Interview: Vijay Deverakonda on his angst over Arjun Reddy&nbsp;criticism

It wasn’t enough to have one review and one interview with the director on FC, and not one but three articles on AR on this blog, we have to listen to this guy justify his role all over again?! How much more traction are you going to give this film?

(And he loves Preeti so much he calls her friend a ‘fat chick’? WTF?)

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Not sure I want to see this interview if it is all about justifying misogynistic, crass, obnoxious film. Arjun Reddy and it’s clones are all not worth our time. Vijay Deverekonda can try all his best to soften the poor image this film gave him but please we are tired of the “justifications” or the creative inspirations behind this kuppai film

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Josh-E-Maddy

Just when it seemed that the Arjun Reddy debate was over… This is the trouble with these serious ‘auteurs’ and serious movie buffs: they preach about embracing life with its imperfections, accepting other people despite their their glaring flaws, yet they can’t handle a little criticism. You can’t everyone to agree to everything you believe in. That’s how real world works. ‘Arjun Reddy’ and ‘Kabir Singh’ are blockbusters. Public loved them. What else do they want? Be content, comrades. A little bit of happiness won’t hurt your dark and serious personas.

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Amit Joki

I am betting that his lines will be taken straight off the book “The Subtle Art of Not Giving a F***”

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Honest Raj

Vijay Deverekonda can try all his best to soften the poor image this film gave him …

Actually, AR was his breakthrough role and the film earned him a huge (female) fan following. 🙂

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Isai

“Arjun Reddy and it’s clones are all not worth our time.”
A belief that WE know what is best for EVERYONE. Check.

“behind this kuppai film”
Trashing something in its ENTIRETY and wishing that it doesn’t even exist just because it has some elements which WE don’t like. Check.

“but please we are tired of the “justifications” or the creative inspirations”
But WE are never tired of trying to silence those justifications.

A poor uneducated guy may damage public property while the opposite may not. But that is only because the lottery of birth has given him more frustrations and less to lose for unlawful behavior. Otherwise, the THOUGHT that something which WE hate shouldn’t even exist is there equally in both.

If one doesn’t like the movie and its justifications, one can easily ignore it. Nobody has been compelled to watch it. If something doesn’t make sense, people are not going to accept it even when multiple interviews are given to justify it. So, why try to suppress those voices which doesn’t make sense to us? Why can’t WE let each one decide whether it makes sense to him/her…. on their own?

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The interview is up.

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I’m about the enter the elevator (at the hotel, during IFFI) and out comes this clearly peeved actor. We chat. He asks if we can talk. I say I don’t have a crew, so can we do a text piece? No, he says, it must be video. And this resulted @fcompanionsouth

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sridharraman

I admire your patience, brangan.

Vijay Devarakonda almost sounds like Nithyananda, frankly.

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@Honest Raj

Why is he then doing these interviews?

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bala

VD: do you think we both are going to get backlash?

BR’s mind voice: should i tell him that only he will get, not me..
(decides not to tell)

BR: i don’t know..

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MANK

Vijay shouldn’t be doing this.

What did this interview achieve? Absolutely nothing (IMO).

He’s a very good actor. He has worked his way up on his own in a nepotism-only industry like Telugu cinema. He has built up a huge fan following (especially female). He should concentrate on his Films and his performances. He’s not an articulate person at all. One can feel the things that he wants to say boiling inside him, but they don’t come out properly and they don’t come out well either. He may have given more ammunition to his critics through interviews like this, who in this Twitter age, will tear apart and analyse every word he’s saying.

Another thing, and as you rightly pointed out, is that he’s pretty amateur and Is having a hard time coming to terms with this. He has to understand that criticism is as much a part of stardom and it’s not going to be only accolades all the way. There are people who are genuinely offended by the film and they are going to react and put their criticism out there. Deal with it. Try to understand it and introspect about it or just say they didn’t get it and move on . It’s just one film. The only reason why it got so much traction is because there was a Hindi remake and that became successful. Even though he keeps saying that he is got it off his chest , the last question about the backlash, shows his concerns.

I fully understand why Brangan went for this interview. It’s newsworthy and it’s commercial, it’s going to get a lot of views, and I don’t mean it in a negative way at all. That’s of immense importance to a digital channel. My only regret is that it turned out to be a nothing interview. The poor guy just struggled and struggled and said a lot of words that add up to nothing.

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Voldemort

Okay, is this his reaction to the backlash (not sure if there was one, haven’t seen it or followed it) for something he said in the FC Adda?

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shemz

The more he spoke, the faster his attractiveness dropped!!

Also BR – the ok from you in the end when he called this therapy 😀 excellent questions !!

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Isai: The problem, as I am watching, is Vijay doesn’t sound particularly democratic himself. He says about Parvathy bringing up the toxic aspect of Arjun Reddy, “I should have put it to sleep then, I should have killed it.” Yo, stud, you ain’t gonna kill nothing. This is a free country and we are going to keep saying how much we dislike that aspect of the film. And, trust me, it pleases me immensely that this criticism bothers you and the director so much. It should. Learn the right lesson from the criticism and introspect. And again, I am not saying you HAVE to make socially responsible cinema blah blah blah. Just don’t show grotesque behaviour and then try to tell us this is how it SHOULD be. YOU, SRV/Vijay, are the ones preaching, not us. Don’t tell us how to make love. And please don’t boast about how you treated rape victims as a medical student. Because even if you did, you will never have to live with the fear of being sexually assaulted that women have to. Is that really so hard to understand?

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He didn’t REALLY address what SRV said. SRV didn’t just say slapping can sometimes be ok, he said if a couple don’t have the freedom to slap each other, they haven’t really made love. I don’t think anything SRV does now short of walking back that remark is going to fix things. Considering that both love to lecture the audience about how to view cinema, SRV should have respected the need to separate himself from his creation and not insert his personal viewpoint into how it is interpreted. Once he did that, it became clear that the film WAS a projection of what he believes and not merely “two specific characters doing a bunch of specific things that need not represent anyone in particular”. I think what MANK said about Vijay applies to SRV too. They both need to learn to deal with the attention. Like the Arjun Reddy character, they both love to project a tough attitude like “I don’t give a f*** about you and I am going to kill this right now” but this only masks their anger and irritation at the comments. Which is unfortunate because the film succeeded, possibly well beyond their expectations. You can’t please everyone, so just move on.

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sorenkierky

Oh my life. Couldn’t watch post his rambling on about corporal (BR, guess you called it capital punishment lol) punishment and some backward ass logic supporting it. Don’t even think it’s worth discussing tbh.

This interview, if anything, has done more damage tbh. I was slightly irked by VD failing to understand what’s being said at the FC event too, but that was still not that bad. Forget the vociferous defense of the character’s moral compass, it was really painful to hear him just spout nonsense re: the fat chick bit (I even lost track of what he’s saying, he’s justifying by saying how he was respectful because he didn’t say it to her face? WTF?) and then it was just a downward spiral from then on.

I disagree with BR too on AR, but that’s a different debate though, a disagreement. This is just a train wreck.

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Voldemort

The whole See – I’m holding my hands in a heart but for you it appears like I’m about to fight analogy was major WTF.

Et tu BR? Did you really have to do this therapy session?

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Doba

The puffed up seriousness and utter lack of humour made it difficult to watch beyond 10 minutes . Why are you doing this horrid interview? I felt sorry.

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Maru

Aargh! This interview set my teeth on edge in a way that Arjun Reddy the film did not. As much as the misogynistic elements bothered me, I watched the film to the end because of Vijay Devarakonda’s magnetic screen presence. Whatever my peeves about the film, there was no looking away because Vijay as Arjun was excellent. I couldn’t however watch past the half way mark of this interview.

I couldn’t agree more with Mank, Anu, Madan & sorenkierky. We absolutely don’t need any more justification for Arjun Reddy’s flaws – the film is a smash hit, reputations have been burnished, now move on. The more Vijay justified the film, the worse it got. The point wasn’t simply that Arjun Reddy called the girl a fat chick and chose her for Preeti’s best friend – it was why. Apparently fat chicks are as warm as teddy bears and very loyal and worse yet pretty girls and fat chicks make for a great combination. If THAT notion isn’t insulting, disrespectful and objectifying of women I’m not sure what is. Still, one can brush that off as a character flaw, one that clearly finds resonance among a lot of people whether some of us like that representation or not. The objection people like me have is that Arjun Reddy was presented as heroic character, an aspirational one. Nawazuddin Siddiqui has made a career of playing ugly, awful sometimes unredeemable characters but whether it was in Raman Raghav, Gangs, or Haramkhor those characters aren’t presented as heroic or aspirational. Vijay D and his director can’t seem to fathom the difference.

Also, is Vijay just naive? According to him Arjun Reddy loved women (or claimed to!) and many women in the audience loved Arjun Reddy so it can’t be misogynistic. Does he not understand how misogyny is institutionalized and that women can be as guilty of it as men. Many of the perpetrators of female infanticide and dowry deaths are women, does that make the acts any less misogynistic? head desk

I do hope as he claimed this is the last time Vijay has defended the character. He’s doing the character no favors.

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I think the use of the word ‘misogyny’ in the discourse around this film (Minus the Vanga interview) doesnt actually capture the perceived problems in the film. Misogyny is defined as the hatred of women and with that context i can see why Vijay Devarakonda might not get the criticism aimed at the film. I think we need to be a little careful in how we use the word. I sometimes see people conflating sexism and misogyny…and no they aren’t the same and it doesn’t help to conflate the two to fight either.

