Read the full article on Film Companion, here: http://www.filmcompanion.in/article/southern-lights-music-beyond-the-maestro
Is older music (other than that composed by Ilayaraja) gradually being phased out of common cultural memory?
The opening ceremony of the 15th Chennai International Film Festival began with a spectacular performance by Anuradha Sriram, who led the audience through eight decades of Tamil cinema with a medley of songs – with a line or two from each. She began with the MK Thyagaraja Bhagavathar era, went on to the fifties, sixties, and then, she reached the Ilayaraja era. That’s when the applause began, that’s when the whistles began to pierce the air.
I was stunned for a couple of reasons. One, I thought the audience would be – given the occasion – a little more decorous, and it was wonderful to be proved wrong. If this is how we express our enjoyment, there’s no reason it should be otherwise at a festival showcasing the best of world cinema. The other reason for my surprise was that the audience chose to express themselves this way only during the Ilayaraja section. There’s no denying our love for the maestro’s music, and no accolade is really enough – my surprise was more about why there wasn’t any love expressed for, say, Nilave ennidam nerungathey, the MS Viswanathan/PB Srinivas jewel from Ramu.
Continued at the link above.
Copyright ©2017 Film Companion.
Baradwaj Rangan 
Raju
December 21, 2017
“which young person listens to the radio anyway?” Gosh! That seems too harsh a generalisation, BR! I, for one, am an avid radio listener(I am in my late twenties), and I have quite a bunch of friends who also listen to the radio. The numbers may have reduced drastically, but I don’t think it has gone totally out of fashion with the younger generation. The way I see it, it seems much better in towns and villages than in cities, but even there, I feel it’s not so bad as to warrant such a question.
Btw, “Nilave ennidam nerungathe” is one of my favourite non-ilayaraja classics, but I never heard this shankar-ganesh song till now. Thanks for the intro. As you say, SPB is great here too!
LikeLike
KP
December 21, 2017
O Mele kekathe
LikeLike
shaviswa
December 21, 2017
I am one of those freaks who has a folder with only T Rajendar songs 🙂 – I listen to songs from the late 1950s. Somehow the MKT songs and the early G Ramanathan songs do not work for me. I prefer the era when MSV-Ramamurthy and AM Rajah began to rule the sound waves. I listen to Nilavae Ennidam ever so often 🙂
Ilaiyaraja’s popularity is due to two reasons –
1) He was too prolific that he has left us with such a HUGE bank of songs to choose from depending on our mood. He has 100s of songs across the entire spectrum from folk to carnatic; mellisai to rock. The man was simply astoundingly productive (and creative).
2) A lot of Tamizh unarvalargal have been extra active on the social media in hyping an already astounding array of songs. For many of them, Ilaiyaraja songs identify with the Tamil culture. Rahman, despite his ella pughayum iraivanukkae Oscar speech, is the urban guy who creates “international music.” To these people, IMO, Ilaiyaraja took Tamizh-isai to international audience. Rahman has brought international music to Tamizh audience. That is the reason you see so many articles about his music on the net. They pirichu-menchu-fy his songs to extents that even Raja may not have thought about.
Slowly, a cult group of Raja fanatics has been formed. And these groups are further aided by film makers who talk about Raja music in every opportunity they get; using his songs or BGMs in movies to convey a mood, etc etc. And this has helped sustain the Raja legend over the last couple of decades. This cult group tries to show its fanatic affiliation for anything related to Raja and his music everywhere. Irrespective of the show being an international film festival or even an art appreciation workshop.
The only place where this cult group is forced to be silent is in an Ilaiyaraja show. Raja admonishes this crowd and makes them remain silent. 🙂
LikeLike
Tambi Dude
December 21, 2017
Ha. Eons ago when I use to be active in TFM page, a common theme was IR fans glorifying him as god and no better composer came in the past or will arrive in future. The certitude !!!
LikeLike
Deepa
December 21, 2017
So true BR. I have also seen the comments on the you tube channels, how even to this day Raja ‘s songs stay evergreen and how the present generation too participates in the discussions.
BTW Nilave ennidam nerungathey can be so disturbing and depressing. Now, it has become the stuck song for the rest of the day.
LikeLike
RaghuCA
December 21, 2017
I try listening songs from all generations. As with any art or technology not-the-best or seasonal stuff get filtered out over the time. Samething is happening with non-ilayaraja composers. They gave some great songs, but not enough to be remembered in the same way as we do ilayaraja.
Another reason (the main one) is the multi-dimensional aspect of the ilayaraja’s music. You can easily name 100s of his songs where almost every aspect (melody, dynamics, orchestration, background, singing and mood) is topclass and they all happen together to create magic. That is not true for any other music director (current or past). Even the best songs of other directors are great at only few of these aspects (mostly melody, singing and mood). So, every listener can find something they like about ilayaraja’s songs.
So, basically breadth and depth of ilayaraja music is unmatched (not even close) so far. In my opinion, ilayaraja’s music will not get filtered out unless there comes another genius like him and dedicates his entire life for music.
LikeLiked by 2 people
Madan
December 21, 2017
Interesting write up about an interesting topic. I have thought about this too; while I do like some or in fact many of MSV/TKR-MSV’s songs, they are in the ‘nice-to-have’ rather than ‘must-have’ category for me. And while I do love the golden oldies of Bolly, the vocal performance and whether it captivates me has a much larger weight in my preference there. So…because I don’t like Hemant Kumar’s singing very much, I don’t really like the songs he has sung for SDB or his own compositions very much either. To take the argument further, I also listen to a lot of Western music and some of which would easily in my deserted island collection. But…would I have been happy just digging deeper and deeper into IR’s back catalogue? For sure, because there’s so much to explore there that it’s enough to keep listeners busy for a lifetime.
Ilayaraja represents a seminal chapter in our film music and arguably our music per se, even that of the world. I don’t care if the above statement automatically slots me as a IR fanboy for many. As I referred to above, I have run the gamut from King Crimson to Coltrane to Beethoven, so my horizon is broad enough, thank you very much. But composers like Ilayaraja only come along once in a lifetime. That 70 years of film music produced only one Ilayaraja is proof enough. Naturally, this puts the composers who preceded him at a disadvantage. Ilayaraja was and is somehow able to marry authentically Western harmony with authentically Indian melody. That incredible confluence has only been managed fleetingly by Rahman since and in a much less ambitious way. The composers after Rahman largely struggle to compose in Indian melody. So Ilayaraja is Western enough for youngsters and Indian enough for oldies. In short, his work has stood the test of time and will in all likelihood resonate with listeners for many more years to come.
LikeLike
praneshp
December 21, 2017
@shaviswa: Ha, “admonishes” is an understatement.
