inigo Montoya moment — “I do not think that word means what you think it means”.
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Tambi Dude
July 23, 2017
I guess those filmi folks took into consideration that RDB was more of an all rounder. For example, he is use to be completely involved in orchestra. SDB use to outsource it to his deputies. To his defense, that was the trend in 50s and 60s when music directors restricted themselves to just create the tunes.
Also there are doubts about some of SDB’s creation post mid 1960s. It is well known that SDB’s career can be broken into two phases. The first one when Jaidev was his assistant. Two songs of Guide are alleged to be Jaidev’s creation (Tere Mere Sapne and Din Dhal Jaye). Once Jaidev left, RDB took over as his assistant.
Songs suspected to be RDB’s creation are
1 – Aaare yaar meri tum bhee (Teen Devian)
2 – Hoton pe aaisee baat mein (Jewel Thief)
3 – Aardhana (quite a few)
4 – Jaise Radha ne mala japi (Tere Mere Sapne)
One thing is clear. SDB Jaidev combo produced clearly superior songs than SDB RDB phase.
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Madan
July 23, 2017
@ Tambi Dude: In fact, even as far as Guide goes, an R D Burman musical biography I read mentioned that the sax arrangements on say Tere Mere Sapne were RD’s. SD basically was not comfortable with sax. Aradhana was RD all the way except the two dull Rafi songs (and I say that as a huge fan of Rafi). BUT if you say Tere Mere Sapne and Din Dhal Jaye were Jaidev’s and if I find some substantiation for THAT, then by jove I would have to revise my opinion because Guide and those two songs in particular have a lot to do with where I rate SD. OK, there still are plenty of great songs on Tere Ghar Ke Samne and Teen Deviyan among many others but Guide is the crown jewel. I am not much fond of SD’s work with Guru Dutt except the song Waqt Ne Kiya and that mainly on account of Geeta Dutt’s rendition. Yes, from Jewel Thief onwards, definitely RD had a huge hand in SD’s films.
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Tambi Dude
July 23, 2017
Madan: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4lfaoRySX28
Here SPB mentions about those two songs. I had heard about it long time back.
[ if not in this video, then watch part 2 ]]
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sanjana
July 24, 2017
http://www.rediff.com/movies/interview/s-d-burman-never-forgot-he-was-a-prince/20141106.htm
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Namrata Joshi
July 24, 2017
Dear Mr. BRangan
After having followed your writing for a few years, I can consider myself a moderate enthusiast of it. I try to look up your blog now and again for information on new posts, and if those posts are of interest to me. I disagree with your perspective on numerous occasions (for example, your writing on KJohar movies and Imtiaz Ali movies are ones I feel most indifferent towards. While I enjoy the writing itself and your thoughts, I feel no sense of identification towards them. I know I do not remotely feel engaged by these creations, and more importantly, have scant interest in the people behind them (for various reasons, of course). But, your writing and the worldview it represents has always kept me interested. Moreover, your basic human decency towards the people who post on your blog and the grace and good cheer you show towards even critical commentators is something I am grateful for. It makes me feel respected and valued as a presence (often silent) in the world of your blog. Some bloggers can, understandably, lose it after the nth critical remark (it doesn’t help that the commentator has used harsh, rude words). It is therefore, laudable if someone continues to not lose their composure and retaliate in kind. I really, really value that. So, thanks!
As for this acrimonious exchange of words between KJohar, his cronies and Ms. Ranaut, all I can say is that I am biased towards Ms. Ranaut and against Mr. Johar and his cronies. I feel I owe it to those who might read my comment to be forthright about my known biases.
As much has already been said on this incident and its principal players, I cannot say much without being repetitive and resorting to cliche. But, I feel I could share my views on how I now feel about these people following this incident (and the related ones that preceded it):
Ms. Ranaut: As I indicated earlier, I cannot help but like her. Part of this response is due to the fact that I truly find her a remarkable, even glorious, presence on the screen. She is, in my unschooled opinion, made for acting for the camera, and she does it with aplomb. I know the narrative she has put forth about her struggles polarizes opinion about her. Moreover, her personal life (especially her choice of being with men in relationships) has annoyed people. The Hrithik controversy didn’t help either. I know for a fact that one’s public image and narrative is part of this job in the current world. While Ashok Kumars and Nalini Jaywants of yore could have affairs while being married and still be bonafide superstars and enjoy the love and respect of the masses, today one has to present a certain image of oneself if one is to survive in Bwood, or so its inhabitants have been told. So, Mr. Salman Khan had to re-vamp his image and partake of obvious, blatant gestures of philantrophy to redeem his viewership. I do not say that this is done with malice or even deliberately. Moreover, I am sure he (and the rest) must have done (and continue to do) at least some act of kindness towards those around them. I mean to indicate that these folks have been told that they have to present themselves as as adhering to a narrow, old-school code of conduct wherein you appear either happily single (possibly celibate) or happily committed to one person.
But Ms. Ranaut seems a bit different in that regard. I say this following her public response to the Hrithik fiasco. Having been schooled in the Bwood way of thinking, I was prepared for her to say that she had only been a friend (platonic one) to Mr. Roshan. But I do not think she made any such remark. In fact, she went to a public fora for women, and talked about her failed experience of love with Mr. Roshan. I saw that speech on YouTube. It was uncomfortable and appeared to be very, very raw. She could have spun this incident a thousand different ways to suit her public image. But she seemed to have chosen the hardest of them: to be honest to a world that would likely mock you. She talked about how (without disclosing Hrithik’s identity) she had been lampooned for her needy emails. She then went on to elaborate on her own thoughts and feelings while writing those emails. She had, it seems, fallen in love with a man of great beauty. His beauty and charm had charmed her into falling in love with him. He too, had returned her affection but only for a brief while. Where she wanted a lifelong love, he wanted a slight dalliance. Not one to give up on her dreams easily, she set about doing what many men and women in love have attempted to do: mould Hrithik Roshan into the image of his she’d carried in her mind, and compel him to return her love in equal measure. Seeing Kangana talk about these very private and discomforting experiences, and her evident struggle at keeping it together, was a very authentic moment to witness. Such moments are so rare in the world, especially a world of gloss, superficiality and practiced gestures, that it has stuck with me all these months later. So, when I hear her mention, my mind spontaneously conjures up this image of her, and I cannot help but feel a slight respect for her struggles (internal and external) and the fortitude they well up in her. Not all battles are fought with AK47s at the nations borders!! Moreover, her open letter to Mr. Saif was eloquent and moving, and has made me more respectful towards her than ever. She is certainly a person of intellectual rigor and emotional heft to me.