I dont know what word can capture the inability to see women as autonomous beings (not exactly see us as sub human either but rather not recognize that like men we are thinking beings too, that we have fully formed and rich inner lives too), the inability (refusal?) to sense our discomfort, our boundaries…I think sexism would be more appropriate. Or we could say they simply do not understand women…but it isn’t something as simple as pure hatred.

I have no idea if I am making sense…

Also @brangan sir: I think when discussing the misogyny in the interview, you should have mentioned the obvious stuff like the knifepoint scene and the kissing without consent thing instead of the fat chick scene…

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This was a great comment in the YouTube comments section:

Vyshnavi S:
14 hours ago (edited)

I really like Vijay but I don’t think he actually understands the criticism that is coming his (or the film’s) way. There is a difference between saying 1.”these 2 people are abusive to each other BUT they also love each other” and 2.”these 2 people are abusive to each other BECAUSE they love each other”. In the first statement you are drawing a distinction between love and abuse while still recognizing that they can both exist in a relationship (although we can argue about what kind of love you have if you don’t have respect but that’s another story).

In the second statement you are making love conditional on abuse (or the right to abuse). You are saying if I love you then I also have the right to abuse you (or that abuse isn’t really abuse if I love you). Arjun Reddy the film and the director of the film don’t seem to understand this distinction. I think that’s the main issue here. I don’t think most people who are criticizing this film want every relationship in the world to be exactly the same.

Also, just because a lot of women love something doesn’t make that thing OK. We all grow up in a society that normalizes abuse, especially abuse from men to women. So everyone internalizes this including women. Those who are more aware of the issue and how it affects society are a little more critical when they this playing out either in real life or on screen.

It seems like Vijay needs to become more aware of social issues and how they affect people outside his own life. But I understand that’s really difficult to do especially when the criticism is so personal. I think given some time he’ll be able to step back and view the film and the issues surrounding it a little more objectively and decipher the valid criticism from the noise.

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nikkie1602: I see that “fat chick” scene as a more appropriate instance of misogyny because it’s a such a cool, casual snub of a woman — made when a guy is fully conscious of his actions. He is deliberately insulting this girl, mocking her appearance.

The knife-point scene — IMO — I don’t have a problem with because by that time he is not in his senses. He has totally fucked himself up with booze and drugs and what-not. Plus, there’s the anger issues.

That’s why the “fat chick” scene is the troubling one, for me.

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MANK: I get what you are saying, but this was also one of the most unusual interviews for me.

For one, it wasn’t planned at all. We bumped into each other at IFFI, Goa, and he was seething and said “I want to tell my side of the story”.

Anu had already asked the director about the more obvious issues in the film, so I decided the angle would be to see WHY all this is STILL bothering him after all this time.

So I decided to make it about HIM rather than the film.

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Kay

BR – kudos to you for doing this interview despite knowing you’ll be caught in the crossfire. Maybe you did it because it’ll generate more views, but I also feel you would have listened to him even if he just wanted to vent off the record.

Enough has been said about the interview and the movie, and I concur with most of the commenters here, so not gonna add more to it.

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I think the interview as such, as far as BR’s role as an interviewer goes, was pretty good. He let Vijay present his side but not without bringing up the legitimate questions that have been asked about the movie. Giving him a long rope to tie himself with, basically.

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Isai

Initially I couldn’t watch this for more than 2-3 minutes, so I played this in background and was browsing something else. Even then, I had to pause it multiple times before I could cross the first 15 minutes. It becomes a bit better after that.

I think Vijay’s problem is that he is someone who needs himself to be respected far more than to be liked. And while movie actors are loved by a lot of people, they don’t get much respect.

As MANK said, he is not articulate enough. An example is he says “I should have killed it” but what he perhaps meant was not that there shouldn’t be anyone criticising the movie but that he believes he had a powerful argument which would have refuted all criticism. This can be inferred as he later says that he is looking forward to understand what people think of his ‘powerful’ arguments.

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Isai

I felt BR didn’t ask the MOST critical questions about that movie. Perhaps he didn’t remember these since it was unprepared. The first being the ‘kissing an just known junior girl without consent’ scene. The second was ‘declaring her as a kind of his property to her classmates’ scene. The third was not about calling the friend fat. It was about stereotyping and correlating fat girls with loyalty, indeed a WTH moment for me and deciding whom his girlfriend should befriend. BR inadvertently made it easier for him by reducing it to just a ‘fat chick’ remark.

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” And while movie actors are loved by a lot of people, they don’t get much respect.” – Not sure I fully agree. I think actors like Naseeruddin Shah, Om Puri, Manoj Bajpai or Nawazuddin Siddiqui were/are all respected for their craft. It seems like some stars these days want that sort of respect without first building up that kind of body of work. Bajpai didn’t earn that image overnight and nor did Shah. I remember liking Nawaz a lot in Kahaani long before his acting became the talk of town. Another interesting tidbit: while idly browsing through Sanjay Khan’s The Great Maratha serial, I spotted Irfan Khan playing a cunning wazir. He had been slogging in the industry since that long! It’s maybe in the last 12 years or so that he has earned a name as a sort of actor’s actor. So Vijay has a long way to go before he commands RESPECT for his acting.

I get the same vibes from SRV by the way. Arjun Reddy is a pretty impressive work, strictly speaking of direction, for a new director. But he’s not yet an auteur and it’s annoying when he gives off auteur-like airs that, for all his recent ranting against Marvel, I don’t get from Marty for all these years of making so many great films. AR is a good film but not without its flaws like a screenplay that sags in places and SRV should put his head down and let his work speak for itself for now, instead of demanding people to respect his skills (which implies that they discuss the problematic aspects of AR only because they resent his success when it’s nothing like that).

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Isai

I didn’t have a problem with the slapping scene.

I googled “Is slapping ‘” and was surprised to see the top result as “Is slapping your BOYFRIEND okay”. Went through the top posts in quora and saw that many girls abroad had first slapped their boyfriends.

I grew up watching multiple women face domestic physical abuse and perhaps due to this, I have never slapped or hit any adult. I don’t know a single woman who had an abusive boyfriend/husband, say that in an argument, I slapped him FIRST, he slapped me back once, AND STOPPED.

I also remember GIRLS in the 18-25 age group who used to publically shout at their bfs/husbands and even those who have slapped their bfs. Some of them confided to me later “What to do, I am so short tempered’.

There is a difference between men who physically abuse women and 2 short tempered idiots like Arjun and Preethi.

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Isai

“Isai: The problem, as I am watching, is Vijay doesn’t sound particularly democratic himself.”

Madan: So what? As Maru said “This interview set my teeth on edge in a way that Arjun Reddy the film did not”. If VD/SRV don’t have convincing justifications, it is only going to turn more people against the movie. So why attempt to suppress their voices? And why try to make people like BR feel guilty for even giving them that platform? Why don’t we allow BR to act as per his business requirements and let people come to their own conclusions?

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“So why attempt to suppress their voices? ” – I did not say their voices should be suppressed and as you will note, I actually commended BR on the interview itself. However, I would like for you to also stop feeling so anxious for wronged men and call out Vijay and others too sometimes when they cross the line instead of insisting on only confronting the liberal side. I don’t care what Vijay really intended to say (and it’s probably a good idea to just say what you mean if you want to be clear) but however it was, it was rude. It makes his proclaimed respect for Parvathy sound phony and fake.

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Honest Raj

shaviswa: Why is he then doing these interviews?

May be, he wanted to “educate” feminists, chauvinists, masochists, normal people, Twitter intelligentsia, et al.

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hattorihanzo4784

This is fast turning into a reality show.

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hattorihanzo4784: Are you calling me a Kardashian? Do I have to school YOU now?

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Isai

“And while movie actors are loved by a lot of people, they don’t get much respect.” – Not sure I fully agree. ”

Sorry, I had meant movie ‘stars’. Not just ‘actors’, even a director like Bala got a lot of respect just after his 3rd film Pithamagan. But, many ‘stars’ don’t get such respect even after decades. In tamil, the word ‘koothaadi’ is often used pejoratively.

” I did not say their voices should be suppressed”

It was not directed at you. I was just reiterating what I had said in my original comment.

“I would like for you to also stop feeling so anxious for wronged men”

It is not about wronged men. I usually comment defending someone only when I sense misdirected/disproportionate anger. In THIS blog, it often happens with wronged and perhaps even wrong men. That’s all.

“call out Vijay and others too sometimes when they cross the line”

I did call out and in fact wrote a separate comment about what I thought were the critical questions that need to be asked. The thing is you call him out like a plaintiff. I call him out like a judge. “The defendant is found guilty in 3 of the 5 charges made against him while there is not sufficient evidence for 2 others”.. this is my style. Even when I am angry, my comments become acerbic.. but not very emotionally invested. I guess that will remain a personality difference between you and me.

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“I did call out and in fact wrote a separate comment about what I thought were the critical questions that need to be asked. The thing is you call him out like a plaintiff. I call him out like a judge” – Nope, you played down/contextualised his “killing it” comment as “he didn’t really mean that”. So if you’re going to use parallels from law, let me say that as someone who has represented before people with judicial authority, a judge would do a plain reading of the words as stated. Which I obviously didn’t do because ‘killing it’ is a metaphorical expression. Actually, come to think of it, even your charitable interpretation doesn’t paint him in a favourable light. What, he thinks he can refute each and everything people say about the film in one shot? Lol, either he takes method acting too seriously or he embodies the character he played in AR to a large extent.

