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Film Companion South Round Table – 2020
Posted on December 31, 2020
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brangan
January 1, 2021
The Round Table video is up.
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SudharsananSampath
January 1, 2021
This was such a joy to watch. So thank you BR. Hosting an interview is an art in itself. I loved how you gave everyone an equal space to express themselves. I loved how Prakash Raj seemed happy to be able to finally land roles such as Paava Kadhaigal.
I wonder how Sivaji Ganesan would’ve fared in an OTT landscape. I think Sivaji Ganesan was never allowed to stay true to the actor in him. He was always the “actor” who was required to be as hammy as possible. Maybe he would’ve done roles like The Lunchbox, an ageing widower left to contemplate the big city on his own. Oh well!
This discussion inspired so many stray thoughts to run amok. So, thanks again. I am a long time lurker, but a rare poster. This community has always helped me and challenged me in my quest to understand and appreciate cinema. It even helps me in writing my scripts. BR’s bad movie reviews often guide my screenwriting process.
Happy new year everyone, and here is to an amazing 2021. Peaceful, prosperous and COVID free. I hope you feel well BR and the wretched COVID has left your system!
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krishikari
January 1, 2021
Very excited to watch this!
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MANK
January 2, 2021
Great conversation Boss. As Sudharsanan said, you are really good at juggling speakers, giving each one the time to express themselves properly.
The real pleasure (and surprise) for me was seeing Manju (chechi)Warrier articulating herself so well. I though she would be eaten up by the others, but she did well. I think this is your first conversation with her. How did you convince her to join this conversation?.
She’s also looking very beautiful and happy :). And happy to know that she has turned producer. A great conversation all around with some good points made.
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brangan
January 3, 2021
Thanks, MANK and Sudharsanan. I was a little scared going into this because I knew it was inevitable that the OTT topic would have to come up — and this has been discussed so much all year.
But it’s also THE most important issue now, and I am glad Tharun had such sharp observations (about data points, for instance) to make. I had to literally hold back my laughter when Manju said “Theatres and OTT can coexist” and Tharun said they CANNOT coexist 🙂 I am sure she meant it in all sincerity, but I think Tharun is right here.
I also liked how Prakash Raj spoke. It gave me the sense of someone sensing the potential to wash away years of “sins”, if you will. He admitted he had been part of the Mafia and now is looking forward to breaking out of the System. Almost everything he said felt very moving for me.
One thing I am not so sure about is the Denmark example Gautham gave. I think these may be one-off audiences. I still most regular people (i.e. non-cinephiles) will use OTTs to watch what lies in their comfort zone, rather than actively go seeking out stuff from “other cultures”.
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Satya
January 3, 2021
Stardom is a by-product of the audience’ ego, I was told by an eccentric filmmaker. Maneesh Sharma’s Fan took it a notch higher. And this conversation hits it harder. I personally don’t see OTT bringing a great change in the mainstream cinema. Maybe things will get a little subtle, that’s all.
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Madan
January 3, 2021
This one is almost the other end of the spectrum from a similar roundtable you did earlier with more of the producer/director types who were like theatres are going nowhere. Of course that was back when they still believed theaters would open by Ayutha Poojai or something and people would simply flock back in big numbers braving the pandemic.
None of the cinema hall crowd seemed to factor in the question of how long exhibitors could survive without being able to do business.
And likewise, the optimism in this discussion about OTT is feverish and mirrors the optimism about self-releasing of music in the 2000s (in the West, not in film industry driven India).
Especially when they say they are tired of being defined by numbers. Reminds me of this infamous ‘classic’ penned by Courtney Love in the wake of the Napster controversy.
https://www.salon.com/2000/06/14/love_7/
These folks are almost like the mirror image of the capitalists in the Ayn Rand cartoon who believed they could be on an island all of their own without the pesky ‘slaves’. They seem to think of numbers as evil and feel liberated, for now, by OTT.
But do you really want a system of thousands of distributors and exhibitors to die so that it is replaced by, um, Disney, Netflix and Amazon? Think carefully which system will come to exert more power from you.
The OTT guys have simply followed a trickle down strategy (properly called skim in marketing parlance) . They have won over the upwardly mobile viewers by offering niche content that contrasts itself with the mainstream. When the bottom falls out from under the theaters is when you will see their true colours. If anything, the amount of data at their disposal will make them even more ruthless in their choices.
In fairness, I think Tarun Bhascker was the smartest with his answers and said rightly that he does not know whether the change will be for the better or worse. But it is a change and they will have to deal with it. Because they are only artists. They don’t control the distribution medium.