I encountered a similar human, revealing moment with Mr. Johar. It was during the second season of his talk show. In one of his episodes, he had invited Kanagana for a brief appearance. Much has been written about that appearance and how she was made to feel uncomfortable and even unworthy of the world of Bwood in general, and KwK in particular. I carry a memory of his scornful manner since then. Thereafter, in numerous other episodes, I chanced upon more to add to this memory of his scornful manner. Of all his unpalatable qualities, the one that annoys me the most is his belief in the mistaken notion that only those who speak English with some measure of success are worthy of being considered educated, “classy”, etc. I too, imbibed this idea from my surroundings while growing up in India. It is really, a form of self-loathing that our colonial masters bequeathed us with. Fortunately for me, I was transported to a different world where language is a means to an end for the most part. Furthermore, if one really claims to love language in this world, one has to want to know and learn more (and in a deeper sense, not superficial learning). I see none of that in Mr. Johar. All I see is him going on and on about how good his English is (while going on to speak in prose that can, on occasion, turn turgid and even odd in its construction). Much of this snobbery was unstated and visible only through his manner. But with the incident with Ms. Ranaut, it has become more obvious and deliberate. In a platform in the West, I believe, he went on to talk of this incident and mock Ms. Ranaut’s English-speaking skills, yet again. I mean, if you really want to mock someone’s language skills, shouldn’t you be at least as skilled as Shakespeare or Dickens? At least be a world-anointed master before you mock someone else! I remember a movie called Kissi Se Na Kehna. It had a brief discussion about language (English and Hindi) and language-users between the ever wonderful Utpal Dutt and Deepti Navel. I have paraphrased that conversation below as I think it echoes my views:
Deepti Naval’s character: “Uncle, is knowing English that bad? Why are you so against learning English?”
Utpal Dutt’s character: “Language isn’t the problem. Language, hindi or english, is knowledge, and knowledge can only elevate us. Moreover, any language is a beautiful thing that can bring one’s thoughts and emotions to life. It can also help us define the messy feelings we carry inside of us. It helps build a bond between those around us. My problem is with some speakers of these languages who have arbitrarily decided to reflect their own prejudices onto these beautiful languages. There is no such thing as a “posh” language or a “crude” one. The shallowness is within the speaker’s mind. And it is this shallowness of thought that I resent.”
Mr. Johar and his cronies seem to represent that shallownesss of thought. In my opinion, if you claim to love English, then you should attempt to learn it well and try to be effective at using it. But for pete’s sake, stop tagging languages as “sophisticated” or not, and for heaven’s sake, stop mocking people for their perceived inability at a language. It is plain rude, and certainly un-posh!
And for pete’s sake, re-watch Kisi Se Na Kehna (and while you’re at it, Choti Si Baat). They are examples of creations that have continued to excite and engage people who were born long after these movies, and long after some of the principal players have exited the mortal realm. RIP dear, dear Mr. Utpal Dutt, Mr. Ashok Kumar, and Mr. Farroque Sheikh.
And chin up, Ms. Ranaut. Your grit is exemplary!
And grow up, Ms. Johar. And maybe, read a book on manners. You seem to need it!
Cheers!
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Namrata Joshi
July 24, 2017
A final word: this topic brings up a very stark image to my mind of a person, an average joe, consumed by a desire to act in the movies. Each day he channels this urge in various ways: some days he stands in front of his mirror in his free time and speaks out the dialogue from a recent movie he watched. Another day he might put on a personality and walk into a bar, trying to perform a character and see how far his charade goes. On other moments, he might inject some play-acting into his normal conversations with his family. This last bit gets him a lot of applause, but that praise is bitter-sweet. It feeds into his growing sense of performance being his life-calling. But it also makes him fearful of all that is at stake. Finally, one fine day, he decides to give into his desire, and leaves his adequately paying job/career, and his family, etc to struggle in Bombay. There is no guarantee of his success. Talented but little known performers like Satyadeep Mishra have such a tale to tell. He left a cushy job, and even landed some scattered applause for his performances, but he continues to be little known and little cast. Same is true of someone a bit more successful like KK Menon. This is why I applaud people by Ram Gopal Varma. His is, in the words of many strugglers who were given stellar parts by him, the only place in Bombay that actively seeks out talent regardless of physicality or the rest. He cast a short, odd-looking Rajpal Yadav and cast him in Jungle as the lead antagonist. He, believably, stole the film from right under Fardeen Khan’s perfect nose. Even Urmila did little to impress in that movie. Since then, Rajpal Yadav continues to excel and shine in whichever movies he is offered, regardless of the nature or length of the parts given to him. So, in all this, I think, someone like RG Varma needs to be mentioned and celebrated! Anurag Kashyap and his team do a little for outsiders but they are relatively new, and so, I will reserve judgement on them.
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Madan
July 24, 2017
@ Tambi Dude: Yes, spotted that reference. I have watched that interview before but there was so much material and I didn’t pay attention to that one little thing he slipped in about Jaidev. I also found this Shaji article about Jaidev:
http://shajiwriter.blogspot.com/2010/02/jaidev-loneliness-of-unsung-music.html
Hmm, and SD used to be much aggrieved that SJ ‘stole’ the Filmfare award for that year with Suraj. Did he perchance intend to hand over his award to Jaidev? Guide does have Kya Se Kya/Mose chal but if you remove those two Rafi solos, it’s much diminished. I am already a fan of MM and Jaidev; makes me sad to hear Navketan stole two of Jaidev’s finest creations. They should have at least credited him for those two songs.
@ sanjana: Thanks for sharing. Lot that I disagree with but nevertheless the book seems to be interesting. Let’s see whether and where I can pick it up. Planning to go to Churchgate today in the second half, so weather permitting, I could take a look at the Flora fountain ‘bookstall’.
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brangan
July 24, 2017
Namrata Joshi: Thank you for that lovely comment, and for your moderate enthusiasm for my writing. I’m glad this thread is bringing out a lot of new voices.
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Filistine
July 24, 2017
Talking about Nepotism….
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Prava
July 25, 2017
Pls do watch Kangana’s brilliant interview with Anupam Kher where she talks about her life, , relationship, success, controversies, Karan Johar and star kids.
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Nkb
July 25, 2017
I can’t begin to vent my frustration about how MANK so carelessly talks about Kangana’s drug use. No where is it proven except by a useless fool of an ex. This is manexplaining at its worst and lowest ebb. You simply cannot accuse someone of something like this unless dude you snorted it with her or gave it to her yourself. Your intellectual articulations serve for nothing when you reduce a woman who made some valid points down to her drug use of which you have ABSOLUTELY no proof. KJ said he was treated for depression and took a break, how come that doesn’t make a part of this narrative. Urrghhhhhhh.
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Namrata Joshi
July 26, 2017
@NkB
I agree. I also have this curiosity: why is it that a self-avowed former drug addict like Sanjay Dutt is seen with the concern, pity and as desirous of our protection (and worthy of raising children of his own) while someone whose may have been recreational (if also that) and not addictive is considered to have a brain that is too damaged by the drugs she used to make any sense? Do the people who assume this about Kangana not think the same about Sanjay? And what about the copious levels of alcohol so many of the heroes consume. Would that not have damaged their brains? Do the people who hold these stellar opinions have any understanding of biology?
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Parvati
July 26, 2017
Anu Warrier’s comment is incorrect where she says ” Ranveer Singh” had no family connections- he is Sonam Kapoor’s cousin and very much a family insider connection.
To find a viable outsider hero, we may have to go back all the way to Akshay.
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Apu
July 26, 2017
Sanjana: “I always wondered why the privileged ones dont go for medicine or IIT. They mostly go for mass communication or MBA. That means they are not academically inclined most of the time.”