LikeLiked by 3 people
Vivek narain
December 22, 2017
Seems like Ilayaraja is equivalent of Shanker Jaikishen, but then SJ were protege of the legend Naushad. Wonder who is the tamil legend.
LikeLike
Arjun
December 22, 2017
But that’s the way things are world over. In the US, classic rock stations hardly play anything from the 60s that isn’t Beatles. My opinion is that popular music has a lifespan of about 50 years or 2.5 generations. By then, the oldest people who listened to it in their youth are dead and there are no longer residual cultural memories for the younger generation to relate to and things get lost in the mists of time and abundance. If any music has to survive beyond that (outside of cult followings), its study needs to be formalized as is the case with classical music. So unless study and performance of Ilayaraja’s music is institutionalized in music schools and universities, even that won’t survive beyond another generation or 2.
LikeLiked by 1 person
Tambi Dude
December 22, 2017
Arjun: What you are telling is that it is very difficult to have a close relationship with film music one has not listened to while growing up. I have heard this argument before and I do think there is lot of truth in it. You listen to a song -> you recollect the movie -> you recollect the year -> then you recollect what you were doing at that time. Sometimes I have experienced that if a particular movie is associated with bad times in your life, you just dislike listening to those songs, regardless of its merit.
At one time I was a die hard IR fan too. Since then I have realized that the popularity of a particular era can not span multiple generations. No wonder film music is heavily skewed towards newer songs.
LikeLiked by 2 people
Tambi Dude
December 22, 2017
” In the US, classic rock stations hardly play anything from the 60s that isn’t Beatles. ”
Not true in case of New York Classic Rock Station Q104.3. They play Led Zepplin, Pink Floyd, Deep Purple, The WHo, Rolling Stones as much as Beatles. They don’t play Jethro Tull as much as I would like.
Due to over exposure, I have lost interest in Beatles.
LikeLike
Madan
December 22, 2017
@Arjun While I agree about Beatles overshadowing the rest of the 60s music, we see that 80s Hindi music does not have the same connect as that of the 60s and the 70s. As such, 80s music hasn’t aged well, barring Raja, metal and a bunch of ‘notable exceptions’. My father was in his formative years during MM’s heyday and he says songs like Tum Jo Mil Gaye Ho are more popular now than back then. So it’s probably a bit more complicated.
LikeLike
Filistine
December 22, 2017
I do think T Rajendar was an under-rated musician. In an era of Ilaiyaraja wannabes, he managed to create a sound scape of his own. And man, he could write! He wove in some delicate poetry into his songs.
Vizhigal medayam, salangaiyittal oru madhu, thatti parthen kottanguchi, kadhal oorvalam Inge, koodaiyile karuvadu…..
Brilliant stuff
LikeLiked by 2 people
Mani
December 22, 2017
Remembered the LOL moment as the gangster in Jigarthanda firmly proclaims ‘Naa Sankar Ganesh rasigan’
LikeLike
Rahini David
December 22, 2017
You can write another “Coco” with this.
Each song is in song heaven. A song dies from song heaven after it is played the last time on earth radio stations. Some songs just live longer than others.
I feel sorry when I realized that I was just attributing non-Illayaraja songs to him just because they were reasonably popular in the 80s or 90s.
Now I realize that I never understood that I was misattributing several Vaali songs to either Kannadasan or Vairamuthu until very recently. And so are several other people. It is a sort of Mandela Effect. So many people misattribute a song and the lie becomes a truth though nobody intends to deliberately deceive. Recently I have become a HUGE Vaali fan.
LikeLike
niranjanmb
December 22, 2017
@Vivek narain: No, SJ’s impact vs Ilaiyaraaja’s are incomparable. If you are talking about their market value at that time, perhaps yes. But someone who has had a much deeper impact in Hindu Film Music is RDB, and of course, if you look at the channels/shows that air the oldies, SDB. In fact Raaja’s impact has been so profound that many of the current crop of composers even in Hindi name him as one of their chief inspirations.
I think Raaja is appreciated more for another reason: he was ahead of his time. While they became big hits then because of the groove/sheer melodic impact, many of his songs have even becomes retrograde hits now because of his sheer mastery over harmony and counterpoint that he employed regularly. No one comes even remotely close.
LikeLiked by 2 people
Aravindan R
December 22, 2017
Rahini, Exactly the same “coco” parallel occurred to me too! In that story, the song “ilamai idho idho” would visit the ‘song earth’ every new year without fail! 🙂
This story has a good potential!
LikeLike
shaviswa
December 22, 2017
One aspect of Raja music that I like is the melodic hook in his songs. That forms the base – the orchestrations and classical music influences come after that. The reason why we are still able to listen to a Raja sone from the late 70s or early 80s is due to that melody. Rahman songs, barring a few, do not stay fresh for long due to its reliance on layered music orchestrations. While it creates a wow impact initially, it wears you down and you no longer feel like returning to them after a couple of years. I still like Rahman’s mid 90s to early 2000s songs. Not any more.
LikeLiked by 1 person
Uncouth Village Youth
December 22, 2017
Actually I wanted to pen a readers write in, about my journey as a IR fan. May be thats for another day. Somehow, I feel IR songs are fresher than all ARR songs post Mudhalvan(my opinion – there are exceptions of course). The feeling that a May Madham evokes, is not there for the post 2K songs.Come to think of it – there are 80s IR songs, which have 1M+ views on Youtube, with zilch marketing.There are numerous BGM pieces analyzed threadbare.And the comments in Youtube -they are any Social Media marketers dream. People just open up their hearts to IR songs, both in the real and virtual world. I hope they are preserved in some form, so future generations, feel incredulous about our obsession with IR. As I say frequently, nostalgia is the ultimate opium – especially when memories are entwined with a simpler time, when the world ‘seemed’ less impure.
Agree, with the notion of IR’s cult – it is unprecedented in the history of Tamil cinema, for a non-hero.The industry too holds IR in reverence. Somehow even his arrogance, is in fact celebrated.Just like the underlying hate for anything Tamil among some elites, there is a pushback of sorts,from the masses, that claims IR as one of their own. They(including me) see it as the ultimate David vs Goliath battle, were I to indulge in a bit of hyperbole, he is our own Obama/Modi – a man from nowhere(as opposed to ARR) coming in and smashing all the edifices built over the decades after independence.Whether we like it or not, IR broke the stranglehold of classical influences in Tamil film music – I know its a loaded term, the best euphemism I could come up with. It is very tough to compete with that kind of backstory. Something similar can be seen in Dhoni’s connect with the CSK crowd.
This is something I have had in my mind for a long time now. Did SM, actually deserve the Oscar award, that so many ARR fans keep bringing up, ever so subtly as seen in the comments above. Will SM, rank in ARRs all time Top-10 albums. How much of a role did Sony play in all this ? A lot of Tamils, understand this at a sub conscious level. There is also a very conspiratorial school of thought that considers IR the wronged man, because of his “you know what”. It also probably didn’t help that, the directors who stopped working with him were from “you also know what”.