” Even when I am angry, my comments become acerbic.. but not very emotionally invested. ” – Really? Talking of suppressing voices is not emotionally invested? No sooner should a few commenters express irritation that Arjun Reddy gets so much airtime on FC than you think people are trying to silence Vijay and/or make BR feel guilty about interviewing him? Meanwhile Vijay has all the licence to use rude and haughty expressions towards other actors, towards critics, members of the audience, etc? Come on! Look, we all have our biases and that’s ok but only so long as we recognise them. Perhaps, yes, some people here are too worried about what happens to women after such films when we know India wasn’t exactly a heaven for them long before AR was made. Whether or not I agree with this proposition, I can understand this viewpoint. But by the same token, you positively project Vijay as some vulnerable dude who needs protection and I see a star who is riding high on a huge BO success. What suppression are we talking about? Dude gets a what 30 minute long slot to make his case; if he still feels suppressed, maybe some goli soda will help clear the muck from his stomach and help him feel better.

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Rahul

VD was chuckling – ” I made love to my lover. Did that result in a population bump?”
MB in the FC interview- ” The values come from your family and education. Movies are secondary and do not have much effect”

I am going to hypothesize about the conditions that foster effect of movies for some themes and not so much for others.

First – relevant sample size . How many people are Gangs of Wasseypur like situations? Let’s say 1 %. But 100 % of young men and women have to play the dating game.So sample size is the whole young population between 12 and 30 . Besides it has also been documented in Roberto Saviano’s book how the style of violence of Italy’s gangs were influenced by Hollywood gangster movies.

Second – The urgency \ importance of the theme in the lives of sample. This is in response to the oft repeated query that why don’t people get influenced by the good things? Fact is, having a girlfriend or being in contact with girls is probably the most important thing in the life of a horny teenager. Helping poor people or becoming a Mahesh Babu type messiah is probably not that much important and I do not blame them.

Third – Existence of other sources of information \ guidance. I am not aware of any school or parents teaching teenagers how to approach girls and ask for their number etc. So I am not sure about Manoj Bajpayee’s point here. Films are the ONLY source of guidance. Reminds me of another VD movie – Geeth Govindam. Here also , he kissed the girl without consent. But no feminists created a furore out of this movie. Why? Because he is shown as a clueless guy and not as an alpha male. He was convinced by his equally clueless friend to do it.

Fourth – Clarity of morality. Even if someone is not taught this explicitly, there is some morality that we have as human beings that tells us that murdering , hurting others is wrong. But in case of approaching girls, our films present us this image of a girl who needs to be coaxed to say yes. So, people who get influenced from such movies , think that girls also want the same thing (to be stalked) and in their minds probably do not think of themselves as amoral.

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therag

Replying to BR’s linked youtube comment – I can think of one film which made the point that two people can love each other and also be abusive without claiming any causation or correlation -> Kaatru Veliyidai.

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Vidya Ramesh

Not enough meat in the video for a kardashian BR.. Not nearly enough. No one can call you a kardashian.. That needs a particularly specific set of skills and a good plastic surgeon on speed dial.. which you do not possess. 🙂

Ps: I’m sorry I couldn’t resist.

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krishikari

OMG I can’t believe I watched this whole interview! I was intensely bored and completely fascinated at the same time. It was like watching someone slowly and awkwardly sticking his whole head up his own arse, just to demonstrate that it was possible. Same with the SVR interview, the star and the director are pretty much cut from the same cloth. Both are having a hard time separating themselves from the character.

As others have said, their film was a huge success, so many people have absolutely no problem with it, then why not enjoy it instead of trying to counter the criticism without even understanding it in the first place? It’s quite baffling, and he never answered the question BR asked about why this criticism bothered him at all. Maybe he doesn’t know, self-aware he is not.

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krishikari

@nikkie1602 “….the inability to see women as autonomous beings (not exactly see us as sub human either but rather not recognize that like men we are thinking beings too, that we have fully formed and rich inner lives too)…”

This inability is very much misogyny. To define it as pure hatred only, is limiting the meaning of the term IMO. To look at women as as a lesser species is also misogyny. That’s the sense I get when this actor said “but Arjun Reddy loves women!” like saying “I love dogs, so adorable!”

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rsylviana

Couldn’t get past the first half of the interview. VD seems delusional and seriously should have just slept on it and blown off some steam rather than do this. The whole “Arjun Reddy loves women because he “loves” Preethi and his grandmom” is so laughable. And that pathetic excuse/ explanation for the whole “fat chick” comment is something else entirely. But IMO , BR should have asked “Ok , suppose the “fat chick” in question got insulted with the whole assumption that she would be a loyal friend just because she is fat and shot back at Arjun saying “You know what ! I don’t want any of this , so why don’t you find some other fat chick to be your precious little girlfriend’s aide” then would Arjun have still respected the woman in front of him for speaking up or gone all Arjun Reddy on her ?” That would have probably made him introspect about what the backlash was all about and how closed-off he seems to be in his own world. Or not. I really don’t know at this point.

@BR – Any plans of watching/reviewing Knives Out ?

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https://www.economist.com/prospero/2015/08/21/three-cheers-for-misogyny

@krishkari: I think not limiting its meaning is not going to help us. The meaning of the word has become so vague. How will we target specific behaviour then? For example, I am sure a Vijay Deverakonda would have no qualms in supporting and even outraging against domestic abuse, acid attacks, discriminatory employment practices, increasing rapes…etc. But the same man simply doesn’t ‘get’ what is wrong with the fat chick scene. This is far more insiduous a problem and requires a more nuanced taking down than simply labelling it ‘misogyny’ IMO.

This article articulates it better:

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nikkie1602: That’s a great comment about the “fat chick” part. This is what I wrote in my review:

Even when Arjun is being obnoxious – like when he asks a “fat chick” to befriend Preeti –Deverakonda makes us believe he’s acting in his girl’s best interest.

This was far more disturbing to me on screen than the knife-point scene, which is the most easily plausible and justified scene. Because one instant later, when the lights come back on, he himself comes back to his senses. He drops the knife and retreats — he “knows” what he did (temporary insanity or whatever) is wrong.

So he knows “threatening a woman” is wrong. But he doesn’t see calling a woman (even out of earshot) a “fat chick” could be a problem.

The big things — everyone knows they are wrong. It’s the smaller infractions that present a grey area that people are unable to see as “wrong”.

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@brangan: Absolutely. It is such a tossed off throw away line. The knife point scene wasn’t problematic because it was a transgression even in the film’s universe, though i think making the guy outside the door a fool lessened the impact of the scene a bit.

Even in Kabir Singh, he tosses off a ‘dupatta seedha karo’ to Preeti. It is done so inconsequentially.

P.S. I watched Kabir Singh and Arjun Reddy side by side out of curiosity. I don’t get the claim that Preeti had no agency. It wasn’t clear in Arjun Reddy but Kabir Singh made it very obvious that Preeti was in the classroom when Kabir/Arjun argues with the dean. She has been watching, she knows who he is. Preeti looks even a little fascinated in Kabir Singh when her father meets with Kabir in college. Also, Kabir Singh explored a little more of Preeti’s madness as well. When she surprises him at his place of work in some hill station, she demands that he kiss her. He objects because it would be inappropriate but she insists I want you to kiss me here and now. You cant deny her agency in the relationship. These are very specific people in a very specific kind of relationship.

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nikkie1602: This is interesting. I have not got this about the differences between AR and KS from any of the reviews or the criticism. In AR she is shown as a mostly mute spectator, sort of a captive of Arjun and then suddenly she grows to love him. I found that arc (rather, the lack of an arc) totally unconvincing. When she meets Arjun with her father, she even looks scared about him and decides against naming him as the culprit. AR basically showed a sort of college bully or goonda forcing Preeti into the relationship. From what you say, KS was more complicated. If this is indeed so, it may explain some of the angst of SRV.

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Isai

“Nope, you played down/contextualised his “killing it” comment as “he didn’t really mean that””

I heard the full interview only after reading your and MANK’s comment. When it came to the “killing it” part, I went in with your notion but then his later comment about looking forward to how people react to his arguments seemed contradictory. That’s when I recalled MANK’s comment about him not being articulate enough and I hinted about it in my comment since I care about YOU and thought you had misunderstood.

“even your charitable interpretation doesn’t paint him in a favourable light”

Exactly. I still feel that his arguments were quite weak.

“Really? Talking of suppressing voices is not emotionally invested?”

It would be if one feels sympathy for the person whose voice is being suppressed. I don’t care about VD. I haven’t watched any of his movies after AR and this is the 1st interview of his that I watched, mainly to see how BR performs when he is not well prepared.

I feel NOBODY’s voice should be suppressed irrespective of the strength or goodness of their arguments or how bad they are as a person. In this blog, I was just pointing out this behavior pattern of some people who demand the suppression of the voices that doesn’t make sense to them. VD is just incidental.

“Meanwhile Vijay has all the licence to use rude and haughty expressions towards other actors, towards critics, members of the audience, etc?”

If he turns out to be a prick, you can call him out as one. But, for me, neither his nor your voice should be suppressed. That’s all.

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Isai: I don’t know why you keep saying I was not well-prepared. You could feel — after watching it — that I did not do a good job, and that’s your evaluation, which I cannot argue with.

I just said this interview came out of the blue. But once I knew it was going to happen, I certainly prepared. I knew I would not go into the movie (as Anu had already done with Vanga). So I said I’d do a more personal journey, about HIS angst.

I had certain questions written out and (like always) a mental outline of contingencies in case he did not go where I wanted him to go.