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Sudha
January 3, 2021
True. I love Tarun Bhascker’s answers. He made a great point about all the data available through OTT platforms. It doesn’t have to be assumptions anymore.
@BR – About Gautam’s Denmark example: I don’t think it is a one off. Personally I search for obscure Japanese, Turkish, Egyptian, Belgian or Polish tv shows and movies because I am genuinely curious and I want to understand other cultures. I’ve been doing that for many years now and this led me to many underrated gems like ‘Shasiyet’, a Turkish tv show or Midnight Diner, my favorite tv show of all time.
I think the same goes for Indian tv shows and films. OTT content, especially things like Netflix originals which are not location dependent, are available for audiences across the world to consume. My Danish friend recommended Andhadhun on Netflix, and my friend from the midwest (US) randomly brought up Tumbbad, and he couldn’t stop talking about that film. Both are old white guys who are slowly beginning to consume content from across the globe. I feel like subtitle is the key. One thing I noticed is that we are not good at marketing. Not the pre-release hype, but marketing after a film has its theater run.
Thanks to OTT, good films, even old films have a “permanent” place to reside and are readily accessible. Does anyone remember the Moserbaer days? I was so excited when they came out and even had a huge collection of DVDs in storage. That was the first time where a lot of forgotten tamil and telugu films were genuinely accessible. They also came with DVD extras and subtitles. Indian producers and film community in general are not good at providing that kind of accessibility and user experience to people. I, for one am glad about the rise of OTT.
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Naren
January 3, 2021
BR, I hate to tube my own horn but many of the points put forth by these people . . . I covered all of them in my comments in the interview with the amazon prime guy. This is not going anywhere beyond a small radius of arguments. Tharun was right to b skeptical because what the rest of them opined seemed more of a wishful thinking than a prognosis. If Prakash Raj is truly being redemptive of his past actions and choices then why isn’t he producing content for OTT thru Duet Movies?! He’s so worried about his dwindling relevance as an actor when he can still remain relevant as a producer. Michael Douglas has been juggling both production and acting since the 70s and he has been spectacularly successful in both the ventures. All these discussions shud’ve started way back when Kamal Hassan perspicaciously uttered the words “Direct-To-Home” or maybe even before that.
Madan – It wasn’t merely optimism for the western musicians in the 2000s but a clear path ahead. Dr.Dre and Metallica may have won in court but P2P applications starting with Napster have irreparably decimated the record label cartel and the flood gates became wide open. You shud watch the HBO show “Vinyl” by Martin Scorsese and Mick Jagger to get a small insider peek into the music industry during their glory days in the 70s. Not even the almighty Led Zeppelin were spared and it took a ruthless tyrant like Peter Grant to fend themselves off from the pillaging and plundering by the record labels.
Whether we want thousands of distributors and exhibitors to b out of a job or even worse, die, is irrelevant. Mahesh Narayanan in his deep dive interview with BR said that he knew people who killed themselves as digital filmmaking started becoming the norm and they cudn’t adapt. No one seemed to object to that change. Producers here r being inexplicably narrow minded, hardline conservatives and most importantly excruciatingly paranoid about every single aspect of filmmaking. If a filmmaker pitches a project to b shot in 1.3:1 aspect ratio or in black and white, all hell wud break loose and that person becomes a pariah. For some reason they think that lattitude and creative freedom r reserved only for filmmakers who have established themselves already by adhering to the norms, as though that guarantees success. As long as such an attitude exists every stepping stone wud merely b a gamble and not a calculated, strategic move ahead.
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Madan
January 3, 2021
” It wasn’t merely optimism for the western musicians in the 2000s but a clear path ahead. ” –
– A clear path to cartelization seeing as some big name musicians like Dylan and Crosby have sold their masters to secure a retirement package. What would they do, after all, with ownership of the masters if monetization of music amounts to a few pennies basically?
“Dr.Dre and Metallica may have won in court but P2P applications starting with Napster have irreparably decimated the record label cartel and the flood gates became wide open” – Likewise. The flood gates were opened to the utter devaluation of a music product called album or single. Earlier it was at least possible that the band would get SOME payment out of the label against the album but today the only way to make money for a band is the live performance. I am going to assume you didn’t mention this because as a consumer, you love this model where music is cheap as never before for the consumer (and who cares what musicians get to make against it, right?). For all major labels too exploited the musicians, at least they got a mortgage and per diem. What now? What can labels pay them if Spotify is going to turn over a few dollars against millions of views?