Do you want to re-think your comment? How is doing medicine or IIT inclination of more academic inclination than doing MBA – all of them are professional qualifications. And if you are talking of getting through in competitive exams – that is true too for all 3 too.
Let us not be too snarky here.
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sanjana
July 26, 2017
Apu, to get into IIT or medicine, the homework is much more gruelling. While MBA can be done even without going to college. And mass communication is what every second film kid person goes for. Why not CA?
Yes, I am wrong in a way. Bachelor of Arts which gets maximum snarky comments can be pursued by an academically serious person. Only in India we find such attitudes. Arts stream is below par and science and commerce stream is what one should aim for.
As for filmstars’ kids opting for easier courses when they can afford anything really amuses me. After MBA or Mass communications, they join films!
Here I am talking about star kids, not the general students who are from any strata.
My intention is not to hurt people who take up other courses.
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Sifter
July 26, 2017
I am not a great fan of Kangana’s work, but she impresses me with her spunk, grit, determination, intelligent plainspeak, frankness and a naivety that is startling!
Not here to comment on the debate on nepotism that’s raging here, but on her response to Saif’s open letter in DNA. She is articulate, simple, straightforward and succinct as well.
She also said these:
but to discredit the likes of Mr Dilip Kumar, Mr K Asif, Mr Bimal Roy, Mr Satyajit Ray, Mr Guru Dutt, and many more
and
We would’ve loved to repeat the greatness of Einstein, Da Vinci, Shakespeare, Vivekananda, Stephen Hawking, Terence Tao, Daniel Day-Lewis, or Gerhard Richter.
It is so telling when she couldn’t name a woman from bollywood, hollywood or outside them
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Anu Warrier
July 26, 2017
It is so telling when she couldn’t name a woman from bollywood, hollywood or outside them
@Sifter: Is it? “telling’ I mean? Or appalling that she couldn’t bring up Devika Rani, Durga Khote, Nutan, Meena Kumari, Waheeda Rehman, Suchitra Sen, Madame Curie, Rosalind Franklin, Ismat Chugtai, Amrita Pritam, Kamala Das,Sarojini Naidu, Mahadevi Verma, Anandibai Joshi, Janaki Ammal. Amrita Shergill, Lailta Lajmi, Anjolie Ela Menon….
I assume, however, that since she was responding to Saif, she chose male role models.
@Parvati – Ranveer Singh is Sonam Kapoor’s second cousin – his grandfather and Sonam’s maternal grandmother are cousins. Considering that Sonam’s mother is not from a film family, and that Ranveer’s family are nowhere in films, I doubt you can consider that relationship an advantage. I’m not even sure the two even acknowledge a relationship? Certainly, AK and Sonam had nothing to do with Ranveer getting into films. Having a distant cousin in films is really not the same thing.
I can claim distant cousinship to Manju Warrier – not knowing the woman or her family from Adam (or Eve), that ‘relationship’ means jack if I wanted to break into films. 🙂
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Sifter
July 27, 2017
@ Anu Warrier- Telling. Appalling. Rebelling, but not going all the way. Not wanting to be seen to much of a feminist…take your pick.
She may have. So what she was responding to Saif? Would he not know them (at least the ones in bollywood)? Or would he take umbrage that she mentioned a few women among the men as people to look up to? Pioneers are pioneers! Especially women who had to in the past and continue to have to overcome additional hurdles because they were, and are women.
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Uncouth Village Youth
July 27, 2017
Just an aside on Ranveer – as per industry grapevine, Ranveer’s multimillionaire dad underwrote and pulled the right strings for his first film. The ‘struggles’ of Ranveer as an ‘outsider’ are just not comparable to the genuine outsiders like SRK,Nawazuddin. May be, we can draw solace from the fact that a non-filmy-outsider cracked B’wood, with money and influence.
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Anu Warrier
July 27, 2017
@Sifter, I was trying to give her the benefit of the doubt (seeing as I don’t like her persona much). 🙂
From what I’ve seen and heard and read of Saif, I don’t think he needs lessons in feminism. But yeah, she could surely have mentioned women too, past and present.
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arielsomebody
July 29, 2017
Unsurprising that BR is ‘baffled’ at why people are outraged at KJo’s defence of nepotism.
But the best joke is how BR writes an article about ‘people like us’ and unblushingly crowns himself as having ‘progressive views’
Hypocritical sottai whose pen is paid for by the market. At least don’t give yourself so many airs dude.
😀 😀 😀
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arielsomebody
July 29, 2017
sottai rangan’s stupid justifications for his regressive views in the comment section are lamer than saif ali khan proving himself a raging bigot with his justifications based on ‘eugenics’
ROFL
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brangan
July 29, 2017
arielsomebody: Everything I write is the starting point of a discussion, not the final word. Like in a discussion over a beer with friends, I’m saying, “Here’s my two cents.” And then someone will say, “You know, that’s actually not the case. Look at it this way.” And someone else will pipe and tell the second person, “I don’t agree. Here’s what I think.”
It’s called an exchange of ideas, otherwise there is no reason for a comments section to exist. I can just post my reviews/articles and keep moving on.
But maybe you don’t get it because you want to have the final word. That’s fine. Whatever helps you sleep at night.
But you may want to stop the body shaming. People may think your parents have brought you up very badly.
PS: In the other space, you said there is “zero dissent” to what I write. Clearly, you can’t read either, for this post is full of contradicting views — but of course, expressed in a civil way. (hint, hint!)
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arielsomebody
July 29, 2017
i find this whole “poor film critic who consistently expresses bigoted views, and then plays victim pretending he’s being body shamed when someone flat-out disagrees with him and finds his views reprehensible” narrative a little baffling
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Prashila
July 29, 2017
@arielsomebody: Hmm, I was reading your comment with interest but only till I understood what sottai means (I don’t understand Tamil much, but google helps!). One of the reasons this blog has stuck out for me for all these years is because we are all so fantastically bereft of our ‘appearances’ here. Before you say it, let me clarify, I am not a BR Yes-man, or rather Yes-woman, neither am I a crony of his personal ideologies (the day I feel his personal agenda, whatever it maybe, creeps into his writing, I will be the first to respectfully step away from this space), nor am I defending him because it is even ridiculous to think he needs someone to defend him 🙂
BR has an opinion and let’s be honest, we frequent this space because we want to KNOW what that opinion is. If we agree with it, good. If we don’t, some engage with their counter-opinions, some just get on with their life. But, someone with your level of spunk and intensity, instead of putting your counter-argument in a manner I am sure you can, gets to the most obvious attack, hitting from behind where it hurts the most. Where is the fair-play in that? And since you feel so strongly about the perils of nepotism, how can you not see the hypocrisy in your own argument. Is it because one cause is more worth standing up to than another? Reminds of me how Smriti Irani was called aunty-national in a headline on a high profile national daily. Sigh.
And this is all I have to say on this topic. So I am sorry I will not come back to counter any arguments you throw at me. But if it helps, you may call me Buck-toothed Prashila, considering I have slightly buck teeth, and that is my real name.
P.S. BR, don’t publish this please, if you think it will end up feeding trolls (I am worried it may), but I was honestly upset to see that comment on this space.
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sravishanker1401gmailcom
July 29, 2017
Coming very late into this thread.
I think its by now abundantly clear that there are as many nays as there are ayes.