I NEVER go to any interview unprepared.

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Isai : They are not asking for suppression of voices, they are asking as consumers of the blog why do they need this. They have a right to say so. They have voices too and as you just said, nobody’s voice needs to be suppressed. Suppressing Vijay’s voice would be something like bringing an injunction in a court asking for the movie to be taken off distribution. Nobody has done that. Yes there was a ban Kabir Singh twitter hashtag and that’s wrong. But I am not aware of any of the blog participants suggesting something like this.

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Isai

BR, if it usually takes less than a few hours (the time that I thought you had for THIS interview) to prepare well for an interview, then kudos to you. I was only interested in understanding how much of a good interviewer’s success is due to preparation and how much is due to thinking on feet. That’s all. I recall having a similar conversation with you in NGK’s review.

I thought you didn’t ask some critical questions about the movie because you didn’t get enough time to recall those scenes and frame questions. Now, I realise it was by design and not due to lack of time.

“I knew I would not go into the movie (as Anu had already done with Vanga). So I said I’d do a more personal journey, about HIS angst.”

HIS angst, at least what he expressed in this interview, is mainly due to people’s criticism of the movie. Now when you decide to not go into the movie, it would become difficult to have a proper dialogue on whether people had misinterpreted the movie or whether VD has not understood its criticism. Instead, it can only end up like a therapy session, which many YouTubers felt it did.

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Wow!! So many comments on this video? Surprised considering that nothing new actually came out of it. You still maintain that AR is misogynistic and that the director and the hero have no clue why people are labelling the film that way.

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@madan: It is interesting indeed. KS is for the most part a shot by shot remake.

Like, KS also cast a curly haired bespectacled woman as one of Kabir’s friends as they did in AR. But there are some curious differences. Like when Preeti clings to Kabir at her place to beg him to stay he says tu kaun hai campus mein kaun jaanta hai tujhe tu sirf kabir singh ki bandi hai….and Preeti says haan mai koi nahi hoon tumhaare bina….this is entirely missing in AR.

The scene where Arjun bashes Shiva’s prospective brother-in-law about objectifying air hostesses is missing in KS. The domestic help chasing scene is extended a lot in KS. Shiva’s father is completely missing in KS.

The holi scene is curioser. Kabir’s primary response is anger. Arjun’s is more complex. He is visibly sobbing.

And AR charted their physical intimacy at a different level. The music choices in both the films during the sequence say a lot. AR’s song “Madhurame” is in a female voice. With sitars and the dhom tanana dhom vocalization, its like we are watching something ceremonial, like it has been ordained. The song is KS is your regular guitar ballad and is a duet with lyrics that go tujhpe mera haq hai…its a bit meh.

I think Kabir comes out as more assholey than Arjun but Preeti/Kiara comes across madder than Preeti/Shalini.

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bart

VD: “I am gonna put to sleep.. I am going to kill it.. ”
We: Ahaan..

After a few meandering rambles (BTW, the session could’ve been better to watch, more ARish, with a few pegs, cheers and bottoms-ups. Please consider this a a humble suggestion for the next therapy)…

VD: “I look forward to hearing the other side and views”
We: Meh..

Data and time wasted…

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tonks

VD: do you think we both are going to get backlash?
BR’s mind voice: should i tell him that only he will get, not me..
(decides not to tell)
BR: i don’t know

Hilarious 😀

This whole angst ridden interview is sort of funny (though I admit I admit I skipped through it a lot).

The point about certain types of misogyny being more difficult to understand by some is valid. We get that all the time from people around us.

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tonks

A YouTube comment beneath this video :

“Whether AR showed misogyny or not is one thing but Vijay not understanding what misogyny is even after BR breaks it down into granules is another level altogether”

Also like a lady said who commented there said, growing up in India, all of us, male and female have so much internalised normalisation of misogyny that it maybe difficult to understand it as wrong when someone calls it out.

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Priya Richard

Hope VD moves on and leaves AR and its criticism behind him. I really like that guy as an actor and the way he has reacted has left a sour taste. No other star has justified or defended his/her role this vehemently though they have played more misogynistic and lewd characters. Guess he’s sensitive to social media that’s not going to give him peace of mind. He’s a fine actor and I want to see him performing for many more years and not get bogged down or overreacting to characters that he plays on screen. No one can take away or deny the accolades for his legendary performance as AR, but he as person is not AR. So, be calm in the face of criticism and take a break before your next enthralling presence on screen.

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Isai

“They are not asking for suppression of voices, they are asking as consumers of the blog why do they need this.”

I have seen the consumers of THIS blog asking for something, like reviews for movies Bala, Knives out etc. But I don’t remember them ever saying we don’t need this. I thought if they are not interested in something, they just scroll down.

“They have a right to say so. They have voices too and as you just said, nobody’s voice needs to be suppressed…. But I am not aware of any of the blog participants suggesting something like this.”

I am only pointing out the hypocrisy where the same people who expressed disgust at people who demanded banning the movie Padmavat, now don’t find anything wrong in saying that this movie need not be remade multiple times or we do not need more interviews with people defending this movie. As I said, at the thought level, both people seem to be similar while only the execution method differs due to their birth and upbringing.

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Ravi K

Thinking back on my one viewing of “Arjun Reddy,” I felt that the main problem with the film was in the ending. Preethi’s baby turned out to be Arjun’s, since she never consummated her marriage with the other guy, which just reinforces the trope of the woman only being with one man, for all the film’s supposed modernity. And all of Arjun’s obsession and toxic behavior is rewarded with him getting the girl he was obsessed with the entire time. Other than that I felt it was a depiction of a toxic, broken man, rather than a glorification of him. But maybe I’d feel differently on another viewing.

I watched it in a theater here in the US with a small, fairly sedate audience. If I saw it with audience in India, who were cheering and whistling at the things Arjun was doing, I might have reacted differently to the film.

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kaizokukeshav

Mr VD is losing maturity, he is under the impression that he is the next superstar. In turn everyone around him is plainly toying with him. In Telugu there is a phrase called “Nadamantrapu Siri” which means when someone get a lot of wealth all of a sudden they will live with full of ignorance. He is in the same phase, probably not able to digest the fact that everyone is moving over with the issues and he is trying hard to prove his innocence. If there is someone who should answer back about Arjun Reddy it’s the writer Sandeep. VD doesn’t need to answer as he is just a medium that puts the character on to the screen.

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enna koduka sir pera

I second Tonks’s point. Certain types of misogyny are difficult to understand and unless a given person has active conversations with someone who can break it down to them clearly, it’s hard to understand them. And, these things take time. To me, it is already a small sign of victory when VD said he will think about doing such scenes in future movies to avoid controversies. And, I think in these types of conversations, you need someone actively arguing for the case at hand, to lay out the points clearly to define why it is misogynistic. BR was mainly a neutral moderator in this interview, and rightly so for that was his role, and there wasn’t a voice to explain to VD why his points were not right. Maybe a discussion between Parvathy and VD would have been better! Also, for those of us calling things out, it is hard, but extremely important to be patient in presenting out points without a tone of condescension/frustration/impatience. Condescension may make the person go defensive and deaf to our arguments. It is very hard to be patient in this scenario, but I see it as the only way to be.

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enna koduka sir pera: in these types of conversations, you need someone actively arguing for the case at hand, to lay out the points clearly to define why it is misogynistic. BR was mainly a neutral moderator in this interview, and rightly so for that was his role…

So that would become a debate, for one. Not a conversation, or an interview.

Also, in the context of an interview / conversation (as opposed to a debate), I am very uncomfortable about “schooling” someone ON CAMERA.

That would be like elevating myself to a teacher and reducing the interviewee to a student in public.

I would rather have a private conversation where this explanation (or “schooling”) took place.

An interview / conversation like this is a situation where someone is very vulnerable, and when they are opening up like this — HOWEVER misguided they may be — it is important to respect that vulnerability and not attack or school them, in front of the camera.

If you want to do the latter, then you should tell VD, “Okay, let’s do an argument about this” — so that HE is in that frame of mind, too. And that becomes a very different energy.

I saw someone who was still struggling to come to grips with something, and that’s why I took this route — I wanted to make him think about the “fat chick” scene, and yet not bang the gavel down on him.

Viewers, of course, may disagree.

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enna koduka sir pera

BR – I completely admire and respect your sensitivity in this situation! Actually, you have provided a great example of what I was talking about in trying to change mindsets – how not to make the other person feel bad/dumb when they genuinely don’t understand a different point of view. Because once we do that, then it is almost a lost cause IMO. It is so rare for an interviewer to treat the situation with sensitivity, not with the intention of reducing someone to a joke in public. Kudos to you for that. You and Anupama have always been like that.

When I mentioned “BR was mainly a neutral moderator in this interview, and rightly so for that was his role…”, I didn’t mean to criticize you or your role. As I had mentioned, you rightly did as your role deemed in that situation. I meant in general that for VD to get an understanding of what the other group is trying to say, there needs to be an active debate/discussion between him and the opposite party (Parvathy for example and I didn’t mean in front of the camera) and without that, we can’t expect him to think and change in a few days.

The seed has been planted in his head. Let us allow a few months for it to germinate and hopefully he gets the criticism of AR!

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enna koduka sir pera : I am not sure even by engaging him and putting him on the spot with pointed questioning, he would change his mind. Rare for adults to (at least on a topic where they are already on the defensive) and if they did, it would have to be offline, not on camera. On camera, he will be most concerned with not losing face.

