A weekly feature, where I answer a few questions on the big release of the previous weekend. (Or, an older film, if the week has no big releases.)
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Posted in: #AskBR / #QnA, Cinema: Tamil
brangan
January 5, 2018
For next week. Thought it would be fun to discuss a Bhagyaraj film. So send in your questions 🙂
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Anand Sethuraman
January 5, 2018
#AskBR #DhavaniKanavugal brings forth the often-discussed topic Sivaji Ganesan over doing his act (especially the admiration to Subash Chandra Bose on his deathbed). However, in spite of this film and few others like Mridanga Chakravarthy, Vietnam Veedu, Gowravam etc., I feel he was aware of it and did it purposely to endear himself to the masses. Would love to hear your thoughts on this.
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shaviswa
January 5, 2018
@Anand Sethuraman how do you endear to the masses by acting in an annoying way? His over acting is a major turn off for me from many of his films. Even in a Mudhal Mariyadhai there was a lot of that. Maybe his best ever was Devar Mahan.
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Anand Govindarajan
January 5, 2018
#AskBR #DhavaniKanavugal – BR thank you for picking a Bhagyaraj movie. I think he was a naughty and rooted writer of his times. The scene where he takes all of his sisters to the theater is replete with a lot of Bhagayaraj-esque humour. It is certainly true that most parents and elders would squirm at some of the movie scenes during those times and often find out if the movie is family friendly before buying tickets. But how Bhagyaraj chose to do it has plenty of naughty innocence to it. Who else do you think had that kind of naughtiness (mostly harmless) in that 80s and 90s?
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Ananth
January 5, 2018
What is ur favourite scene? Mine is d shooting sequence where he enacts the sis scene wit radhika..
The other thing I feel about bhagyaraj is, his scenes are predictable most of the times but they are very likeable. Indru poi naaLai vaa is another example for this..ur views?
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Harish Jayesh
January 6, 2018
#AskBR #DhavaniKanavugal I wanted to ask you about the famed Bhagyaraj Screenplay in this movie and what you thought of it from a pacing, lucidity and intelligence perspective. It is often mentioned that Bhagyaraj was the master of moving his stories (which were not always unique) at a brisk pace through crisp scenes that were not very redundant. Your thoughts please…
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abishekspeare
January 6, 2018
Why is it that comedians loose their sense and quirk after they get old? For example, Vadivelu might speak the same dialogue that he always does in a present film, but it won’t really work. With an action hero or a romantic star this is understandable, but what do you think dries up comedians’ ability to make us laugh?
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sai16vicky
January 6, 2018
#AskBR #DhavaniKanavugal The writing in this movie still fascinates me. For example, how the Tailor, LaundryGuy and Postman’s characters are introduced with a sympathy towards Bhagyaraj’s family. Later, they come together in a way that brings a closure to the story, which attaches itself to the standard feel-good masala template. Ok, my question is this: Do you think Bhagyaraj’s key success as a hero came because of his writing (or) his chutzpah to make himself the object of most of the jokes (eg. the delightful movie-coin joke)?
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Srini
January 7, 2018
#AskBR #DhavaniKanavugal I often hear Bhagyaraj being referred to as the master of screenplay writing. Can you take a scene from this movie that you think is a proof of this mastery and describe the nuances that you see ?
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"Original" venkatesh
January 7, 2018
#AskBR #DhavaniKanavugal : Where does the “early” Bhagyaraj (circa late 1970’s to mid-80′) fit in the rubric of Heroes ? Is it fair to compare him to say an Amol Palekar ?
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Anu Warrier
January 7, 2018
I thought most of the Bhagyaraj films were extremely regressive in content even when I initially watched them. Thoughts?
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Rakesh
January 8, 2018
#AskBR #DhavaniKanavugal When the hero should have been burning up the disco floor for the ditty.. ‘Oru Nayagan Udhayam Aagiran’.. Bhagyaraj’s with his two left feet and zero wattage deflates the energy in the air, should he have stuck to direction and screenplay writing like Bharathiraja ?
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shaviswa
January 8, 2018
Baghyaraj’s movies worked brilliantly because he was willing to play the hero where the hero is not characterized with super hero qualities. He would be the butt of jokes, many self-deprecating references, and more often than not at the receiving end of the leading ladies (and even vamps like in Chinna Veedu).