Thats as it should be but appalled to read some of the comments degenerating into aspersions casting (very mild term) bordering on trolling.
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Anuja Chandramouli
July 29, 2017
arielsomebody: In this space many arguments have gotten out of hand as we readers went hammer and tongs at each other or BR over diametrically differing viewpoints. There have been trolls aplenty and threads have been flooded with venom and ugliness. But may I say that seldom have I found a comment as appalling or disgustingly cheap or below the belt as yours? If you have a shred of decency you would apologise to BR for the unwanted, vituperative attack asap if not sooner.
BR: Sir! I applaud the class you displayed in dealing with such crappy crassness! #respect
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arielsomebody
July 29, 2017
The absolute irony of BR, famous for his body shaming of women, crying victim in the same breath as saying kangana ranaut is playing the ‘victim card’, in a reprehensible article defending nepotism.
And then he goes on to ‘parent-shame’ me by making some remarks about my upbringing. Hilarious.
And then going on to publish some woman’s lament after she says not to publish it – where she completely ignores the reasons i’ve said BR’s views are reprehensible, instead focusing on the sottai. HAHA
Btw, the term he feels ‘body-shamed’ for is sottai (which means bald) for non-tamil readers. I don’t know what’s shameful about being bald. i thought BR sports it as a choice. He’s referred to as sottai rangan by everybody that i know. However, BR since you are so deeply offended, please accept my apology for calling you ‘bald’ 🙂
i don’t think you will, but if you can, now focus on the actual content of the comments.
BR and MANK are a pretty pair to be sure. Sometimes i think they’re the same person. There he is, MANK on this thread too, trying to attenuate BR’s disgusting stand by trying to victim shame Kangana, bringing in some nonsense about drug use/bad relationships. Luckily he was called out for it by somebody else.
These are the reasons i think this blog is a communist cesspool. (i hope this blog doesn’t feel body shamed)
As i said before, i’ve found better quality reviews elsewhere, so adios.
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arielsomebody
July 29, 2017
@anuja chandramouli what a load of crock. What did you find crass? calling BR sottai? Did you find his regressive viewpoints and self-styled intellectual airs crass? What a bunch of hypocritical ‘virtue’ signalling poseurs! Demanding an apology indeed. i don’t care for your opinion.
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sravishanker1401gmailcom
July 29, 2017
arielsomebody : Please keep your righteous indignation to yourself.
We wont miss you.
Using the word ‘sottai’ twice in the same thread and the insinuations that accompanied it dont reek of innocence or bonafide intent – not one bit and was in awful bad taste.
Agree with Anuja – BR was being very very restrained and graceful about the whole thing.
Oh and just in case anyone here was wondering, being a movie critic is definitely not for the faint-hearted……..
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Iswarya
July 29, 2017
BR, I nominate ‘Communist Cesspool’ as a worthy replacement for ‘Blogical Conclusions’ (a name I still somehow see in links from others’ blogs leading up here). Please consider and do the needful.
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Anuja Chandramouli
July 29, 2017
Good riddance to bad rubbish.
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GODZ
July 30, 2017
BR, First of all Why these comments are published? Then whats the point of moderation? I guess this is the second instant in this week and Dont you sense something fishy? Why these repeated personal attacks on you. I guess its time for you to enforce a simple rule. Any personal attacks on any body(Rotten rats, Barks etc etc) automatically qualifies for rejection. The reason the blog is so successful is any one and any body can discuss and express their ideas in writing. I guess its time that the blog needs some censor rules to make sure the ideas are expressed freely and without any fear of personal retaliation.
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Madan
July 30, 2017
“famous for his body shaming of women” – Really? What are some instances of these? I don’t remember and wasn’t reading his reviews from the Indian Express days.
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Anu Warrier
July 30, 2017
Oh jeez, and here I was thinking that it was sad that BR had to ban someone from the blog – n the years I’ve been reading him, Anuj was only the second person banned. Is Ariel Anuj’s sock-puppet? Because they seem to put forward the same argument, and somewhat same invective.
Ugh!
And I’m getting rather tired of being called BR’s crony/yes-woman/whatever. We really don’t come here so we can agree with what BR says; we do (or at least I do) come here to hear what he has to say, and what others have to say on a particular thread. And to agree or disagree as the case may be. And yes, I, at least, have had really passionate debates/disagreements with many people here – Amit Joki, Anuja, et al, will all know what I mean. I have even had a serious disagreement with BR, where I did get snippy about his perceived disinterest in a very serious matter. So the argument that he only admits his cronies or yes-me is laughable.
Yet, at the end of the day, we have consistently kept this place civil and polite. I wish we could still do that.
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brangan
July 30, 2017
Madan: Here’s something I wrote (about Nayanthara’s pre-weight-loss form) that I’m not proud of today:
But I don’t know that I did this too often. This was one of those “trying to lighten up the review” things that ends up backfiring.
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Honest Raj (formerly 'V'enkatesh)
July 30, 2017
An excerpt from your review of Captain’s Sagaptham:
Maybe we should talk about his father, who makes an appearance at the end, his hair dyed with henna, his head bobbing majestically on its bed of chins.
#Facts_are_facts 🙂
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brangan
July 30, 2017
I think an action hero being overweight IS something that’s traditionally ribbed… like in this Ebert review, where he talks about Seagal’s double chin.
http://www.rogerebert.com/reviews/half-past-dead-2002
PS: Not saying this is right. Just wondering aloud about the line between PC and flavour in writing. Or even pointing out a character’s looks on screen, like in this New York Times review:
http://www.nytimes.com/movie/review?res=9E0DE1D9153DF932A15751C0A9659C8B63
“But Mr. Daniels, who has gained a double chin since ”Gettysburg,” has shed his luminosity. Next to his Confederate foes, he comes across as a bloated, ineffectual wimp.”
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sravishanker1401gmailcom
July 30, 2017
So what should we do now ? Outsource the moderation of comments to Pehlaj Nihalani ?
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brangan
July 30, 2017
sravishanker1401gmailcom: I don’t know if it makes sense to delete a comment just because it has a personal attack. The comment may still be useful. So is the answer weeding out the offensive language? That’ll take way too much time…
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GODZ
July 30, 2017
BR..Do you really need to be defensive here..? I mean a critic is a critic and you cannot be mindful of each and every sentences. The freedom of Expression in writing is something that you own completely and if you get conscious of what u r writing in the sense that it might hurt someone then you can never be a critic. Sorry If I am wrong here but this what I feel here..Unless u write offensive very specific on someone and that someone expresses any concerns then I believe u r obliged to answer. Rest You Don’t. It’s that simple. I mean that’s the problem with this online bullying and Rants. They play all the mind games that suck one’s energy and you know clearly this is not about the writing or the opinions. This is something else.
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GODZ
July 30, 2017
and this might help
http://www.wpbeginner.com/plugins/how-to-allow-users-to-report-inappropriate-comments-in-wordpress/
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sravishanker1401gmailcom
July 30, 2017
GODZ : That was a great comment. You said exactly what I wanted to say.
BR : Sincerely hope this doesnt put the brakes on the flow of your pen. Im sure there is some rhythm factor to it. My comment was more in exasperation than anything else. Ultimately in online groups (or whatsapp groups) its the broad consensus on what is offensive and what is not offensive that would become the rule and anything untoward would get called out.