Glad that TR is getting the recognition he deserves. Though he himself fueled his caricaturization with reckless behavior, the man has talent. In fact, TR along with BR, MR brought in new ideas to Tamil cinema – but most people don’t openly say that, for the ridicule they might be subjected to.
LikeLike
Naveen
December 22, 2017
IMO, there are two reasons i always thought was the source of IR’s longevity
1. his songs were much ahead of their time and are being appreciated more in depth only now;Sivappu Rojakkal, Ullasa Paravaigal, Tik Tik Tik have so much richness and freshness – apart from songs, his background scores are being analysis/discussed with fresh energy on forums
the amazing layers of his songs make us find some new nuisance in every listening, you can never fully or completely appreciate a song in one or two times; i still find some new microsecond layering in Andhi Mazhai everytime I listen to it
these points might apply other music directors too, but most appropriate for IR. more than any explanation, this article by itself is a proof of the pudding being eaten 🙂
LikeLike
Arjun
December 22, 2017
“” In the US, classic rock stations hardly play anything from the 60s that isn’t Beatles. ”
Not true in case of New York Classic Rock Station Q104.3. They play Led Zepplin, Pink Floyd, Deep Purple, The WHo, Rolling Stones as much as Beatles.”
Aside from Who and Rolling stones, those others would generally be categorized as 70s bands as that’s when their seminal albums came out even though they were formed in the late 60s. And yes there is more variety on air when it comes to 70s rock. However when it comes to the 60s, yes I’ve heard the Who and Rolling stones, but as far as I’ve observed, they stick to the most obvious hits. Even for a band like Led Zep, I can’t remember the last time I heard “When the levee breaks” or “SInce I’ve been loving you” on radio.
“What you are telling is that it is very difficult to have a close relationship with film music one has not listened to while growing up.”
Not just film music, any music. Even passive second-hand exposure through hearing parents or grandparents play something on their LP might be sufficient to kindle interest and make one want to revisit it later in life. But in general, I find that once people hit their 30s, it’s unusual for them to explore new music. Maybe life doesn’t allow time for that.
LikeLike
Tambi Dude
December 22, 2017
Madan: Is there any good post 70s music in English pop music. The greatness of classic rock of 60s/70s is in its longevity. I got back into it few years ago and now it is part of my daily diet. The sound of 80s does not have the same impact and I have no idea of English pop music 90s onwards.
LikeLike
Vivek narain
December 22, 2017
Mandela effect is no collective self deception or confabulation, being one of the core group,i should know. A raging meme in US, it is still an unsolved enigma much like synchronicity.
LikeLike
Tambi Dude
December 22, 2017
Arjun: ” But in general, I find that once people hit their 30s, it’s unusual for them to explore new music. Maybe life doesn’t allow time for that.
”
Agreed, with one exception. If they move to a different cultural setting. For example, I moved to US when I was 31 and got exposed to Jazz, which today I like as much as our film music.
However I still maintain that film music is most vulnerable for aging because it is nearly impossible to decouple the music from the film. Today when I very occasionally listen to old Hindi songs, it is mainly because of the nostalgia factor. Inherently all film music eventually sound outdated and insipid.
LikeLike
brangan
December 22, 2017
RaghuCA: You can easily name 100s of his songs where almost every aspect (melody, dynamics, orchestration, background, singing and mood) is topclass and they all happen together to create magic. That is not true for any other music director (current or past).
Wow. That’s a heck of a sweeping statement and one of the reasons I wrote this article. 😀
LikeLiked by 2 people
Prasanna
December 22, 2017
If you play a random Tamil song until late 1990’s My brain could place it as a MSV song or IR Song or ARR song, There were also Music directors during MSV, But some how like it was copying his style rather than their own. IR broke that template when he came in scene, and the next generations followed his style, Take Deva, apart from his signature Gaana songs his style was always following IR, then after ARR, Deva started making music like ARR. Now we have a better spread of Music director, IR and ARR are still scene, then SaNa, Anirudh, D Imaan etc. have their own style, not very clearly ear-marked…
LikeLike
RaghuCA
December 22, 2017
“Wow. That’s a heck of a sweeping statement and one of the reasons I wrote this article.”
Yep. Some deserved to be said as we feel!! Now you know one of the reasons why people think highly of Ilayaraja 🙂
LikeLike
Rakesh
December 22, 2017
‘Pournami Neram’ still does not work for me, with its rustic rhythms a tad too over the top according to me.
Take another of Shankar-Ganesh’s composition ‘Pattukottai Amaale’ from Ranga. The gloriously glitzy sound alternating with a terrific foot-tapping dholak being a case-study of fusion music from the 1980s.
A few other knockout Shankar-Ganesh songs which people even now assume is by Illayaraja.
LikeLike
Madan
December 22, 2017
@Tambi Dude: Depends what you mean by English pop. If you mean stuff like Wham (80s incidentally), then not a lot but I don’t like much iof that kind of blockbuster pop from the 60s and the 70s, except Beatles, Carpenters and ABBA. If you are open to somewhat left field but still very accessible suggestions (kinda like classic Stevie Wonder or Steely Dan), then:
Prefab Sprout (Two Wheels Good ’85)
Fiona Apple (When the Pawn ’99/Idler Wheel 2011)
Jamiroquai (Return of the Space Cowboy ’94/Travelling Without Moving ’96)
Brand New Heavies (Brother Sister ’94/Get Used to It 2006)
Lianne La Havas (Blood 2015)
These are all in the acid jazz/jazz pop orbit since you mentioned you now listen to jazz. Also, not really left field, but not wildly popular and quite pleasant is Swing Out Sister’s 1989 album Kaleidoscope World. For something aesthetically ‘purer’, their Somewhere Deep In the Night album will also do.
I am not sure about the part of it getting difficult to get into music beyond your growing up years. But yeah, part of it is just getting busy. I recently switched from train to a chartered bus which gives me lot of time to kill in evening traffic. Because of this, I have started listening to new albums again and have four albums from 2015/16 loaded in my phone. I am sure I would find more if I tried just a bit harder. But do people proceed to get close minded and dismissive of new music as they grow older? I don’t know and not true in my case. I MAY dismiss some music, new or old, but that’s because I am, unfortunately, a snob when it comes to music and wouldn’t have it any other way. I don’t want to dumb down my tastes just to force myself to like whatever cliche and safe pop happens to be charting now. Idina Menzel can keep bleating Let It Go till her throat goes; it’s not for me.