This also meant his movies had some pretty strong female characters. Be it Mouna Geethangal, Andha 7 Natkal, Mundhanai Mudichu, Idhu Namma Aalu etc., his heroines were pretty strong characters.
#AskBR There were movies made earlier on unemployment before DK – like Varumayin Niram Sivappu. But do you feel that Baghyaraj was able to weave a story on this topic but making it a lighter, easier watch with his trademark humour and a more relatable plot? Most movies I have seen addressing this social problem were like documentaries.
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KayKay
January 8, 2018
“I thought most of the Bhagyaraj films were extremely regressive in content even when I initially watched them. Thoughts?”
Warrior, a few of his movies like Mundhanai Mudichu, Mouna Geethangal, Idhu Namma Aalu, Sundara Kaandam, Chinna Veedu and Dhavani Kanavugalall featured heroines with genuine spunk, which is more than you can say for the state of leading ladies today.So, that’s something in his favor at least.
It helped that, barring a Sulakshana or 2, his choice of female leads like Radhika, Urvasi, Bhanupriya, Ambika, Kalpana, Sharita etc had more acting talent in their index fingers than most of today’s North Indian imported Cream Puffs have in their entire gym-toned bodies.
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KayKay
January 8, 2018
KayKay’s disclaimer: My use of the word “spunk” in the post refers to it’s most generic meaning.
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Shankar
January 9, 2018
#AskBR #DhavaniKanavugal – Can you talk a bit about how and if Bhagyaraj has used the songs effectively in this film?
We can discuss whether songs are even appropriate in a film and such, but having accepted the Indian film construct and how we go about it, I feel Bhagyaraj made a hash of the terrific songs in this film. When it came out, I thought “Oru Nayagan” was as grand an arrangement as Raja had ever done until that point. This was Bhagyaraj’s moment just like Kamal had “Ilamai Idho” and Rajini had “Poomalai” but what a letdown as remarked by Rakesh earlier! 🙂 “Sengamalam Sirikkuthu” also got a raw treatment! Until then, I thought he was okay with this stuff, case in point being Thooral Ninnu Pochchu, and even Mundhanai Mudichu. But from this point on, I can’t recall any memorable usage of songs…even “Vandhal vandhal Rajakumari” stands tall for the composition rather than for the lazy film making of it (helicopter shadows!)!
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brangan
January 9, 2018
The video is up. We shot yesterday, so could not include the last few questions. Sorry 🙂
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Vidhya M
January 9, 2018
Bhakyaraj was very popular and successful in the 80s – there’s no denying that, though his fame did not transcend the decades.
#AskBR – do you think Bhakyaraj’s movies would have been more successful / more appealing (atleast to the subsequent, if not the current, gen) had he cast suitable lead actors rather than featuring as hero himself.
Lets say Dhavani Kanavugal with namma Mohan or angsty Vijaykanth or Karthik. Inspite of the versatile plots and interesting characterizations, his performance was always one-note (to me)
And as someone rightly said – he chose the most spunky heroines of those times which offset his lack of acting chops.
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Vidhya M
January 9, 2018
#AskBR – What does the title Dhavani Kanavugal signify? The movie is about the hero’s kanavugal however the title seems to emphasize on the sisters and their dreams (Dhavani?).
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Anu Warrier
January 9, 2018
KayKay, I will give a very qualified ‘yes’. Because what used to bug me about his films was that it didn’t matter if the heroines were ciphers or spunky – there would be one scene where they would beg his forgiveness, or he would slap them or something that would establish that the woman was inherently inferior to him (no matter what an idiot he was).
(Your disclaimer is what made a very straightforward explanation Kaykay-esque. 🙂 )
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brangan
January 9, 2018
That slapping scene is in the video!
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Anu Warrier
January 9, 2018
BR, yes, I just watched the video now after I posted this comment. 🙂 I would wager every single one of his films had one scene like that – the heroine abjectly apologising or otherwise being shown the error of her ways, or being slapped to bring her to her senses.
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shaviswa
January 9, 2018
This was excellent yet again BR. Thanks. And yes, we would want to have this regularly for older movies too. And you could cover multiple aspects – direction, screenplay, acting, music, editing, special effects, etc.
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Vivek narain
January 9, 2018
Touche`, that shot must be cut, censored, slashed or whatever ghastly way, done away with.
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Honest Raj
January 10, 2018
About Bhagyaraj being referred to as “India’s greatest ever screenwriter”, I think I got the answer now. Going by that logic, the likes of Visu and Pandiyarajan, too, would meet the standards.