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sanjana
July 30, 2017
The best way is to avoid obvious pitfalls and potholes.
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Honest Raj (formerly 'V'enkatesh)
July 30, 2017
BR, I’m not criticising you. 🙂 You’ve been equally fair towards men and women. Some are funny:
“GV Prakash Kumar (sporting a beard that seems to weigh almost as much as he does) … ”
Don’t think even GVP himself would take offence at this.
I find the “famous for his body shaming of women” thing a little baffling, that’s all. 🙂
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Madan Mohan
July 30, 2017
@BR: That example would indeed qualify as body shaming. But body shaming wasn’t even a word at that time, if I am not mistake. Heck, I have been fat shamed plenty since the time I was a child and it’s not like I was ever Inzy plump. I am not saying that makes it ok, but surely people have to recognise that the norms of what is or isn’t acceptable in vocabulary has changed a lot. Even a usage like Afro-American (as opposed to African American) is considered derogatory today but if somebody used it back when it wasn’t, I don’t really know if it can be held against him or how it would be productive to do so. It WAS acceptable at a certain point of time to call somebody fat if he/she was indeed fat. I have experienced this dissonance myself because when in school I wrote a horrible poem for some relative (an infant to be specific) in USA where I used the word fat only to be told that fat was a derogatory word there. I had not meant offence in the slightest because in the cultural norms I was familiar with, it was acceptable and I was often at the receiving end.
Now if you have done something like that Nayanthara example in a recent review/write up (especially for the ahem non left leaning Film Companion), I would not condone it.
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Rahini David
July 31, 2017
Honest Raj: This thread will eat up a lot of your time. So read when really free.
I will mention here that I liked the main article a LOT and while I do see the point some people are making there, I can’t see that article in the “BR is fine with female body shaming but not men” sense.
There are 2 other very similar threads but I don’t remember where.
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brangan
July 31, 2017
Rahini David: Coincidentally, FC retweeted this today… Go, figure!
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rothrocks
July 31, 2017
@ BRangan : Curious world that we live in. People take a lot more liberty in telling a man to lose weight, even in the workplace, whereas such a comment to a woman would immediately land the offender in trouble. But a man may, if he chooses to, simply ignore such advice and still succeed even in a very looks centric profession. A woman does not have that luxury; Vidya Balan is an exception rather than the norm. There are baby steps like that very overweight Hollywood comedienne enjoying (modest?) success and I remember music reality show The Stage actively promoting a fat contestant possibly out of diversity considerations rather than pure talent (which I am not criticising because some of the other finalists stank anyway). But that apart, mainstream norms haven’t changed at all. Thus, the word policing PC doctrine has failed to substantively reform behaviour. Because it is not enough that people be polite and not insult people for how they look if the criteria of desirability are unchanged from what they used to be. That we fundamentally want to see only slim and beautiful actresses in lead roles means the objectification of women is well alive beneath the veil of politically correct vocab.
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brangan
July 31, 2017
Actually, I did not mean to body shame anyone in that piece. (Though my intent and what the reader perceives may be two entirely different things.) I was just batting for people’s right on screen to be non-gym-shaped 🙂
This is the key line, I thought.
“Rather than remarking that Madhavan needs to drop a few kilos, maybe we should begin to discuss if Bipasha’s wardrobe needs to be equipped with love handles.”
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Rahini David
July 31, 2017
I know right? I thought people were going to be pretty pleased with all the honest writing and all that.
If I am not very wrong, the people who disliked that piece want you to insert something like “Deepika and Diana look pretty but I feel sad that more normal looking girls with regular features aren’t featured more” in a review of Cocktail. If you feel sad about it, you’d say so and if that thought didn’t occur you’d not say so and that is all there is to it. You can’t say things to balance it out. That would make your writing look stuffed and bulky.
Maybe you’d incur less wrath if you had finished the review with “This is probably what the feminists have been saying all along, now my eye are opened to the problems of being a woman”. But at the end of it all expecting another human to think your thoughts is silly. A simple “Ah, now you know how we feel” and a smiley would have actually made the men to consider the problem without getting on the defensive. Starting a decent dialogue would have been so easy given the tone of the piece.
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Jyoti S Kumar
July 31, 2017
Madan, when I talked about Know giving outsiders more opportunities, one example that comes to my mind is that of AR Rahman, who constantly gave chances to newcomers when the music industry was ruled by a handful few. His work of having an academy open for all ages also ensures that he is constantly in touch with new and worthy talent. Like any industry, movie industry also has high entry barriers. That is where college and the placements play a role in somewhat leveling the field and overcoming the entry barrier. Whether we accept or not, TV show like nalaya iyakkunar and all the super singers have somewhat helped a new crop of talent to emerge in Tamil film industry.
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Honest Raj (formerly 'V'enkatesh)
July 31, 2017
Rahini David: Ha ha, I found that piece yesterday. While I understand that the above line (which BR has quoted in this thread) can be a little problematic, I don’t see a reason why people were offended by this:
“The problem with Jodi Breakers isn’t Madhavan but Bipasha Basu, whose time would be better spent with an acting coach instead of a personal trainer.”
The counter-argument is Strawman at best!
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Kay
July 31, 2017
That was one vitriolic, cringe inducing comment. Like Anuja said, good riddance of bad rubbish. BR, over this weekend I binged on few of the threads and I’m appalled by the level of hatred spewed by Anuj and arielsomebody. I agree with you on freedom of expression and that’s one of the reasons that I have frequented this blog, but you really need to start moderating the comments, if only to stop the negativities spread by those comments. Getting personal and name calling is just not acceptable.
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Jyoti S Kumar
July 31, 2017
Godz, I have to slightly disagree with you on this
A critic is a critic and you cannot be mindful of each and every sentence
He has to be mindful of each and every sentence because he is being read in the national media. When we talk here about how actor’s have an influence on the masses, atleast his words also has an impact on the reading community.
And like BR sir said, the comment was useful (though it was distasteful) because it made him retrospect his own work and come up with the article of 2005. For eg, if Nayanthara did go around feeling offended for that comment, ( if it was written about me, I am sure I would have moped about it atleast for a day), then again comes the allegations that she is playing the victim card, she is playing the woman card, blah blah blah.
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sanjana
July 31, 2017
A pleasant face is more appealing than a chiselled body with not so pleasant face. If it is both, then they are quite lucky. Konkona Sen is not a typical beauty, yet her personality is appealing. Madhavan is appealing because he has a good smile and friendly face.
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Venky
July 31, 2017
Seriously, that comment by Arielsomebody made me puke. Yes, please install moderation plugins. P.S. Bora Bora shall aways remain the most delightful island where ardent lovers of your blog go and enjoy your writing!
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Kay
July 31, 2017
A lot many views have been expressed on nepotism and the role it plays in film industry or any other field for that matter. I’m not here to say if i agree with it or not. However, the fact remains that we can find examples of nepotism on every field that I can think of. Casting is a business decision taken by producers and we, the public, can’t question it unless we are shareholders in the company.