“Whether we want thousands of distributors and exhibitors to b out of a job or even worse, die,” – That’s not what I said at all, so read the sentence. I said a MODEL based on thousands of distributors and exhibitors. You completely missed the essence of my argument which is that when you have thousands of exhibitors, they are at the mercy of the producers and the stars. When you have a buyer cartel which is what Netflix-Amazon-Disney will soon become, THEY will control what to buy and producers/stars will now be at their mercy. You might want to crow, “Let them, they enjoyed for long” but well, whatever big producers face, the plight of smaller filmmakers and actors will be ten times worse. We already have this model in essence in the music industry. It won’t be so dire for cinema because the trio and other OTT platforms are able to monetize content to a decent extent but it also costs a lot more to make a movie than it does to make an album. So there will be rationing of what properties they are prepared to go forward. And those who can assure maximum eyeballs will win.
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Aman Basha
January 4, 2021
Forgive me for being a skeptic, but the comparison of a music CD to a theatre experience is stretching credulity in my opinion. Like TV, CD, laserdisc before it, OTT and streaming will definitely take over and absolutely dominate the home viewing experience, but that’s that. A theatre is not just about watching a film there, it’s about the communal experience, much like a music concert. Stars like Salman, Vijay or even a Rajni are what drive people to theatres. It’s depressing to think of life without going to some hardcore mass film with pulpy punches and juicy punchlines, having your eardrums burst with fans’ hooting and hollering. I may be stretching it, but let me put it this way: Let’s wait till Jan 13 to know about the future of theatres. #VaathiComing
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Madan
January 4, 2021
” but the comparison of a music CD to a theatre experience is stretching credulity in my opinion” – In terms of business model, it’s not. Substitute CD with a digital file sold by the BAND on bandcamp and it would effectively be the same. Selling CDs or MP3s or vinyls, what have you, gives the band a revenue stream that can potentially be rewarding. As is exhibiting the film at a cinema hall. It’s pretty clear that Spotify/Youtube cannot pay musicians at any level comparable to Bandcamp or to the much reviled record label contracts. It’s also not at all clear that OTT will continue to pay as much as they can now. It looks that way now because OTT is in the growth stage of its product life cycle. Theater is a mature distribution model and STILL pays more. It’s not even comparable. You cannot make $1bn off OTT alone.
As to whether theaters WILL go the way of CDs, I cannot say and made no claims either way about it. My point is rather that this particular panel was overoptimistic about OTT. The theater model had its own benefits which may become clearer to such artists in hindsight.
As for CD experience not being comparable to theater, it all depends on what you value. As a musophile, I absolutely do not buy that listening on Spotify compares in any way to the CD experience. That the difference in audio is not important to casual listeners does not make the differences non existent. Likewise, I would say not every film rewards watching it in theater and for me, the ambient noise of Tamil mass is not highly important (and I would rather watch a beautifully shot film on the big screen because in that case, the maker knew how to use the scope of cinema). But what I can say is, no, a movie experience does not compare at all to a music concert but again, that’s me talking as a music fan. I do not accept that a final product obtained from hours of post production has the spontaneity of a performance delivered live, warts and all, right in front of you. And you can also only imagine reaching out and touching and feeling the beloved movie star on the screen. You can’t actually shake hands with the performer. I have…in the case of a show performed by a particularly nice band. Best part: they were Germans. So much for stereotypes about German coldness/rigidness.
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Sam
January 5, 2021
@Madan, I believe the market for a theatre experience is significantly higher than the CD experience and not an apples to apples comparison for the current discussion…
Agree on the possibility of the entry barrier for a OTT being significantly higher than theatre distribution once the dust settles (which might take some time)
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hari
January 5, 2021
Who is the mafia that these guys keep alluding to? And why don’t they speak out about it?
Madam awesome comments, these guys are overly optimistic about OTT. It is a niche area and will cater only to few people IMHO.
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Voldemort
January 5, 2021
I would like to have whatever Prakash Raj was smoking 🙂
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hari
January 5, 2021
Voldemort you should have added #JustAsking 🙂
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krishikari
January 6, 2021
Manju Warrier (looking great!) was not the only one with naive optimism saying theatres and OTT can coexist, GVM said that too.
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Voldemort
January 6, 2021
Hari : Voldemort you should have added #JustAsking
Haha.
Was not sure which thread to post this-
But wanted to know what the well informed readers here thought of it-
https://gadgets.ndtv.com/apps/news/whatsapp-privacy-policy-terms-update-february-8-2021-changes-2348361
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brangan
January 7, 2021
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