As for the title-card thing, nothing can beat the one in Sundara Kaandam. 😀
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Madan
January 10, 2018
Excellent. Loved that you mentioned vidiyum varai kathiru. Not without its flaws but interesting film. Back in the day, my father was so captivated by the BGM that he watched the film twice in the same day (in theater) just for that.
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GODZ
January 10, 2018
I dont know If Bhagyaraj is the greatest screenwriter in India But he is The Manmadhan of Tamil cinema. Not even Kamal deserves that title. You can take any Bhagyaraj movie. Anything. Whether its Sundara Gandam or dhavani kanavugal or mundhanai mudichi or andhe ezhu naatkal…Woman just fall and yearn for the slightest possible looks of our manmadhan.
Their is always a invisible sexual tension in his movies between the lead pairs. I guess he was very good at capturing the pulse of Woman audience of the time. So If someone feels his movies have strong woman characters, then it means our Manmadhan bought u in with his deceptive screenplay. with Very few exceptions, Its finally our Manmadhan who makes the decision whether he accepts the female lead or not and not the other way around.
But I was very happy when Myskin Cursed our Manmadhan in an completely unrecognizable avatar.
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MANK
January 10, 2018
Anu, Bhagyaraj is like our balachandra menon, except Menon’s heroines arent that spunky – his films are all about him :), but the gender politics are pretty much the same
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shaviswa
January 10, 2018
Why do we single out Baghyaraj on his handling of women? I find most Tamil films even today being regressive. Heck even Balachandar’s films (in the guide of liberating his women) were very regressive (Sindhu Bhairavi mother character was horrible; Sindhu begetting a child for JKB was nauseating)
Kamal;s character in many films would demean women. Recently saw Vikram and was shocked to see the level of misogyny in that film. Rajinikanth has always been this hero who insults women with an independent mind in his films.
The rest of Tamil film world was actually worse.
At least in Baghyaraj films, his heroines dominate the hero for the better part of the film. They had a significant role in the story and good characterization.
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Anu Warrier
January 10, 2018
MANK, Balachandra Menon is exactly like Bhagyaraj – and he remade a couple of Bhagyaraj films in Malayalam as well, if I remember correctly. His films always made my skin crawl. Talk about vanity!
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Honest Raj
January 10, 2018
shaviswa: Mass heroes exhibiting misogynistic behaviour is a phenomenon that’s not specific to Tamil cinema alone. The Tamil culture is a subset of the Greater Indian culture. Take the Telugu cinema for instance, Raghavendra Rao’s (their Bharathiraaja equivalent) films predominantly featured subservient female leads. The problem with Bhagyaraj films is the benevolent sexism towards women and the idea of projecting his heroines as torchbearers of patriarchy. The Kalpana character in Chinna Veedu is a classic example of that. I’ve heard people claiming that Mouna Raagam was inspired by Andha Ezhu Naatkal. It’s almost a sin to compare both because the former deals with human emotions, where as the latter revolves around the age-old “thaali sentiment”. To sum up, like most of our filmmakers, he was no intellect but a product of his times.
Coming to KB, there’s a reference to the little-known Kalyana Agathigal in the clip. A while ago, a Tamil FB page (operated by the BJP IT-cell) took a scene out of the movie – for its “message” against religious conversions – and waxed eloquent about KB. It went viral that even some non-Tamil pro-BJP pages started sharing it. Out of curiosity, I saw the clip only to be bemused by the absolute nonsense that was conveyed through it. The “moral” of the scene is supposed to be something that a woman should be allowed to make choices for herself. But the writing takes it to a different level that it ends up preaching that one should “stick to their roots”. Sigh, I thought SB was way better. 🙂
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Enna koduka sir pera
January 11, 2018
Am loving the AskBR series, especially the discussion on old movies. I think you have found your own irreplaceable spot in the video format with this series, where you with your infinite knowledge on Tamil cinema will be a joy to watch by many amidst all the other channels in that space streaming content on current cinema, with interviews and reviews on new releases. For this reason, and also for the possibility that people like me, who don’t get to watch the new releases within a week, would not be able to enjoy/participate in your discussion on new releases, I vote for doing more old movies in this series. I am just guessing, but if you do this series in Tamil, you might be able to increase the views/subscriptions, if FC South is looking to do that. Having said that, am loving your English with spurts of Tamil in between 🙂
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GODZ
January 11, 2018
Coming to KB sir, I always wonder What that Sindhu bhairavi movie is all about. Imagine we had a talented carnatic singer whose husband does not share her taste and she is childless. Now she meets someone who shares her some love of music. She falls for him , sex with him and bears a child from him. He leaves her and she drinks etc moaning for her lost love. Then the lover comes back and leaves the child to husband and she is all fine and well.