LikeLike
Madan
December 22, 2017
@ UCY: “there is a pushback of sorts,from the masses, that claims IR as one of their own” – OK, since counterpoint is a term often bandied about to describe IR’s music, let me offer you one. I am a Mumbai based Tamil Brahmin and my Thatha had a wonderful Carnatic music collection. For that matter, I can appreciate Carnatic too though I am not deeply into it. And by the way, he is NOT one of my own. He just happens to make incredible music. I don’t understand this temptation we have (I mean, it’s there in a lot of music journalism per se) to trace the appeal of a musician and his work to some socio cultural context. Was Mozart just a social construct or was he a phenomenal musical genius? IR is no Mozart but in a pop music context, he is probably the closet we will get to one. IR knows more about music than the Fab Four or Wonder did; maybe people like Bjorn Ulvaes/Benny Anderson were actually educated musicians able to make blockbuster pop and Intermezzo no.1 notwithstanding, ABBA never took the kind of risks IR did. IR’s music is brilliant, that’s it. When the music plays, it just becomes hard to deny his talent, irrespective of his background, because listeners can’t help themselves and identify with the sound. That’s the beauty of music. Its appeal is so visceral, so intuitive that it transcends social barriers and allowed Raja to impose himself on the scene.
LikeLiked by 1 person
Tambi Dude
December 22, 2017
Madan: It is not lack of time alone. I think with age our taste also changes. Even within the available time I spend far more time listening to Hindustani Classical then I did 20 yrs ago. Same with Jazz. All this comes at the expense of less time for TFM or HFM.
LikeLiked by 1 person
Madan
December 22, 2017
“All this comes at the expense of less time for TFM or HFM.” – So maybe this simply has to do with us becoming more and more familiar with the formulas of film music out of repetition and outgrowing it. Add to that the lack of exciting new developments in film music, so what’s there really to pull the listener to it unless he/she is only comfortable with that level of ambition or no more. This might also account for why people outgrow pop music at a certain stage of their lives. For the same reason that they stop reading picture books or ‘illustrated classics’ once they are out of school (if not earlier) or trade Hardy Boys for the Russian epics. When a Raja or Wonder is able to marry complexity with infectious hooks, then pop music can be rewarding even for the discerning listener. Otherwise it can be pretty boring and there’s no obligation for anybody to engage with it just because it happens to be the music of the masses. I dare say the masses would engage with more ambitious music that happens to get past the machine; they have done so in the past after all.
LikeLike
therag
December 22, 2017
In the US, the music industry is separate from the film industry. While a Jonny Greenwood or Trent Reznor might score for a film now and then, the film industry section is mostly divorced from the Music industry. In the Indian context, ARR is more of an International quality producer of pop music than a pure genre musician. A cross between Dr Dre and Nigel Godrich for an Indian audience. Seen in this light, ARR and IR do not operate in the same sphere. In fact I like to think that in a scenario where they were not film composers, IR would be closer to Leonard Bernstein while ARR would be a hybrid of Dr. Dre, Philip Glass and Trent Reznor. Maybe throw in a little Vangelis there.
I also think it’s easier to praise IR over ARR because IR operates on the classical side of the spectrum. I mean his music is on an average more earthy, more classical. I have read umpteen blogposts on how IR wowed us by subverting expectations with this Raga etc etc. His immense popularity in the rural areas is because of his relatively “Earthy” music compared to ARR. It’s difficult to do the same for ARR because he is much less classical. This is the reason it took so long for a band like Daft Punk to get recognized. Electronic Music and Industrial Rock were already immensely popular in the mainstream before the award shows deigned to recognize them. This is something I have observed even in film criticism. Critics tend to go easier on stuff when there is more material to criticize. Quite natural because you want to be able to explain why you like something when you are a critic.
Why does a song like “Closer” from “The Downward Spiral” work so well. I have no idea but it packs a wallop. If you ask me, ARR and IR hit the sweet spot with almost the same frequency.
As for the MSV question, I agree with the “50 year rule”. Your music has to be tied to pop culture to break this rule. So a Bob Dylan will in all likelihood be remembered because his music his tied inextricably with the Civil Rights Movement and the Anti-Vietnam-War movement. So “scholars” in the future will be analyzing his music while studying that era. Ditto for the Beatles. Otherwise, your only chance at popularity is if the song somehow finds it way into the pop culture of the present.
LikeLike
Madan
December 23, 2017
“ARR and IR hit the sweet spot with almost the same frequency” – But they don’t. IR was delivering hits/great songs call it what you will across 30 films a year compared to 4-5 of Rahman. So it isn’t really comparable. However, I do agree that at least up to the early noughties, Rahman was extremely successful if not wildly so with just about every soundtrack he delivered. I also don’t think his early work – when he was yet to venture as deeply into electronic – was so difficult to contextualise. But what he did was to change the rules of the game rather than try to beat IR at his own game (which nobody has to date). He began to construct songs in more of a pop hitmaker like way with big money moments (the two SPB melody numbers of Duet come to mind), somewhat like Quincy/Clive but with more flair and variety, refusing to subscribe to the existing rules of film music. He was also really with it when it came to urbane dance music and showed up IR’s own reluctant attempts to quench the MJ mania of the 90s (e.g Kadhal Then Kodukka). I don’t really like the pseudo MJ attempts on Anjali either for that matter. IR was in a Chick Correa-like world of fusion and understandably loath to come out of it. Lastly, I don’t really think Rahman’s music is as subversive as Reznor or Greenwood; maybe he is constrained to carry a large young music listener population with him who probably want something Western in a light vein. As successful as Radiohead are, they sold less than half as many copies as Oasis in spite of making many more albums. They were never competing in that market. I remember around 95 or so, Rahman mania was all over the place.
LikeLike
Tambi Dude
December 23, 2017
Madan: “So maybe this simply has to do with us becoming more and more familiar with the formulas of film music out of repetition and outgrowing it.”
You nailed it.
I think the Mukhada + 2x Antara ( Pallavi + 2x Charanam in TFM) format has been beaten to death. I think I have heard it enuf in my lifetime. Of course I enjoy whenever I get a chance to listen to it, like in Desi restaurants, Desi grocery stores etc. Heck, I even enjoy Jatin Lalit 90s songs if I catch them (as it happened few weeks back at a desi store where I ended up spending close to half-n-hour). But I am not going to out of my way to listen to them.
There is one more thing. Once you are out of India for decades and are not part of that milieu, film music loses relevance, specially the new ones. I tried to keep in touch (to some extent) by listening to City 101.6 (Dubai based Bollywood station) so that I can get a feeling of listening to the Radio Mirchi kinda stations. Whenever I am in India I make it a point to listen to Radio Mirchi.
Q to all here: Is there a good Indian bollywood FM station which is streamed live?