But I think all this outrage on the issue is because of the privileged few keep denying that they have been fortunate in getting a platform for their debut. To quote an article in Huffington Post, “It would be amusing, if it wasn’t also faintly revolting, how almost everyone who comes from a Bollywood family wants to talk almost exclusively about success, while being perfectly happy to ignore the looming elephant in the room: access.”
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Madan
August 1, 2017
@ Jyoti S Kumar: Agreed, Rahman did promote a lot of new singers as well as gave prominence to the musicians. As for the talent shows, they have been around before as well. It’s just that they never used the sms vote pattern and thus could not assure music directors that the singer had a readymade fan following already (which Indian Idol/Super Singer have established). Even so, the success of the singers has been mixed since then (and this is more easily observed in Bollywood whereas most of the Super Singer winners/runners up have landed assignments). Vipul Mehta, the winner of the 2012 Indian Idol, was very talented but hasn’t recorded songs at least in Bollywood last I checked. However, one of the other contestants, Devender Singh,bagged a song in Luv Shuv Tey Chicken Khurana right away.
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tonks
August 1, 2017
Reading that Twitter post comment about MR asking Madhavan to shed weight reminds me again (at the risk of objectifying a little) of how much better he looks now than before, with his salt and pepper hair and the sculpted body. Even the hint of laugh lines and crow feet add to the appeal. (Isn’t life a tad unfair when wrinkles and grey hair enhance sex appeal in males?)
Speaking of body shaming, is Malayalam the only language where the word “Nannayee” (euphemism for ‘youve gained some weight’) is a compliment? I can think of so many plus size on screen heroines (off the top of my head : Kavya Madhavan, Seema, Sheela) and heroes (um, nearly all of the older generation ones, I think 😋)
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tonks
August 1, 2017
Yikes, the drool smiley is a typo. (That may be transferred to the Madhavan sentence however 😉)
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Namrata Joshi
August 9, 2017
I know this thread is all but dead for now, but I will still try my luck. I just thought of a point I haven’t heard being discussed in this whole debate: how long it will take before the lesser talented star kids fall by the wayside. Whenever this point has been brought up, people bring the equivalent of 3-4 movies (I’d guess that amounts to about 4-5 years of filmmaking time and resources) before the less-than-stellar starkids are weeded out. So, these people say, life is pretty fair, afterall. But how about an Abhishek Bacchan? He began in 2000, and started to gain some success around 2004-05. During this brief period, he was celebrated as the best thing since sliced bread (much like folks have been doing for Ranbir Kapoor since Rockstar and Barfi). I recall the Koffee with Karan episode where everyone on set and those interviewed were drooling over how talented and handsome (yes) they thought Abhishek was. This celebratory attitude lasted well into his early years of marriage with his missus. People really only gave up on him (including people like KJohar who no longer seems to want to cast his friend), and started to consider him as a failed starkid around the time. Basically, he had around 16 flops before his first bonafide hit, Dhoom1. Thereafter, till around 2010, he was still considered a success although his ratio of failures to successes was still alarmingly high.
(Let’s not bring up his father for two reasons: even though his films were failing, he was able to land jobs without the type of recommendations his son now receives by merely being his progeny. Secondly, if we equate the success, memorability, and monetary success of Amitabh’s films since Zanjeer, his successes clearly trump and outweight his past failures. Not so in his son’s case.)
Even now, as a failed starkid, he still gets work, some sort of fame, and a good paycheck. It is anyone’s guess if this is due to daddy pulling strings or something else. But, we are all (I think even hard lined enthusiasts of Abhishek would agree) certain that unless he does something very drastically good, he will join the legion of starkids remembered for their families and for having tried to be stars.
But, my question is this: while I agree that he will not be a legend, but in spite of his less-than-stellar record, the type of resources, jobs, and paychecks Abhishek Bachan still earns would put the talented Nawaz, KK Menon and their ilk to shame. Same for Ranbir although the Bwood bigwigs are still trying to bet on his success, and giving him the choicest of roles and movies.
I realize that this is a private enterprise and people are free to throw their money down the drain if they so desire, but why do I get the feeling that the system of making and selling popular Hindi movies, and the audience, are being exploited to make sure Bwood remains an old-boys club and no one new enters their ranks? KK Menon once, in his interview, made a very prescient remark a few years before people like Kjohar blatantly started to create their own stars, about the fact that short-term (5-10 years) stars can be created quite easily. All that is needed is the monetary resources and the will on the part of the person with access to those resources. How true! He would know as he is one of the talented ones who have to wait endlessly for roles to justify his talents. Same for Ranvir Shorey, Vinay Pathak, filmmaker Rajat Kapoor, etc.
What does someone who believes Kangana’s remarks and the entire issue is overblown, feel about this facet of star kids and manufactured short-term stardom that I have mentioned here?
I also think that people are being far too confident of Alia Bhatt. Yes, she is relatively talented, and yes, she will get plum roles based on her mentor’s recommendation, and a fat paycheck, but I do not think that she will be remembered for long and unless she does something as drastic as the type of notice Deepika got following Cocktail. This decade of Hindi movies will likely be remembered for Deepikas, Anuskhas, and yes, Kanganas. I know she has her fans, but I have the same feeling for Kareena Kapoor. i know she was treated as the best thing ever to arrive in Bwood in the decade of 2000. THereafter, she was seen as an example of talent surviving while Abhishek was seen as an example of no-talent-no-survival narrative bandied about starkids. But now, as the generation that was school and college-going when her movies were most frequently made and released, prepares to enter their middle adulthood, people are starting to question her entire approach to stardom, and whether she deserves here accolades or not. Afterall, a JWM and possibly, Talaash are the only redeemers in her otherwise dismal filmography. And her once luminous hubby too has a dismal record of films for a very long time.
So, yes, time will render things more equal. Afterall, how many will remember ABjr for his films and not famous connections? About the same that remember Kumar Gaurav’s movie roles (which is the audience that was young and interested in Bwood while his movies were being made, and another handful of enthusiasts of all things antiquated in Hindi movies)! I am sorry if I sound snarky but I am surprized that people, specifically so many average-joes, find nothing odd about Alia’a career, KJo’s approach and snarkiness, and the inordinate amount of resources starkids take for themselves. I mean, a KK Menon gets paid a pittance compared to Abhishek’s paycheck. Does this not startle people out of their stupor, and make them even a trifle enraged? I miss KK while I have Abhishek films still being made. How is this not worthy of at least some comment and more?
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ramitbajaj01
August 9, 2017
@Namrata Joshi
While I agree with your overall point that Bollywood should be a talent oriented industry and not nepotism based, I want to address a few things.
Abhishek no longer gets a lead role. He is a supporting star now. And, Nawaz and Irfan are more successful than Abhishek. They get more movies per year than Abhishek.
Alia may have got a headstart, but she also has talent. She has got critical acclaims for most of her movies.
I guess ‘star creation’ is like any other product launch. If it hits, it hits. And if they are ticking all the basic checkboxes then what’s the problem? Given all the exposure to world cinema, if we are still getting sub par movies then the filmmakers are no more guilty than the audience.
If producers hire genuine talent then it would be a win-win situation for Bollywood. It can help create long-term stars( khans, akshay), leaving the brand creation from scratch redundant every time a new star kid matures.