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I was more befuddled by @baradwajrangan who just sat there- no counter point,not getting annoyed by the guy. True privilege of being an upper class man in India. You can grin& enjoy something so toxic. Shameful.

— Kamayani Vyas (@k4ms) December 10, 2019

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brangan : Wonder what she has to say then of Emily Maitlis’ interview of Prince Andrew. I am sure that interview would have been a lot less effective in exposing him had she been combative and argumentative (rather than the patient, meticulous approach she adopted for this one). Gad, somebody needs to tell woke twitterati that by your injecting political rhetoric into an event, the event doesn’t actually become political and it only reflects how consumed or obsessed with politics you might be. If we start questioning body language and expression of interview, might as well not have any interviews at all. Somehow I think the woke crowd would rather enjoy that boring, killjoy world they so badly want to usher in.

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OMG, did somebody just become befuddled that BR did not get annoyed with a person whom he was interviewing? Getting annoyed is wrong and not getting annoyed is wrong too?

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MANK

An interview / conversation like this is a situation where someone is very vulnerable, and when they are opening up like this — HOWEVER misguided they may be — it is important to respect that vulnerability and not attack or school them, in front of the camera.

Good point. But i sincerely hope you never take a job at Republic TV or Times Now. You would be a complete failure.And sincerely hope that VD never does an interview with Arnab or Karan Thapar . they will wipe the studio floor with him

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RC

True Incident

I brought up Kabir Singh with 2 male colleagues currently in their late 20s. Both of them claimed to have liked / loved the movie. One of them explained that he generally likes movies for their story and the message of KS, which he thought a lot of people did not get is (I am not even paraphrasing, I quote verbatim) ” guys can go to any extent for their love, whereas it is not the same with women”.

As gobsmacking as it was for me, this probably explains the movie’s success. Show a misbehaving, substance abusing, entitled, irresponsible and generally horrible character, and our audience comes out seeing a man in louuvve.

Ah looouvvve. Because it can only be misery. Who would believe in the depths of his looouuvve if Arjun Reddy / KS was a well adjusted adult, dealing with his emotional trauma sanely. That would have been bereft of drama, on and off the screen.

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sachita

Sometime after swathi murder, Dhanush had said that he never asks to do like characters he plays on screen and told peope should just view them as characters he plays on screen.

Why could vijay devarkonda make that distinction – he cant that be dumb.

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@RC: Okay that is horrifying.

There’s no denying that Arjun Reddy is a powerful film. We are still talking about it. For me, it is fascinating how I knew objectively that this an asshole of the supreme order yet I found the love story compelling and the film immennsely watchable. I give that to my reading of Preeti and also for the refusal of the film and its characters to be all sympathetic to Arjun.

I wonder though…when we talk about the influence of such films…can we discount confirmation bias? Yes, the film is validating the sexist views of the men like mentioned in RC’s comment. But is that the film’s fault only? Or is it our definitions of glorifications are different? So many questions!!

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“Show a misbehaving, substance abusing, entitled, irresponsible and generally horrible character, and our audience comes out seeing a man in louuvve.” – Tbf, crazy love affairs DO happen. You will notice sometimes, especially in lower/lower middle class, young couples standing and arguing on the road. Sometimes matters get to a slap.

The problem isn’t depicting a flawed love affair between two crazy people. It is in holding up Arjun Reddy as a posterboy, of going to the extent of titling the film after him. If as the director claims, it is a film about two crazy people in love, why so much primacy to the MAN? The director (and possibly Vijay as well) does appreciate a certain view of masculinity where the man should be strong, take no prisoners, do rowdygiri and be able to get away with, treat his lover badly and still ‘love’ her so madly she will come back to him. He gave a hint into his worldview when he said he always loved the name Arjun from childhood because it denotes strength or something like that.

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“I wonder though…when we talk about the influence of such films…can we discount confirmation bias? ” – It is certainly not the film’s fault ALONE that sexist behaviour happens in India. After all, Hollywood cleaned up its act and that hasn’t exactly killed sexism in America. As Vijay said, even if films are an influence, it is only one of the factors.

So that isn’t the issue. The issue is in espousing and promoting a view and later trying to seek refuge under the “I just made a film with characters” defence. In that respect, Vijay and SRV are at least less hypocritical. They reveal, inadvertently or not, that they are so consumed in patriarchal views that they do not even understand what misogyny really is. I have always maintained that once you draw the lead male character as a HERO specifically, then you imply that what he does is right. This is not the same thing as casting DiCaprio in Wolf of Wall Street. Leo may have had a romantic image long ago when he acted in Titanic but in that movie, there is no room for doubts as to his utter greed and lack of morals. If somebody does do what Vijay suggested and get inspired to do financial frauds by watching Wolf of Wall Street, that can’t be helped. But the movie itself doesn’t tell you that what Jordan Belfort did is right. HERO is a very Indian cinema conception and directors can’t both cling to that for box office returns and also fulfill their artistic impulses to explore grey characters at one and the same time. If you go grey, then de-massify it please.

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Asking for a friend-
1.Kamal Hasan/ Rati taking their own lives in EDKL is fine?
2.Rajni garu’s killings in Andha Kanoon are fine?
3.AB Chastising Zeenat Aman for wearing a bikini in Dostana is fine ?( The dialogs were by Salim- Javed)
4.Glorification of Nayakan is fine ?
5 Killings by Kamal in Indian , I guess are all fine?
It’s just a film , a fictional story, why so much intolerance and lynching here ?
Kuch toh log kahengey, logo ka kaam hai Kehna !!

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@madan: I get that and agree that our filmmakers need to be a bit mindful… And yes this particular film has its share of problematic bits and those should rightfully be discussed. But I dont get the massive backlash the film got in the first place (discounting the Vanga interview). Nowhere in the film is the man rewarded for his fuck ups. He is thrown out of his house. He is beaten up and the love of his life doesnt even flinch nor even look at him. She goes on to marry to spite him as he had cursed her to do the same. There was criticism about the fact that it was his baby, that Preeti had to be ‘pure’. But the woman’s marriage was the equivalent of the middle finger, she was crazily in love with him so why would she consummate the marriage? And it is forgotten that Arjun never managed to sleep with anybody himself. The man abuses his body, his friends too. He goes through a self made wringer.
Yes he got the girl at the end. But the girl wanted him too…

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” But I dont get the massive backlash the film got in the first place (discounting the Vanga interview). Nowhere in the film is the man rewarded for his fuck ups.” – For me, it’s the background score constantly seeking to manipulate us into sympathising with him or celebrating him that bothered me and made me see it as an attempt at hero-worshipping Arjun Reddy rather than merely essaying the character and leaving it there. I was even more convinced of this because SRV does not allow BGM to be lathered all over the film. It is used very selectively and strategically. So this is clearly the director dictating to us how to feel about Arjun Reddy. And I don’t like that at all. It’s not even about this one film. I didn’t like the BGM in Onaayum Aatukuttiyum in many places (when I watched the film; standalone the music was great). I later learnt from Myskinn’s interview that he had prevailed over Ilayaraja and insisted on dictating a viewpoint through the music rather than allowing the audience to decide. I basically don’t like manipulative BGMs much and when it is combined with problematic material like Arjun Reddy, it’s a double whammy. There were other things like him saying her one cursory look at him in college somehow conveyed crystal clear that she was interested in him and him only. But again, I could have let this go as merely what this stupid, fucked up guy thinks had it not been for SRV insisting that Arjun was in fact entirely justified in thinking this way.

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Rahul

nikkie1602 – “But I dont get the massive backlash the film got in the first place”

On this blog itself I think there were 3 articles defending the movie. And there was one video essay published by FC and here by an editor ( I forget the name). The massive adulation has lead to massive backlash IMHO. And that has lead to more adulation. And more backlash. And so on.

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“4.Glorification of Nayakan is fine ?” – Not fine by me and I have never missed an opportunity to mention this and I am not about to now. Not just Nayakan, in general, Mani gets frequently let off easy for weak and/or problematic writing. Never understood why.

Never watched Ek Duje/Andha Kanoon/Dostana. But I will say that with Kamal/Rajni they are already elevated to superstars, i.e. our desi Superman/Spiderman so there is already a suspension of disbelief on the part of the audience. There is no doubt that this is supposed to be escapist entertainment not to be taken too seriously. Again, that kind of treatment does not work when you take up a closer-to-life theme and also give it a more realistic treatment. With only a few changes, Arjun Reddy could be a wonderful and non-problematic film. At least imo. I strongly feel the director wanted to insert a viewpoint into the film and that’s what created the problems. This is why criticism of the film winds up him (as well as Vijay) because they want concurrence with this view. They are not ok that we are not ok with such a viewpoint.

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Rahul

“EXCLUSIVE: #ShahidKapoor walks out of awards show, refuses to perform after being denied Best Actor award”

Ironically, the actors who are insisting that this film did not affect others seem to have been affected by it the most. : )

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RC

Madan – I had the same problem with AR. I don’t mind watching movies about messy lives and loves, but the movie’s gaze towards its male lead was so sympathetic, it was revolting to me.

Nikkie1602 – to me, it felt like AR faced no real consequences. He played the poor little rich addict, imo.

Rocky – yes, fiction, only a movie, yes. But the actor has tried to drag it back into focus, no?

Seperately, after 10 mins of this interview, I landed on Anupama Chopra’s interview of the director. Made me wonder if he was trying to be crass to grab eyeballs (that’s probably the kindest explanation?). Stopped watching when he said that KS marking the girl as ‘meri Bandi hai’ is similar to people getting married. Gah.