LikeLike
therag
December 23, 2017
Yeah the comparison breaks down on many levels. But I name dropped Greenwood/Reznor to point out the fact that Radiohead and NIN also took the existing state of the art and did something new with it. And a lot of the brilliance in their music also comes down to their innovative mixing and engineering. They set a very high bar in the late 90s-early noughties which IMHO is yet to be breached even by themselves but they sure do turn out solid work even now. In the popularity stakes, I think a comparison with Oasis is unfair. Radiohead are a strictly alternative rock band unlike say Coldplay. In the niche that they operate in, I’d say Radiohead is ultra-successful. For the kind of music that they make, I’m really happy that they are as popular as they are right now. Same argument for Reznor. He is probably the most successful industrial rock musician in the world and composes for the David Fincher.
LikeLike
Tambi Dude
December 23, 2017
There is another form of music I have discovered in the last 15 yrs is Hollywood Soundtrack (BGM for IR music). Thomas Newman is by far the greatest I have ever heard. The closest I can think of is IR. He is the only one whose movie soundtrack CDs I buy. There is something phenomenally creative about him.
LikeLike
Chandra prakash
December 24, 2017
Hear from horse’s mouth, about music and significance in relevance to time period.
Good interview
LikeLike
Madan
December 24, 2017
@therag: Fair point, but then Coldplay are even more successful than Oasis (and even more boring imo :D). That’s why I said Radiohead weren’t interested in competing in that market. Yeah, they have had stupendous success even so, probably because their subversion is often balanced by their knack for melody. So it comes back to melody again. If you get into anti-melody, it still doesn’t resonate with a large audience. And I wouldn’t say Rahman operates outside a melody framework and particularly up to around the mid noughties one could clearly trace his songs to particular ragas. A song like Swasame Swasame is very beautiful in terms of the raga structure, maybe not as breathtaking as some of IR’s experiments but that’s ok. IR is just the ceiling; it’s not sustainable to have him as the benchmark, the floor. That side of Rahman’s music still comes out in his soundtracks for Mani Ratnam.
@Tambi Dude: Thanks for the heads up. I enjoy Danny Elfman and Mancini’s scores but haven’t paid particular attention to Newman’s work. Speaking of Mancini, this bit from Return of the Pink Panther is Raja-esque before Raja:
LikeLike
Tambi Dude
December 25, 2017
Reach out to me at tambidude at aim dot com for some Thomas Newman music.
LikeLike
Shankara
December 27, 2017
Generations listening to msv period music are scarce, soon the same fate will befall raja, maybe another 10-20 years,, this is enevitable
LikeLike
ThouShaltNot
January 6, 2018
G. Ramanathan’s songs are such a delight (was hailed a Carnatic expert who parlayed his skills in the world of films). His songs (most) seem to have a distinct signature – a high tempo. And the biggest hits of his career were perhaps Uththama Puththiran and Ambikaapathy. But the song of his I like most – Poovaa maramum poothadhey – is from Naan Pettra Selvam. It is a thing of beauty. The lyrics were by Ka. Mu. Sheriff. TMS and Jikki do the singing honors.
A married couple’s dream of a life of harmony and bliss is nothing unusual. So it is with Sivaji and Varalakshmi. What is a bit surprising is that they also solemnly commit to a life of rectitude at their high point. It speaks to a different time.
She: Panam vandha pOdhum panbOdu thaaney inaindhendrum vaazhvOm anbOdu naamey
He: Manathaalum theedhey ennaamal naamey gunathOdu vaazhvom endru magizhvaai en kanney
The two are setting a high benchmark. I love the way Varalakshmi brims with joy and twirls around with her coy and come-hither maneuvers. With a smile in their hearts (and a song on their lips), the two spread tranquil well beyond the screen. Varalakshmi wraps up her part with a second jeeva amudham kidaithadhey. Vicariously, we partake.
(Aside: We’ve heard of leg-pulling. What’s with Sivaji’s pinnal-pulling? 🙂 Also, the man looks handsome)
LikeLike
R Ravi
January 11, 2018
“Another reason (the main one) is the multi-dimensional aspect of the ilayaraja’s music. You can easily name 100s of his songs where almost every aspect (melody, dynamics, orchestration, background, singing and mood) is topclass and they all happen together to create magic. That is not true for any other music director (current or past). Even the best songs of other directors are great at only few of these aspects (mostly melody, singing and mood).” : RaghuCA
One important aspect of a song that contributes to my overall listening experience is the lyrics even though this is not in the domain of the music director. Moreover, I do not think a song has to be complete in all aspects mentioned above to qualify for greatness. To give an example, the song “Marainthirunthu” from Thillana Mohanambal has no instrumental interludes at all. Yet it ranks higher in my listening preference list than most classical dance numbers composed by Raja. Style of composing and personal tastes have their place as well.
LikeLike
ThouShaltNot
January 13, 2018
Hamsalekha’s foray into Tamizh films was short-lived. He composed music for fewer than ten films. Back in Kannada though, Hamsalekha is huge and I’ve enjoyed quite a few of his Kannada hits. Two of his hit films in Tamizh were Kodi Parakkudhu and Paruva Raagam.
“Selai kattum penukkOru vaasam undu” is among one of his hits and has an undeniable allure. And that is not just because of Hamsalekha’s tune. Why else, you ask? Given that intriguing hook, curious minds (like mine) wanted to know what Vairamuthu was up to this time. A typical VM song those days was fertile ground for “aaraaichi”. Not the kind that lifts mankind from the doldrums, but the kind that makes a man think he is much the wiser for knowing something his friends purport to have known all along. What? Why? How? Huh? Really?! Blush. Kandadhundaa?, VM asks after the initial assertion. Kandavargal sonnadhundaa?, he further asks rhetorically. Put together, his assertion and the questions have the feel of a paradox. But we won’t dwell on paradoxes. The curious mind simply wondered, “Namakku dhaavanikkum dhupattaakum vidhyaasam theriyala. Aanaa ivar, ponnunga edha pOttaa (as in dress) enna vaasam, e.g. saree = jasmine, churidhaar = lavender, paavaada-dhaavani = kanakaambaram, jeans = colorless & odorless…, nu aaraaindhu pattiyalae pOttu vechirukaaru !” That is just one way to parse it (I’ll spare you the torture of endless possibilities). And as if the first line didn’t leave one with enough to inhale, VM further exhorts, “Koondhalukullae oru veedu kattungal, kaadhalukkulae kidayaadhu sattangal”. We know better than to disagree with a dyed-in-the-wool romantic. But enough with the ribbing. Here is the cloudy-with-a-chance-of-colorful-sarees song (SPB-Chitra):
Here is another tune of Hamsalekha, this one from the Kannada version of Paruva Raagam, that casts a beguiling spell (aided by SPB-SJ). I find the Kannada version more euphonic than its Tamizh counterpart. Although my Kannada is rudimentary, I’ll leave you with a stolen remark that captures my feeling about the song, idhu eshtu saari kelidharu chennaa! (a play on the song’s line). Savor this delectable musical treat from a master.