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Jai
September 9, 2017
Now that Kangana is again in the news with a polarizing interview, we need to delink the debate over nepotism in the film industry (a very valid issue, where insiders and star kids do have an advantage over “outsiders”), from judgements over Kangana’s personality, either way.
Asides about Kangana’s mental balance (or lack of it) and purported drug use do not and should not detract from the valid points she made about the “Old Boy’s network” operating in the film industry. But equally, it’s rather disingenuous to try and build this narrative of victimhood and spotless bravery around her, portraying her as always courageously facing down odds. Such a stand is, contrarily, a bit condescending and in fact, does not recognize the fact that Kangana herself has agency and quite a bit of influence and “newsworthiness”, which she, like anyone else in her position might do, is using to her advantage.
I’ve seen comments on this thread seeking to establish a continuum about how she earlier faced down a bullying attack from Hrithik Roshan, and then with KJo, Saif & Varun. The issue with such a “black or white” portrayal is, in her fracas with Hrithik, much of the film industry was in fact neutral, with many in fact speaking out in favor of Kangana. (Vidya Balan comes to mind, and there were several others too). In fact, HR was reported to be very cut up by the lack of support he received, from many people he thought he was close to.
There were enough holes and inconsistencies in both their stories—and in at least one detail (Kangana’s claim of HR proposing to her at the Eiffel Tower), there was solid evidence (HR’s passport), that he wasn’t even out of India when that incident claimed by Kangana happened. Whether she was embellishing/embroidering facts or whether it was an outright lie, is up for debate. But clearly, this past fracas continues to preoccupy Kangana. Even after a mutual agreement was reportedly reached between her and HR’s lawyers/camps, to withdraw their cases against each other and quietly bury the issue, now is at least the second time Kangana has again come out to take potshots at HR. And whatever may be the rights and wrongs of the matter, one has to admit that HR has shown a lot more dignity in respecting that reported agreement and not repeatedly washing dirty linen in public, after that agreement was reached.
As Sona Mohapatra said, probably Kangana needs to rise above this muck now. The recent interview seems just like an attempt to generate publicity for herself and frankly, is in rather poor taste. Again—-I am not saying that Kangana’s persona and likability (or lack of it), should detract from the valid points she is raising (wrt nepotism). But the converse is also true. As in, when one seeks to bolster her stand with judgements about her bravery and admirability, one risks losing focus on the points at hand—because Kangana, just as many people (in the film industry or otherwise) isn’t always behaving in an admirable manner.
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GODZ
October 5, 2017
Statement from Hritik Roshan..
I have been harassed by this for 4 years and the well-meaning and probably necessary social bias toward women has deemed me helpless in defending myself.
https://www.ndtv.com/entertainment/hrithik-roshan-speaks-finally-never-met-kangana-ranaut-in-private-read-his-statement-1758933?pfrom=home-lateststories
If a film star cannot defend himself, then think about ordinary Munna and Suppan? We are so biased in our societal model where the victim is always a female. Wont woman lie? Won’t they commit harassment? When genuine concerns are raised the so-called feminist group immediately silence those voice in the name of misogyny. I am not saying Woman do not suffer in the hands of man..But there is always another side too. When will our mindset change on this? But the fact remains. The current society especially the urban mindset is so biased that a “fair” woman can commit an abuse or a crime and walk away playing the woman card.
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Doba
May 14, 2022
So a new movie called Archies is coming out and this is what NDTV says
Speaking of the film’s cast – all of them have impeccable genes. Suhana Khan, daughter of superstar Shah Rukh Khan and interior decorator Gauri Khan, has inherited her love for acting from her father SRK. Agastya is the son of author Shweta Bachchan Nanda and business tycoon Nikhil Nanda. He is the grandchild of Bollywood veterans Amitabh Bachchan and Jaya Bachchan. Khushi Kapoor is the daughter of late superstar Sridevi and film producer Boney Kapoor. Her sister Janhvi Kapoor also features in Bollywood films.
Bollywood heard the public and responded with screw you! Wonderful! Of a 1.4 billion population, Shah rukh khan’s daughter, Sridevi’s daughter, and Amitabh Bachchan’s grandson are naturally the most talented and beautiful.
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Ramit
May 15, 2022
@Doba, nepotism aside, I am feeling very excited about The Archies. I love Zoya’s oeuvre. Enjoyed thoroughly the vibe in the cast announcement video.
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brangan
May 15, 2022
Ramit: So if Zoya does it, it’s okay, but if Karan does it, it’s not? 🙂
Kidding. Kidding. Kidding.
I, too,l loved the vibe of the whole thing, though one thing that puzzles me about Zoya is that she is one of our best directors and — with the exception of LUCK BY CHANCE — she keeps choosing material that is either derivative or (IMO) not deserving of her.
I mean, of course it’s her prerogative what she wants to do. Still…
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Ramit
May 15, 2022
I am feeling equally excited for the latest season of Koffee with Karan, though can’t say the same about Rocky Rani something or Brahmastra 🙂
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Jai
May 15, 2022
Hmm…..little puzzled by statements about the Archies trailer/casting announcement video being impressive. Leave aside the nepotism angle for a bit – though ofc it’s mind boggling in itself for Zoya to be slavishly launching 3 star kids in one film – but in what part of India and in what era is this Archies spin off set in??
Yes, I get that it’s an adaptation of the comics and a certain preppy feel and wannabe attitude comes with the territory, but surely Zoya ought to have picked up some cues from the flak SOTY got? That was pretty much an Archies remake too, with the minor variation that the “Archie” character was played by Alia, Veronica’s by Varun Dhawan and Betty’s by Sid. If Zoya wanted to remake the remake, surely she could have been a tad more “realistic” in translating the preppiness?
I’m still hoping that this will be a kind of meta spoof (on the lines of how the recent Netflix film the woman across the street from the girl in the window spoofed the “neighbourhood amateur sleuth who has substance abuse issues” genre), but unfortunately I’m fairly sure Zoya is in painful earnest about showing an actual, literal translation of the Archies comics on screen.
Ah well. I just hope we get the episode where Betty and Veronica battle over Archie and he instead chooses Cheryl Blossom over either of them! 🙂
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Madan
May 15, 2022
” but in what part of India and in what era is this Archies spin off set in??” – Thank you! Why do the boys look like HRHK or Randhir Kapoor in Jawani Deewani? The original Archies was set in a middle class neighbourhood and Riverdale High is like a typical public school in an American suburb. So why do these kids have a boarding school vibe about them? Is this just yet another nostalgia fest? Why NOT take the ‘risk’ of taking the story to a contemporary Indian setting (which would both get older viewers who have read Archies comics interested AND also interest young viewers who may not have read the comics or see the fuss about it)? That could have taken off like a rocket if done well or so I would have thought. But I think Bollywood prefers to keep boring Gen Z and younger to the point that they permanently move to English fans and then, ten years down the line, we will probably have Karan and Zoya and the rest lamenting their distaste for Hindi Kalachar (the irony!).