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@Rocky – AB Chastising Zeenat Aman for wearing a bikini in Dostana is fine ?( The dialogs were by Salim- Javed)

Absolutely not! I cringed when I watched that scene as a girl, but the theatre erupted with claps and wolf whistles. I watched Dostana in the somewhat-recent past and cringed again. His character is a chauvinistic pig. It doesn’t make it right because it’s AB who’s doing it. He’s done enough cringeworthy roles/scenes in his 50-long career.

Rajni in Andha Kanoon, Kamal in Indian and AS, Amitabh in Aakhree Rasta – these are all films with ‘vengeance killings’. (Though AB in this film does get killed in the end.) I’m sure there are more. But the truth is that for every such film, there are enough counter narratives where the law is upheld.

Here, the problem is two fold: 1) There are far more ‘stalking-as-wooing’ characters in films than there are vigilantes. 2)The misogyny is so insidious that sometimes you can’t even pinpoint the exact scene where it happens.

Let me also add that if at all someone decides to follow in the footsteps of the vengeance-seekers in film, he/she’s going to be very much in the minority. Whereas, ‘love’ is a universal emotion, and the idea that they are ‘owed’ the attention of the women they are in ‘love’ with is a scary thing to imagine. That women can be raped, disfigured or killed because they don’t respond to their stalkers like the heroines on screen has been the ground reality for women for some time now.

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Also, this: It’s just a film , a fictional story, why so much intolerance and lynching here ?

It’s lived reality for a lot of women. And why is expressing our disagreement on a blog ‘intolerance’? It’s not like we are suppressing the right of the film maker or the actor to make the movie or talk about it. When they justify their views/perspectives on something that’s put out for us to consume, isn’t it okay to disagree with that perspective – and say why we disagree?

‘Lynching’ has a very specific meaning, and very violent roots . It’s better not to dilute it to mean people protesting civilly. No?

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@madan: Fair enough.

@Rahul: That’a curious though no?

For my part, I am a proud intersectional feminist. I abhor the garden variety misogyny in our films. I just feel in this film, the discussion demanded more nuance. I have thoughts regarding the use of the word misogyny as I have mentioned in previous comments which came up when the backlash started. The kind of discourse that emerged made me question myself..was i being a bad feminist? When i just couldnt see the blatant misogyny alleged, I was mystified. I think i am defending the film because I don’t want to be lumped togethet with MRAs and trolls, which is what the discourse has devolved into. Around the time of Arjun Reddy, rhe discussion was healthy. Kabir Singh is another beast.

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Isai

I think how one reacts to this movie is also determined by one’s family background which is an environmental factor of one’s personality. For example, Reddys, Rajputs etc. were a large population marital races/militant castes who had faced lot of battles in the previous centuries.. they rebelled against oppression and consequently their future was often uncertain and dangerous. This made them take pride in their bravado, be obsessed with their goals and live in the moment. Other communities also thought highly of this behavior, unless they were at the receiving end. This cultural ethos gets passed on from one generation to next. That is why such hyper masculine behavior is viewed sympathetically.

Whereas, Tamil Nadu has relatively been much peaceful. It has faced the least number of wars. There are only 2 communities with small population that can be classified as militant castes. So, there is no such cultural ethos of hyper masculinity. (Even the aanda parambarai thingy is only used to reassert dominance and not hyper masculinity since there were not that many wars in TN.)

That is why an Aditya Varma would never get the success that AR or KS got.

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Isai

While I think the movie is quite problematic, I feel the SEVERITY of the backlash is not due to its glorification of inappropriate behavior. That is why it doesn’t make much sense to compare this with movies like Nayagan. This movie and a reaction of a section of audience to it, reminded some people of a frustrating aspect of their lives: when an argument boils down to a confrontation, their relative lack of physical strength leaves them at a significant disadvantage. I know people who have come to terms with this. Just like how a zookeeper doesn’t spend her day worrying about the lion, for she knows how to handle it, these people know how to maneuver around such bullies. It is only those internet warriors who are neither good at physical confrontation nor at emotional manipulation, who vent out their frustration this amplifying this backlash.

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rsylviana

It is only those internet warriors who are neither good at physical confrontation nor at emotional manipulation, who vent out their frustration this amplifying this backlash

Wow , thats a first !

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@rsylviana : This is turning into continuation of VD interview on the blog. Nothing to add, waiting with bated breath for more ‘revelations’.

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@ rsylvania – right? (smh)

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Honest Raj

they rebelled against oppression and consequently their future was often uncertain and dangerous.

Rajput and Reddy were originally “titles” and not castes. Second, when Sandeep Vanga Reddy was questioned about the title of the film, he said he chose his own caste because it “asserts” a certain power and authority. In the political and socio-economic spheres of AP, the Reddys are the most influential caste. NTR formed the TDP with the sole intention of bringing down the hegemony of “Reddy Congress” (as it was viewed by other dominant castes of the united AP during the time of Indira and Rajiv). This has nothing to do with oppression or rebellion. In fact, the protagonist of the film hates caste.

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Madan: There is no doubt that this is supposed to be escapist entertainment not to be taken too seriously. With only a few changes, Arjun Reddy could be a wonderful and non-problematic film.

I agree, I found Kabir’s taking Kiara to boys’ Hostel and the slap very offensive and problematic . I also found the gross twisting of truth in Article 15 hugely offensive and problematic. Ab Kya kareyn .

Anu: It’s not like we are suppressing the right of the film maker or the actor to make the movie or talk about it. When they justify their views/perspectives on something that’s put out for us to consume, isn’t it okay to disagree with that perspective – and say why we disagree?.

I have no issues with that Anu, but I don’t think any director has been subject to such Vile and ridicule.

I think BR himself mentioned that part of the awkwardness in Reddy’s responses to Anupama was due to him not being comfortable with English.

Aside: On Anupma Chopra- IMO she is terrible as a reviewer but is excellent as an interviewer .

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Isai

Honest Raj: I am not bringing caste anywhere into making of this movie. I am only talking about its box office reception.

To give another example Nattamai and its telugu (Pedarayudu) , kannada (Simhadriya Sinha) remakes are iconic blockbusters. But, its hindi remake (Bulandi) couldn’t make the same impact. I think the reason for this is that the events of the last few centuries in these 3 southern states have conditioned people to respect/accept an hereditary village family of authority figures who dispense justice, whereas such reverence/acceptance is not there in the Northern states. So, the people there couldn’t connect to this storyline.

Similarly, I predicted that Aditya Varma won’t be able to replicate the box office success of AR or KS because Tamil Nadu has been that Indian state which has seen the least number of wars and hence such hyper masculine behavior won’t connect to our audience.

This interesting video shows how the kingdoms in India changed over the last 2500 years:

One can see how little TN suffered when compared to other states.

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RC

I know people who have come to terms with this. Just like how a zookeeper doesn’t spend her day worrying about the lion, for she knows how to handle it, these people know how to maneuver around such bullies. It is only those internet warriors who are neither good at physical confrontation nor at emotional manipulation, who vent out their frustration this amplifying this backlash.

Umm. You have left out a category. Like I (and I think rsylvania and Anu Warrier here) who have learnt to let problematic statements slideby on the internet, because.. it feels so useless and tiring to get up in arms about the same things again.

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“I also found the gross twisting of truth in Article 15 hugely offensive and problematic” – That one I didn’t watch so no comments from my side.

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Ravi K

Madan wrote: “If as the director claims, it is a film about two crazy people in love, why so much primacy to the MAN?”

Preethi was barely depicted as reciprocating Arjun’s feelings. I didn’t sense much attraction or even personality from her. The film being about Arjun is no excuse. Take Betsy in “Taxi Driver,” for example. Even though her screen presence is relatively short, you get some sense of her personality, and she’s not some mostly mute object of Travis Bickle’s actions. I didn’t need an in-depth explanation of why Preethi likes Arjun, but some sense of the kind of person who would be into someone like Arjun would have been interesting.

Maybe in “Kabir Singh” she had more agency (I haven’t seen it), but in “Arjun Reddy” it’s more like we’re told she liked him, with little convincing evidence of it. For that matter, it wasn’t even clear why Arjun liked Preethi! It felt as if Arjun had to be into Preethi to kick off the rest of the story, and Preethi liked Arjun just so he wouldn’t seem like a completely unsavory person in that regard.

The discussion around the film endures not because it’s a bad film, but because it’s actually a fairly well-made film that, with a few tweaks, could have been much better.

Isai wrote: “Similarly, I predicted that Aditya Varma won’t be able to replicate the box office success of AR or KS because Tamil Nadu has been that Indian state which has seen the least number of wars and hence such hyper masculine behavior won’t connect to our audience.”

Didn’t people in TN see “Arjun Reddy” already? Not sure a Tamil remake of this was even necessary.

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Thupparivaalan

Isai: “Similarly, I predicted that Aditya Varma won’t be able to replicate the box office success of AR or KS because Tamil Nadu has been that Indian state which has seen the least number of wars and hence such hyper masculine behavior won’t connect to our audience.”

Wow.

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Ravi K: I am the last person to make any excuses for the director. I am only pointing out the contradictions in the defence made for the film. Anupama herself characterised the film as two crazy people in love. If that is indeed so, why is the film named Arjun Reddy? Why does Preethi not matter at all?