LikeLike
Madan
January 14, 2018
“Moreover, I do not think a song has to be complete in all aspects mentioned above to qualify for greatness.” – Absolutely, plus there are really no wholly objective parameters for what makes a song great. But the point RaghuCA may have been trying to make is Raja is so overwhelmingly complete. He is great at writing melodies, he is great at writing chords to said melodies AND (which is the least talked about aspect of his music) at writing amazing grooves. Seriously, all his wonderful melodic-harmonic experimentation wouldn’t have swayed the audience even a bit but for his grooves which first hooked them to the song and then allowed them to appreciate the nuances over several listens. He can actually steal a little from Canadian Sunset and turn it into the uber-rocking (or should I say, swingin’), uber-infectious Thodhadha Thaalam. I would urge people to listen to the aforementioned staid Andy Williams-rendered song (which since was appropriated by many great jazz musicians) to understand how Raja transformed it almost beyond recognition (and not in the Anu Malik like crass, tasteless sense). In a similar vein, he has a wonderful appreciation of folk/rural music and has composed very foot tapping stuff in that genre too, to the extent that some people believe that alone defines all of music. See, I haven’t even talked about his orchestration yet. There hasn’t been another music director who was or is so strong in his understanding of what makes for a piece of Indian music as well as Western that a lot of people would love to hear. What all this amounts to is you can immerse yourself in IR’s music alone and be contended. Not that you SHOULD do that but just saying that getting through his vast back catalogue is itself a humongous task, which possibly breeds indifference towards the work of other Tamil music directors.
LikeLiked by 1 person
R Ravi
January 15, 2018
Madan, Thanks for taking the time to clarify. I appreciate your (and RaghuCA’s) viewpoint now.
LikeLiked by 1 person
Madan
January 15, 2018
@ R Ravi: Welcome. And time flies when I write about Raja. 🙂
LikeLike
ThouShaltNot
January 20, 2018
The Shankar-Ganesh duo delighted Tamizh film-music lovers with many hits for over two decades. But when it comes to the S-G duo, the most intriguing question that has lingered is whether Shankar Ganesh is really one person or are they 2 different people? For those still unaware, Shankar is Shankar and Ganesh is Ganesh, and the twain did meet, collaborate and create music for films and they are now a part of Tamizh film lore. Shankar (a.k.a Shankarraman, younger brother of M.D., C. R. Subbaraman) is no more. Ganesh is still around. To memorialize Shankar, Ganesh decided to retain his name after his death and might have inadvertently caused further confusion. Both were assistants to MSV-TKR before they became composers in their own right. The man who helped them become music composers with a separate identity was the legendary lyricist Kannadasan, who (on incessant nagging by Ganesh), pleaded with Chinnappa Thevar (Dhaevar and K were good friends) to give the two an opportunity in his film. Over the long haul, S-G did not disappoint with their music, but the taint of tune-lifting (at times wholesale reuse) trailed them all along. In all fairness, that is not all they did. Far from it.
To inject a bit of irony, we’ll start with an old song of theirs, the tune for which was lifted by Gaanaa Ulaganathan (the starting lines of Vaazha meenukkum) and turned into a blockbuster a few years back. With pride, Ganesh recounted in an interview that Kamal’s first dance in a film was to their song (the veracity of which claim I can’t attest). A little way into the song, watch Kamal’s cartoonish flexing as he launches into Mickey mouseu kutti galaa kuttigalaa (In the same movie Maanavan, there is also a lovely SPB-PS duet kalyaana raamanukkum kannaana jaanakikkum kaadhal vandha naeram ennavO).
Stories about MGR as a largehearted man abound. It is hard to know how many of these are really true. Based on personal anecdotes of some in the industry, he had shown great care and concern for at least those within the film fraternity. But this story about Ganesh is for real. A demented person mailed Ganesh a bomb in 1986, the result of which was his shredded arms (practically) and lost eyesight. Since that incident, it has been a long road to recovery. MGR not only offered moral support to Ganesh through trying times, but paid for much of his medical rehabilitation. It is only fitting that we listen to one of the biggest hits of S-G, which happened to be the first MGR movie for which the S-G duo composed music (movie:Naan Aen Pirandhaen song: Naan paadum paadal nalamaaga vendum lyrics: vaali).
“It is the thought that counts” goes the popular cliche. Of course, this does not mean you can entirely dispense with the tangible asset and transact in mere thoughts. More than likely, that will fail in any scenario. And I don’t suggest trying 🙂 I can’t tell if it is the ravukka sela or the thought behind it that is causing all the intoxication in the song Ravukka sela vaangi thaaraen raa pagalaa pesuvOm – a S-G themmaangu paattu. Suffice to say I feel tipsy from merely listening to this one 🙂 Perhaps this is second only to S-G’s nadaya maathu in the genre, but the rendition by SPB and Vaani elevates this song to another level. Love the way SPB, voice suffused with curiosity, asks at 3:26, “Thandhaa?!” Can’t get enough of Vaani either in this one! (I love the S-G songs set in a rural milieu. Another song, Paruththi edukkaiyiley enna pala naalum paatha machaan is simply terrific! Years later, another man would go on to perfect this genre and more).
LikeLike
ThouShaltNot
January 21, 2018
Devaamritham, jeevaamritham, endrum pennOdu dhaan! With Rajini and Radhika playing leads, unbridled gratification gets wide play in this S-G disco song from *Moondru Mugam. Other than this song, S-G composed music for at least two more movies with disco as theme. Paadum Vaanambaadi, a remake of Disco Dancer in which Anand Babu reprised the role of Mithun Chakravarthi, became a musical hit (Like his father Nagesh, Anand Babu knew how to shake a leg, but unlike his illustrious dad, he could not move a muscle in his face and his career went nowhere). The tunes in the movie were straight lifts from the Hindi version. Mangammaa Sabadham was their other movie with disco music. If you like Kamal in his dancing shoes, Sorgaththin vaasal engae is worth a watch (a lifted tune), otherwise there is not much to write about songs in this movie. Back to this Rajini song from Moondru Mugam, I think this tune is an S-G original. Off screen, at times, we’ve seen Rajini speak like a traditional saamiyaar leaving us all confused (system is corrupt…too many viruses…reboot won’t work…drive replacement might…fix delayed is fix denied…see you in 3+ years). On screen here, he dons a Rajini-ish avataar. With lines like the below, this song extols hedonism with a masculine slant
thuravaram enna sugam tharum, endrum pennOdu konjungal undaagum paer inbam…jabam thavam ini aenadee manam dhinam unadhu madiyil…uchchaagam ullaasam undaagum pennalae dhaan!