If KB made a movie out of it..what would have happen. Is KB trying to normalize this behavior of men. IMO, the story of Sindhu bairavi is pure BS. The Same with Azaghi. Nothing more nothing less.
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Rahini David
January 11, 2018
It’s almost a sin to compare both because the former deals with human emotions, where as the latter revolves around the age-old “thaali sentiment”
Very well put, Honest Raj. The main point of Mouna Raagam is that Revathy decides to disregard the supposed sanctity of the rituals and afterwards genuinely falls in love. In A7N, the whole point is that a Tamil woman is bound to the rituals that she willingly disregards the happiness of the pretty much everyone. What is wrong with Ambika and Bagiyaraj being a couple who takes good care of Rajesh’s daughter for a couple of years while Rajesh is able to mourn the loss of his mother and come to terms with his life. Perhaps they can go through a matrimonial and find a suitable match who actually WANTS to marry a widower with a daughter. But no, a few sanskrit lines that the two chanted while both kept their mind elsewhere should bind them both forever. Good God.
I have not watched DK except for the famous scene everyone talks about. But let me say that this #AskBR thing absolutely rocks.
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Rahini David
January 12, 2018
I assume you’d be doing #AskBR for mostly new movies except when there is a dearth of new releases.
But here is the set of movies I’d like to see in this section
1) Thillu Mullu
2) Indian
3) Nadigan
4) Aan Paavam
5) Sethu
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நவீன்
January 12, 2018
Thanks for answering my very simple question, the last question in the video, it was a nice rush to hear your question as question after question of similar stance. Yes the idea of discussion on the latest movie thru #AskBR refreshing, but how many of your followers invest the first weekend or more precise every weekend to catch the lastest release? Request a pre-oscar special as we still count their movies. Thanking you.
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Karthik
January 12, 2018
GODZ: Coming to KB sir, I always wonder What that Sindhu bhairavi movie is all about
Sindhu Bhairavi is a layered story, where the characters and basic plot lines you mention serve as metaphors for the abstract plot which deals with connecting Carnatic Music with the common man. Bhairavi’s inability to conceive a child with JKB mirrors the inability of the general audience to “get” Carnatic music. The Sindhu character is a metaphor for folk music, her illegitimate birth mirrors the unknown birth of folk music (nadodi paatukku thai thanthai yaaro as the song goes). JKB and Sindhu’s union mirrors the fusion of Carnatic music and folk lyrics — both are viewed as adultery, the former by those who believe in the sanctity of marriage, and the latter by those who believe in the sanctity of traditional classical music. The birth of their love child and his final acceptance by Bhairavi is then reflective of the abstract conclusion which is that this new form of classical music they birthed is accepted by the masses.
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Honest Raj
January 12, 2018
Karthik: So what does the film convey? That general audience can never “get” the Carnatic music in its actual form?
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Karthik
January 12, 2018
Honest Raj: I think I took the metaphor too far in a haste. The movie just portrays a disconnect between the non-Tamil music and the general audience, and the childlessness of JKB and Bhairavi mirrors that disconnect.
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shaviswa
January 13, 2018
Wow Karthik. You deserve to be an English language teacher – this is just like how they try to interpret hidden meanings in poetry by Keats, Wordsworth etc or prose by the likes of Maugham 😀
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Honest Raj
January 13, 2018
Karthik: The plot makes perfect sense when looked from the perspective of ‘screenplay angle’. What I don’t get is the ‘folk vs classical music’ debate and the argument that normal people won’t ‘get’ the music as long as they don’t ‘understand’ the lyrics.
I’ll stop here as I don’t want to throw KB out with the bathwater. 😛
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hari prasad
May 8, 2023
In these videos , Bhagyaraj and Parthiban discuss the creative process behind Dhavani Kanavugal , how Parthiban was casted as the postman and how Bhagyaraj struggled to show a casual side of Sivaji Ganesan within his histrionics.
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hari prasad
May 8, 2023
A comment of mine went to spam , can you please bring it back , BR?
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