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Madan: I don’t see any contradiction in the title. As I said in my review:

“But the film’s gaze is so aligned to the protagonist… Occasionally, the narrative pulls out and we get another viewpoint from his dean or grandmother… But otherwise, Adithya is so monstrously self-involved — with an equally monstrous amount of self-pity — that we see only what HE sees. We don’t see what happens to Meera after she parts from Adithya…”

Some stories show both POVs and are named so: say, ROMEO AND JULIET or BAJIRAO MASTANI.

Some stories show only one POV — say, JANE EYRE — even though the bulk of the story also contains Mr Rochester. Or DEVDAS — which contains TWO other characters in Paro and Chandramukhi.

AR contains two people at its centre. But it is only ONE narrative gaze or POV, and that’s the protagonist’s.

I am not asking you to buy the film or like it. Just saying there is nothing contradictory about a story being about two people and being named after only one (and choosing to follow only that single gaze or narrative POV).

AR is a very clear, consistently written screenplay.

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Isai

Thupparivalan: I am keen to hear alternate theories on why Aditya Varma didn’t have the same box office success as AR or KS.

Ravi K: Even if many urban youngsters had seen Arjun Reddy with subs, there is still a large audience who hasn’t seen it. That is why many popular telugu movies were/are remade in Tamil, right from Thammudu/Badri days to Pelli Choopulu now. It also happens the other way round, with 96 being the latest Tamil movie being remade in Telugu.

RC: Are you new to commenting on this blog? I don’t remember seeing many comments with this id here in the last 1 year. If you don’t mind, can you share any blog link where you comment regularly. I am asking this ONLY because your comment seems to have signature elements of someone whom I am tired of explaining.

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BR: But if the story is only told from one perspective, then the defence of two crazy lovers doesn’t hold. Because we never really see much craziness from Preeti. We only see her getting coerced into consent. If the director was honest in saying he doesn’t see anything wrong in a man forcing a woman to make love to him this way, this explanation would hold. But if he did so, he would not be able to maintain the “you idiots misunderstood my film completely” narrative.

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Isai, do you really imagine yourself to be leonine enough for someone to bother with a sockpuppet?

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RC

Isai: Not new to the blog, but not a regular commentor.

Are you thinking I am someone else? And also saying that my views are not novel or unique? Ouch and ouch. 🙂

And I am afraid I don’t have a link where I comment a lot that I can share with you.

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blameless

Isai: “Similarly, I predicted that Aditya Varma won’t be able to replicate the box office success of AR or KS because Tamil Nadu has been that Indian state which has seen the least number of wars and hence such hyper masculine behavior won’t connect to our audience.”

hahahahahaha

Isai, knock yourself out trying to knock me down / show me how invalid my opinion is etc. But this comment should be framed and be pinned comment on every Tamil movie thread.

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Saipriya

https://www.google.com/amp/s/culturacolectiva.com/movies/most-misogynistic-films-of-all-time/amp

Enough said :-)?

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@Isai: “I am keen to hear alternate theories on why Aditya Varma didn’t have the same box office success as AR or KS.”

Maybe performance?

Also AR was not a star driven vehicle like Kabir Singh. So a movie already having been a huge in Telugu, again a huge hit in Hindi – maybe people knew too much about the film already and did not feel like watching it in Tamil?

I did not see AR being promoted as much as KS. That could also be a reason.

Released after the Deepavali films were released towards the fag end of the year. Maybe many film buffs were already fatigued?

There could be many reasons why a film failed. And I do not think it is because people in TN are not hyper masculine. 🙂

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Isai

RC:
A friend had narrated something very similar to the true incident mentioned by you, during the time of Kabir Singh’s release. We again had a bitter argument during Aditya Varma’s release and haven’t spoken since. I haven’t seen her in WordPress though she often comments in news websites and youtube. I guess I mistook you for her. Apologies.

Rahini: ??

blameless: pointless

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Isai: So what websites does your friend comment in? Can you show us these threads? For I want to get to know your friend. She seems like an interesting character. Do you know her in person?

BTW, never heard of sock-puppetery?

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@madan: Just one thing about your comment…It was Preeti who intiates the love making…She wasn’t forced.

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Isai

shaviswa: I am not saying that people of TN are not hypermasculine. I am saying hypermasculinity is not celebrated in TN in the same way as it is in some other states. To give another example, movies in which the hero plays an ‘encounter specialist’ are generally well received in all Indian film industries. I think they will be well received if they are made in Pakistan too. That is because, in all these places, the criminal justice system is quite leaky and agonizingly slow which has made these encounters a form of wish fulfillment and these ‘specialists’ as someone worth celebrating. But, if these movies are released in a country where the criminal justice system is far more efficient, it won’t get the same adulation that it gets here. Thus, along with other factors, ethos of the audience community also determine how a film is received.

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filmarcher

Bang on! I don’t think VD understands the concepts of patriarchy or institutionalized misogyny and how the interplay of the two affect women’s’ lives every day in all aspects. He doesn’t realize that in 2019 those concepts are being slowly but surely contested and have been shown to be damaging to women’s welfare. Yes, people are influenced by a lot of factors including movies, but why can’t the big social change start with cinema? Also, as Parvathy said, the visual grammar in cinema needs to change, it’s not that misogyny cannot be shown in cinema ( movies are after all art which is a reflection of life and society). But the visual grammar of glorifying patriarchy and institutionalized misogyny needs to stop big time! This includes gay jokes, rape jokes, jokes about fat people, dark people, defining an ideal woman ( fair, thin, submissive to the hero and his needs, having no personality or character or agency of her own) etc. Parvathy’s own film Uyare shows how misogyny can be disguised as love …..it shows misogyny but does not glorify it. That’s all we want. VD is very naive and views the middle-class patriarchal framework he grew up in with rose-tinted glasses. That kind of upbringing might have worked for 70% of the population, but it hasn’t for 30 %. Also, women in India live with the very real fear of being harassed, of having acid thrown in their faces, of being verbally, physically and sexually assaulted. I wonder if VD understands or has tried to imagine how Arjun’s act of kissing Preeti on the cheek without her consent on the day he meets her might unfold in real life…… I’m sure many people thought it was a great scene and loved the chemistry between the leads. Imagine the same situation IRL….. if some all-powerful college final year senior kissing a fresher girl on the cheek, expressing and signaling a clear sexual interest……..( in the movie we are only shown later that Preeti is ok with all that happens) what about IRL? What if the girl is not interested? The guy might have even tried it because he saw it in the movie and decided the fresher was cute. Is this acceptable? Even if it was a kiss on the cheek, it is still assault if it’s without consent. For a guy/ a stranger who barely knows you to kiss you on the cheek without your consent to start controlling your life without your consent? VD apparently hates entitlement….what about the male entitlement of Arjun Reddy and his creator Sandeep Vanga? If VD hates entitled people asking him for photos, then women hate entitled men who think that women need to submit to men’s needs and especially men who think they can walk in and kiss, control, touch or grope and assault women all they want! I really wish he would grow up and maybe take Feminism 101.

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Rahul

@Isai: “I am keen to hear alternate theories on why Aditya Varma didn’t have the same box office success as AR or KS.”

As a certified numerologist here is my explanation :

numerological total of Arjun Reddy Release date : August 25, 2017 + Vijay Deverakonda’s birth date + name of actor + name of character = 9

numerological total of Kabir Singh Release date : June 20, 2019 + Shahid Kapoor’s birth date + name of actor + name of character = 9

numerological total of Varma release date : November 21, 2019 + Vikram’s Son’s birth date + name of actor + name of character = 5

This should clarify it, I guess.

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Sutheesh Kumar

This is the pre teaser and i have a sneaking feeling that SRV and VD had decided to do provocative marketing with their film. This was the first bait and second was the cuss word Maadarchod in the teaser. They felt ruffling a few feathers would garner a few more eyeballs. They are right afterall, the movie has become a phenomenon not only with it’s mammoth boxoffice sucess but also the endless articles, discussions and discourses about it.

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Sutheesh Kumar

Provocative and Shock Marketing are marketing techniques to pique interest in one’s product so the counterculturists will flock to it and embrace it with a vehemence that peeves the mainstream consumers. As the dissidence grows they will milk it even further to leverage it as publicity to their product.

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Uma GANESAN

@filmarcher: Completely agree with your comment. Both VD and SVR act as if they can not comprehend how some of the scenes depicted in this movie can lead to men/boys in our Country following steps. Their interviews are more or less on the lines of a Strong Woman like Khusboo coming out and saying in an interview that what many movies depict is not stalking but that is how girls like to be wooed (after the Remo hullabaloo) or something to that effect. Pandering to your audience (most of whom are males), being profit conscious is one thing but it would be great if our filmmakers taken into account the social ramifications in a Country like India where women are subjected to so many atrocities/harassment every single day. It is just irritating when filmmakers come out and condemn rapes/acid attacks etc when your movies are promoting masculine toxicity. Arjun Reddy did not even have the guts of TV series like As I am suffering from Kadhal where the lead the female lead ends up having sex with someone else on her wedding night. But in AR’s case, the woman had to be pure, not let her spouse even touch her clothes, blah, blah, blah. What would have been a truly great ending would have to show Preeti show everyone a Middle finger and get married to a normal guy that she liked and also goes on to have AR’s baby.

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Isai

Rahini: She is my ex-colleague. She comments in news websites like Nytimes to forums like Indusladies.com. I am not sure which threads you want to see. I would like to help you meet her but don’t know how to do it without affecting my privacy. She is in Chennai and is a feminist. Is there any feminist group in Chennai that meets regularly? I am not able to find any using Google. I think it will be a good support system and also save me from some, what I feel is, misdirected anger.