If indulgence were deliverance, you might consider this song cult! (Another S-G duet hit (a nice folk song) with the same pair was maasi maasam dhaan, getti maela thaalam dhaan)
S-G’s biggest hit song with Kamal was the peppy unnai naan paarthadhu vennilaa vaelaiyil from Pattikaattu Raja. But the audio and video of this song that is publicly available is of poor quality. Another song with Kamal that turned into a hit (this one doesn’t hew to the conventional format) was Nadiganin kaadhali naadagam aenadee? – a mini-musical involving Madhu Malini and Sridevi. This song oozes trademark SPB nonchalance and swagger tailor-made for Kamal’s character. Enjoy the singing along with the two monologues (Kamal himself and then SPB) that function as a hagiographic prelude.
A lovely S-G tune for Karthik and Revathi in Idhaya Thaamarai with the help of P.C. Sreeram’s camerawork and some good VM lines turns this film song into an audiovisual poem ! (pookalin karuvaraiyil pirandhaval neeyaa…OdOdi vandhadhaal ulmoochchu vaangudhu…un moochchil allavaa en moochchum ulladhu).
The many S-G hits run into the hundreds. While you cannot place S-G in the same league as either MSV or IR, they held their own and it would be grossly unfair to leave the duo out of the conversation while discussing contributions of music directors to Tamizh cinema. Another contribution the S-G duo made that I like was the numerous opportunities they gave Vani Jayaram.
LikeLike
Shankar
January 26, 2018
Congrats on the Padma Vibhushan, Raja!
Baddy, time is slipping away…do something please!
LikeLike
ThouShaltNot
January 27, 2018
It is incredibly tough to cherry-pick a couple of MSV (or MSV-TKR) songs for listening pleasure. But within the romantic genre, I’d randomly select “muthuthukalO kangal” as an example of one of MSV’s finest songs. By itself, I relish the song’s tune. Pleasure from parsing Kavignar’s lyrics is a bonus. And we haven’t talked about KRV yet! Here, Kavignar’s metaphor for her is that of a flower macerated in milk. But we won’t get distracted by pedestrian thoughts. Lyrically, this song has a unique format; not the typical question-answer or the pure assertive template, but interrogative musings interleaved with assertions. I’ll focus on the one line that I think enhanced this song’s lyrical appeal.
sandiththa vaelaiyil sindhikkavey illai thandhuvittaen ennai
Was Kavignar merely stating the obvious? Are Sivaji and KRV reveling in or ruing the absence of sindhanai in courtship? Where does thoughtless surrender fit in the scheme of romance? It calls for a mini-sindhanai.
When contemplating people, we are prone to creeping cynicism (including those with whom we may fall in love). Our predilection to see through people gets in the way of a deep desire to fall in love (or even make friends) with another person. Without the suspension of such cynicism, any amorous feelings will quickly dissipate. Incidentally, when someone strikes a deep chord within us, even if it is for the flimsiest of reasons, there is an upsurge of emotions that turns off our contemplative side (the world may think little of our reasons to fall in love, but they still mean a world to us). And we are on overdrive exaggerating and extrapolating from the little we know about those we’ve begun to love. Essentially, when we are enamored of someone, blissful ignorance (of the whole person) seems farthest from folly. Overrun by feelings of ecstasy in the crush phase, we may have no conscious say in this matter (It all works fine until one day you notice your lover says po-tay-to whereas you prefer po-tah-to and you now want to call the whole thing off).
So, Kavignar was in a sense stating the obvious about what happened, but ruminating about the why or why not otherwise gives it an illuminative gleam. Even if evident, his pithy formulation kindles the thrill of recognition of a valuable thought. Here is the song:
‘Kannae Kalaimaaney’ is generally recognized as Kavignar’s last film song. IR cherishes that he happened to be the MD for Kavignar’s last song. But was this really Kavignar’s last song? I’m not sure anymore. Here is a MSV song for Bhaagyaraj in Andha Ezhu Naatkal which might have instead been his last. Maybe it is a matter of technicality (AEN was released in 1981 and Moondraam Pirai in 1982)?
thendral adhu unnidathil sOlli vaiththa saedhi ennavO
penmaiyin sorgamey paarvaiyil vandhadhO kaaviyam thandhadhO
Kavignar wrote those lines as the song’s Pallavi. After that, he was stricken, never recovered and he died without completing the song. Says who? Bhaagyaraj! And MSV was right there when he said it. Who finished the incomplete song? Bhaagyaraj ! Everyone still thinks of it as wholly authored by Kavignar, in part because there are nice nuggets buried in the bowels of the song.
ullam engum pongum aasai indru thanga radham aeriyadhu
unnai paarthu sollum vaarthai indru gangai ena maariyadhu
(So, that is about simmering desires finding lush expression after which the verbal floodgates open up)
edhu varai thalaimurai adhuvarai thodarndhidum en aasai unnOdu dhaan
(Here Ambikha swears allegiance to Bhaagyaraj for generations to come. BTW, Kavignar had a penchant for writing not just contextually apposite lines, but often times, lines that covertly referred to a reality outside the film-song. nalam dhaanaa udalum ullamum nalam dhaanaa was not just about Padmini’s caring question for Sivaji in the film Thillana Mohanaambaal, but was a covert message to C.M. Annadurai. Annaa was stricken with cancer then and because of an earlier falling out, Kavignar was not in speaking terms with him. In the AEN instance, the presumption by some Kavignar’s fans was that this line was also meant to transmit his close bonding with MSV)
sandham thaedi sindhu paadi undhan sannadhikku naan varuvaen
Had Kavignar written the above, it might not just have been Ambikha seeking out music composer Bhaagyaraj, but Kavignar seeking out music composer MSV. But not the case, as it turns out.
So, along with being the best screenplay writer, Bhaagyaraj will now also bear the burden of being a good songwriter as well 🙂 The mridangam beats which linger from start to finish and the flute (played in the interludes) produce such a pleasing effect in this lovely song. Not to mention the rendition, which is another feather in the cap for Jayachandran. Same goes for Janaki.