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Madan
May 15, 2022
*English films, not fans
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Madan
May 15, 2022
” though ofc it’s mind boggling in itself for Zoya to be slavishly launching 3 star kids in one film” – In a sense, it’s not given that she cast Hrithik, Abhay and bro Farhan in ZNMD. It’s a different matter that all three essayed their roles well in that film and Kalki was a bad advertisement for outside talent, if I may. But their obsession with film family and friends is writ large over that film too. And not to get political but that is why the whole Anglo-centric liberal order has crumbled to next to nothing now. What is the point of your high minded un-bigoted secular values if you can’t think beyond your own film fraternity when you make films and only find SoBo/Bandra or Europe to be appealing locations to shoot films (Gully Boy being the notable exception)? Hypocrisy ki seema nahi, in short.
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Rahul
May 15, 2022
To me the Archie’s video seems like something suhana khan and their friends made for a summer project and it was released as a prank but now they are pretending they were serious to begin with
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Jai
May 15, 2022
@Madan, wrt “In a sense, it’s not given that she cast Hrithik, Abhay and bro Farhan in ZNMD. “, Well pointed out and you’re right. It’s just that ZA has this image (IMO deserved) of being a filmmaker with more depth/nuanced takes if one could put it that way. Which perhaps shifts the focus a bit away from the predominantly-within industry nature of her casting choices. LBC being case in point, thoroughly enjoyable film, though ofc she did cast Farhan as the lead.
ZNMD , IMO at least, came across as a tad pretentious, but at least the strong performances (Hrithik’s albeit a tad forced and overblown) carried it through as you mentioned.
Which is why in this case, I’m frankly puzzled not only by the craven attitude of casting 3 industry kids (which could be excused as a means to the mega publicity the film could get, a la the slobbering ndtv article), but also the subject matter. Why on earth would a director like Zoya be content to choose this vehicle, in this style, is what I’m wondering. It’s not as if she’s breaking any real ground here, SOTY and SOTY 2 were candy floss, glitzy, soulless Archies remakes in all but name.
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praneshp
May 15, 2022
@brangan: glad to see you are back!
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Madhu
May 15, 2022
I cannot get over the big noses of all the kids. They look like a bunch of Jewish kids in some American suburb in the ’70’s/’60’s? Is this set in India? Did people dress like this in India? I realized it is an Indian show only when the Hindi song started playing.
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MANK
May 15, 2022
Bollywood heard the public and responded with screw you! Wonderful! Of a 1.4 billion population, Shah rukh khan’s daughter, Sridevi’s daughter, and Amitabh Bachchan’s grandson are naturally the most talented and beautiful.
LOL Doba. this is going to be the SoBo epic to end all SoBo films. I feel sorry for KJo- getting outsmarted by Zoya like this. I loved Luck By Chance, but since then Zoya has been going downhill. Brangan is going to have a field day with this one- picking apart Zoya’s Listening Hindi Hearing English dialogues; that’s if this is really in Hindi and set in India
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Doba
May 15, 2022
Madan – The ugly bigoted hate speech by a Kangana Ranaut is rightly criticized and shunned by liberal media. But the sophisticated othering of the poor by rich India gets a free pass again and again. People have commented that the folks who make these movies don’t dress, talk or act Indian. But that’s the outside stuff. That is the imitation of the West. So they have the superficial wokeness about race and feminism and stuff that doesn’t concern them directly. The inside stuff- the innate casteism in the ugly Indian – the lack of awareness of privilege, the belief that privilege stems from our karma, genes, inheritance whatnot, the determined rejection of criticism, developing a thick hide to escape criticism,… that we can’t escape from, even if we are rich and secular. Especially if we are rich! I have now heard Zoya Akhtar, Saif Ali Khan, and Kabir Khan speak on this subject. All of them are successful, rich, secular, and supposedly articulate. The only feeling I come away with is a feeling of profound disgust and disillusionment that as a country we are never going to escape from the viciousness of caste and its modern avatar of class. It is the same with politics. A Yogi Adityanath’s horrendous statements are pulled up and criticized. But the quid-pro-quo between Modi-Shah and the Gujarati businessmen gets a free pass from the media. It is the blue-collar crime vs. the white-collar crime. Both are evil but the latter gets sugar-coated under words like lobbying, development, talent whatnot.
MANK – I liked Luck By Chance too mostly for the amazing Konkana Sen. I watched ZNMD but stopped in the middle and Dil Dhadakne Do somewhere before that. They were so boring. I respect BR as a reviewer too much to dispute his claim that she is one of the best directors of India. But her movies don’t work for me.
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Prat
May 15, 2022
Why did they even bother making this in Hindi? Why not make it directly in English given that it’s slated for OTT release?
@Doba – Great points on the sophisticated othering of the poor. Bollywood has been so obsessed with the 1% of rich Indians and pretending that the other 99% don’t exist. Multiplex movie after multiplex movie of characters living the American life, wearing American clothes, thinking American thoughts in India, and KJo had the gall to bemoan the demise of masala movies and Indian sensibility that his movies were directly responsible for.
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Madan
May 15, 2022
“The only feeling I come away with is a feeling of profound disgust and disillusionment that as a country we are never going to escape from the viciousness of caste and its modern avatar of class.” – Word. I actually wrote about this back in 2006.
I don’t know anymore exactly what I saw back then, heh. Shows how easily the past gets rose-tinted but I had been paying attention to the stuff concealed by high economic growth. Now that stuff is front and center because growth is hard to come by. In 2006, the phenomenon of rich guys owning fancy cars speeding dangerously and noisily on the road was just about starting to take root. Now, of course, driving etiquette is virtually non existent.
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Rahul
May 15, 2022
Doba , Surely the media isn’t doing its job properly but there has been at least one big expose about crony capitalism back in 2020 that does not get much traction in popular discourse and for that everyone of us is to blame. Here, you can browse stories related to Electoral bonds
https://www.reporters-collective.in/team-members/nitin-sethi. (search for electoral bonds on the page)
And this is from a few days back
https://thewire.in/economy/govt-agency-confirms-centres-auctions-allowed-millers-to-corner-pulses-meant-for-the-poor
The problem is that unless the bigotry is addressed, people do not really care about these issues. If you confront a Modi supporter about electoral bonds they will come up with lame excuses and question the validity of the source.
(contd.)
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Rahul
May 15, 2022
Doba, the other point I wanted to make was regarding this line – “we are never going to escape from the viciousness of caste and its modern avatar of class. ” I think you should reconsider the conflation of caste and class. Class is not a modern avatar of caste and it will never override caste. Caste is still very much present, everywhere, even among the diaspora.
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Jai
May 15, 2022
@MANK – as to “that’s if this is really in Hindi and set in India” – yeah well, it’s being reported now that this is indeed set in India, from the 1960s. 🙂 Let’s see if Zoya manages to get her crew to get the inflection and flow of the 60s lingo right (am sure my parents would be able to point out errors if there are any, as and when they see this…..I doubt they would bother, though)!!
It’s almost a given with this cast (and with the director) that the dialogues would be a Hinglish cocktail. Nothing wrong with that, ofc. But which hinglish…..I would be quite curious to find out if they manage to get the everyday YA speak of the 60s to bear here, or if they can’t help but segue into millennial jargon.
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Rahul
May 16, 2022
Here she is bullying Ananya Pandey
Its a dilemma for me to resolve, to be against nepotism but not end up on the same side as Kangana.
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