I got to know the words sock-puppetry and leonine only yesterday, though I do have read about using bots, paid agents and IT wings for news manipulation. I googled their meanings but still am not sure about your comment. I had seen my colleague headlining her comment as ‘true incident’ when narrating a personal experience, which I think is odd. Since RC did the same and also narrated something very similar to what I had heard from my colleague, I thought about the odds of this happening and convinced myself that they are the same person. That’s why I was asking her for a blog link (since my colleague AFAIK is not into blogs) and not because of any false identity.

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Isai

https://www.news18.com/news/movies/the-worst-thing-about-kabir-singh-is-kiara-advanis-preeti-sikka-heres-why-2200835.html

“Because we never really see much craziness from Preeti.”

When Kabir speeds his bike to bash up the guys who had, without Preeti’s consent, put colours on her during Holi, Preeti is the one holding Kabir’s baseball bat, riding pillion on his bike.

Preeti drops in at his Mussoorie college to meet him, he warns her against PDA, saying that this college authority doesn’t tolerate such behaviour, to which she responds by stubbornly insisting on being smooched in the middle of the college ground.
After Kabir slaps her and gives her an ultimatum of six hours to convince her parents in favour of their relationship, in the next scene, we see her angrily declare to her family that she and Kabir had been between the sheets hundreds of times. As the drill of ‘trying to convince parents’ go, it is hard to fathom why she would think that her account of her sex life will be convincing proof for her parents that Kabir is a good match for her.

3 days after her marriage, she tells her husband that she is not interested in him and that she married him only due to frustration. Is it fair to her husband? Is this normal?

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So was watching the Interview and where Vijay says to BR that – AR’s character was liked by so many women and so many people loved the movie then why is it getting so much hate?
The following statement by Smt. Priyamvada Gopal came to my mind !!!

(..and now I hide )

An ingenuous argument why those who lose elections should get to form Government. We have heard this before. pic.twitter.com/5iWXo0ItNd

— Kanchan Gupta 🇮🇳 (@KanchanGupta) December 13, 2019

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Isai: Your examples are from Kabir Singh. I have not watched that movie and nikkie said above that there are some differences between KS and Arjun Reddy. In AR, Preeti is shown mostly as a meek, almost mouse like girl so the narrative that they are BOTH crazy is hard to believe. It feels more like Beauty And The Beast (in terms of the power dynamic, where the older and stronger partner, being the man, has made the younger and weaker one, the woman, his captive) except that in the latter it is the independent minded Belle who starts to take interest in the Beast who, in spite of much cajoling from his servant gadgets, is extremely skeptical that “who would want to marry a Beast” as said in the prologue of the movie. I am referring here again to the animated classic from the early 90s though the one starring Emma Watson isn’t significantly different in that regard. Anyway, back to AR, here it is the guy who forces her to be in his company and ‘selects’ her as the one. It is never clear whether she has a voluntary change of heart about him or she accepts her fate, faced with no other choice.

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Isai

Madan, I haven’t watched Kabir Singh but I think all these scenes were there in Arjun Reddy too. I get the part about girls freezing due to fear for their safety and can understand why she may not have reacted in his presence. But I am not able to ignore her decision to go to Mussoorie, her behavior there and her behavior with her parents and husband. If we consider your theory that she felt compelled to accept her fate, then her refusal to meet Arjun post her wedding and her not deciding to intervene when he is beaten up by her parents and more importantly her decision to not go and meet him post separation from her husband, doesn’t make any sense.

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Isai : I don’t remember any PDA scene in Mussourie, especially not such that Preeti insisted on a kiss in the middle of the college ground. These seem to be adjustments to the script for a North Indian context. And actually my theory completely makes sense in light of her not intervening when he gets beaten up at her wedding. Because it suggests she simply put up with him while in his presence but she was OK to toe the family line rather than take the extreme risk that he wanted her to take. There are magnum inconsistencies anyway in the narration and character development anyway in the film and I will not go into them. I don’t think the scriptwriting in AR is even half as impressive as how well SRV films the scenes themselves.

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Isai: I had seen my colleague headlining her comment as ‘true incident’ when narrating a personal experience, which I think is odd.

What is odd about it?

Why would you think there is misdirected anger? I didn’t speak with anger. And most importantly, why would you assume that a response directed at you is misdirected anger?

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Isai

“What is odd about it?”
When I see a comment written like “I saw/heard/did etc.”, I assume it to be a true incident, for why else would someone voluntarily write that? But when you headline it as ‘True Incident’, it seems odd TO ME because it is not like the other incidents which one writes without the headline are ‘cooked up incidents’.

“Why would you think there is misdirected anger? I didn’t speak with anger. And most importantly, why would you assume that a response directed at you is misdirected anger?”

I was not talking about you. After our argument, I heard that my colleague is going through a rough patch in her marriage. I think some of her anger got misdirected at me during the argument. I thought a feminist support group would be helpful for her now and that’s why I was asking you.

I feel if you spend half the time that you spent in understanding my motivations, speculating on my imaginations and judging my personality into comprehending what exactly is written in my comment, we can avoid lot of unnecessary conversations. Ciao.

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Isai

Madan, you are right about the smooching scene, though there was enough PDA during that song when she goes to Mussoorie.

“And actually my theory completely makes sense in light of her not intervening when he gets beaten up at her wedding. Because it suggests she simply put up with him while in his presence but she was OK to toe the family line rather than take the extreme risk that he wanted her to take.”

It would if Preethi had lived with her husband. But walking out just 3 days later and then choosing to be a single mom with AR’s baby is far more risky and crazy IMHO.

“There are magnum inconsistencies anyway in the narration and character development”

I feel Arjun occasionally thinks with his brain, frequently with his heart but mostly with his… well you get my drift.. Preethi is not much different. This is best exemplified by the scene in which they are smooching in her open terrace while waiting to have a tough conversation with her dad. When you see the movie with this perspective, I think it will mostly make sense.

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Oh thank goodness. Was worried that you thought we weren’t getting along.

Btw, mind if I call you “Isaignani”? A lot more fitting for your personality than plain old “Isai”.

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“But walking out just 3 days later and then choosing to be a single mom with AR’s baby is far more risky and crazy IMHO.” – But we never come to know why she chooses that. What was fraught about her relationship with her husband that she opted out? Did she and the husband never have a conversation about it? How would we know because we are never shown such a conversation.

I don’t necessarily expect characters to behave logically and rationally because humans don’t always make rational decisions. But I do want to know the motive. Because the entire film is made from AR’s perspective, we never learn what Preeti’s motives are and that makes the film very one sided and unsatisfying, again, from a writing perspective.

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@madan: The motive is that she pissed. He gave her an ultimatum and then disappeared. Why would she go from “we were between the sheets” one day to marrying a stranger the next? It all happened in two days…she looked meaningfully at Shiva when he comes to collect his bike later too… And the guy she married was party to all the drama that took place…he smiled at her cockily if you remember…and most importantly she wanted to get back but then she read the news about him and the actress and decided not to…

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tonks

https://www.thenewsminute.com/article/dont-dismiss-online-bullying-because-you-dont-see-damage-body-parvathy-speaks-114110

When I made the comment on this film (Arjun Reddy), I felt that about 90 percent of the debate was actually a proper debate and discussion. When the anonymous [Vijay Devarakonda] fan accounts started posting abuse, I had no time to explain that I was not talking about them. I was not as rattled. Every time this happens, it gives me the strength and courage to deal with these things. This may not always be the trajectory but I’ve realised I’d rather speak and bear the brunt of it than be quiet

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nikkie: I get THAT motive, as to why she married him. But why does the movie just assume she fell out with her husband without giving him any frames? I found that wholly unsatisfactory. This idea of there being only one true love, whether or not overly romantic, is not new in cinema. But when this concept is explored, they always show the perspective of the girl as well as the guy she is rejecting. The classic love triangle, in other words. There is no love triangle here. Just Arjun Reddy, the centre of the universe.

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@madan: Because the third guy here doesnt matter in the scheme of things. This isnt a love triangle. At least not in the same way as Devdas, HDDCS or the recent Manmarziyaan. This IS about one man and his universe. He is a self obsessed ass. We do get glimpses of her perspective, the way we do Shiva’s but it is predominantly his gaze. It IS about his descent into self created hell and his slow way out of it.

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nikkie: But when you make a film about this entitled dude only and show him coercing a woman, it IS problematic. No need to cut the scene, no need even to apologize because it’s just a film but for heaven’s sake spare us the whingeing and don’t tell us we don’t understand cinema. Acknowledge that it is subjective and that what seems OK for you may be problematic for others. To be clear I am not talking about you but the filmmaker and Vijay. If they think liberal twitterati is condescending, maybe they should go look at themselves in the mirror.

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Daisy

I am a doctor myself, that the Medico world is small and well connected. When you work in a hospital, you get to know a friend of a friend, or a friend of a senior of a senior… you get the drift. What I am found odd was that Preethi managed to reach her third trimester without AR finding out about it or even the fact that she split from her husband and is staying by herself. This kind of news spreads really fast and it is starange that AR happened to see her in a random park. Preethi is not shown to be moving to a different state, so I found it very odd that that AR didn’t get to know about all this and had to go through self destruction when Preethi had convinently split from her husband, untouched and still pining for him.

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krishikari

December 16, 2019

@tonks Parvathy is brave to just say what she thinks regardless of consequences to her career. She uses whatever privilage she has to speak up. What a contrast with the male stars who are too cowardly to even put out a statement to their fanclubs to stop bullying women. It will cost them nothing and they still don’t do it.

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