LikeLike
ThouShaltNot
January 27, 2018
Now for a MSV sOga paattu that is one of my favorites. How does a music director embed mood into a song? How does a lyricist precisely peg feelings onto words? How does a singer stir emotions in the deepest part of the soul? How does an actor emote with great intensity and avoid overstepping? There is more than one Tamizh song that might tacitly provide answers to these questions. This MSV song from Kaaviya Thalaivi (remake of Hindi Mamata) is one such. Frankly, IMO, this is not much of a lyricist’s song. This one belongs mainly to MSV, Susheela and Sowcar. Especially, Susheela and Sowcar do much of the heavylifting and steal a march over the rest of the team (Oru thaaikkum (Sowcar) thun magalukkum (Sowcar) irukkum mana thavippaiyum, aekkathaiyum urukkamaaga unarththiya paadal). Susheela imbues the lines with searing pain and wistful yearning. Her marubadi pirandhaal saerndhiruppaen is gut wrenching. Overall, a marvelous bit of music and cinema !! (Aside: MDs like V. Kumar, Vijayabhaskar, Chandrabose and Shyam have regaled Tamizh cine music lovers with some scintillating hits. But numbers won’t tell their story or do justice to them). Here is the oru naal iravu pagal pOl nilavu song:
LikeLike
Madan
April 16, 2018
bump Only yesterday I had a lengthy chat/debate with a Tamil bud on WhatsApp on the reasons why IR is still not considered a greater composer than MSV. The reasons inevitably were attributed to thalaiganam or lack thereof as applicable. But that is not what I came here to talk about. My question is is it really the consensus opinion in TN that MSV is greater than IR? I always thought the arms race was being contested by IR and ARR and that MSV had retired to the position of doting father figure. I don’t have a problem obviously if some people do rate MSV the greatest of the three but what IS the ballpark majority opinion anyway is my question.
LikeLike
Arjun
April 17, 2018
“what IS the ballpark majority opinion anyway is my question.”
IR
Daylight
Rest
LikeLiked by 2 people
sanjana
April 17, 2018
Taste changes as time passes. But some songs are timeless. We cant judge yesteryear greats by today’s standards. I dont know much about tamil remixes but hindi remixes prove that old songs are still used to create a space in today’s world. And the oldest songs still have audience in the youngest.
LikeLike
Vivek narain
April 17, 2018
When you’re playing to the gallery like IR, you’ve to play it fast and futuristic all the time, if there’s such a thing as time. And that requires a helping hand from the providence, whatever, it or he or she is.
LikeLike
Rahini David
April 17, 2018
I am not sure if this is the general consensus or my personal opinion. But this is how it goes (for Tamil). Songs of the 60s and 70s were the best. The 40s and the 50s could not match them and none thereafter. The main reason for this is Kannadasan rather than MSV (alone or with Ramamurthy). As a music director, IR is the best.
LikeLike
Srinivas R
April 17, 2018
I think the general consensus is the IR and ARR debate. As far as I know, MSV is the best of the lot is not the general consensus
LikeLiked by 1 person
Madan
April 17, 2018
Rahini: I also think that when people say MSV > IR, they really mean Kannadasan > Vaali/Vairamuthu. Would like to hear more opinions from MSV fans especially the ones who do consider him greater than IR as to what other than lyrics are the aspects of his music they rate higher than IR.
LikeLike
brangan
April 17, 2018
Madan: MSV’s music is not just the lyrics. It’s the way he could make the words fit into his breathtaking tunes — or rather, make his tunes flow around the words.
It’s hard to explain this point, but a film song is not always instruments and brilliant orchestration. MSV was the master of tuning the four-line stanza. Each line would be tuned differently. And the stanzas would be tuned differently, too .(You can find this latter aspect in a few Raja songs too, like Kuyile kavikkuyile…)
It really depends on what draws you to a song — the basic tune, the instrumentals, or the words + music.
If it were just the lyrics, we’d be READING Kannadasan’s poetry instead of still LISTENING to them couched in MSV’s music.
PS: I do not consider MSV > IR. I don’t find any point in comparing two greats from two different eras.
For instance, for its time, the prelude to this song was fairly intricate — with the end closing the loop begun at the beginning, and with a violin run in between (preceded by a “chinese” instrument played in two pitches). But compared to Raja’s songs, this may sound “primitive.”
So it also depends on one’s ability to transport themselves to different eras of music… It’s a very complex thing.
LikeLiked by 3 people
Madan
April 17, 2018
BR: I didn’t mean to say lyrics are all there is to MSV’s music. Just that in my general experience, MSV fans usually talk about the lyrics of those songs as their plus point. And MSV also came up with less complicated tunes to go with the lyrics. Which brings me to…
“If it were just the lyrics, we’d be READING Kannadasan’s poetry instead of still LISTENING to them couched in MSV’s music.” – While I agree with this, I think the point is without great lyrics, simple tunes would sound rather banal. The lyrics lend weight to the tunes. IR himself tried the simple/unembellished approach on some tracks – Kanne Kalaimane, Karpoora Bommai Ondru, Un Paarvayil. Only the one penned by Kanne Kalaimane became a classic (though personally I like Un Paarvayil more).
LikeLike
brangan
April 17, 2018
Madan: And MSV also came up with less complicated tunes to go with the lyrics.
Okay, I don’t think MSV’s tune-making is “less complicated” at all — it’s enormously sophisticated. But to each his own, I guess.
LikeLiked by 1 person
lakshmi
April 17, 2018
Each line would be tuned differently. And the stanzas would be tuned differently, too.
LikeLike
Madan
April 18, 2018
BR: Again, the reference is vis a vis Raja’s tunes. NOT saying that they are simple per se; if anything, in an earlier thread I had argued that MSV’s tunes are more complicated than his Hindi contemporaries. But Raja took this even further with really long phrases with lots of notes, sure not all songs but in many of them. I don’t mean that “less complicated” thing as a slight, it made the melody sound more elegant.
LikeLike
brangan
April 18, 2018
Madan: There are MSV songs with “long phrases” and “lots of notes” but let’s end this here. The ease with which he skipped scales (for instance, the major to minor glide in the phrase “naayakan vandha naal” in Maadhamo Avani) and the grace with which his tunes flowed… (Raja’s is a more staccato style, owing to how he thought of the tune as part of the instruments)…
But let’s end this here. He is one of the most misunderstood musicians – IMO (not asking you to agree with me here).
The other day I read a piece comaparing Raja and Salil that credited Raja for dragging film music out of Carnatic roots (don’t remember the exact words). What can one say? 😀
LikeLike
Madan
April 18, 2018
BR: Of course it’s nonsense to say Raja dragged film music out of Carnatic roots (if anything, he was more Carnatic while MS experimented more with Hindustani treatment). I am completely with you there. I don’t think I misunderstand MSV’s work (I also agree that in essence he used more legato while Raja is staccato even when he composes jazzy stuff which is kind of an oxymoron because legato is the essence of jazz). Maybe it becomes difficult to have a granular discussion once I announce myself as a IR fan (even if I don’t all the regulars here already know that anyway).
LikeLiked by 1 person
sanjana
April 18, 2018
It is surprising that only 3 to 4 music directors are counted. After ARR, who is going to rule?
LikeLiked by 1 person